Can any book test faith as much as the Bible?

[Jarhyn]

That would be the best, the Romans could do, moving one weighty object that size. But the blocks in Baalbek are much larger. The largest estimated to be 1600 tons!!

And yet it is well documented on when it was built, and it was built mostly by human hands (some animals were involved) using human techniques that are all fairly well understood.

 

[Elixir]

But the blocks in Baalbek are much larger. The largest estimated to be 1600 tons!!

Ah, incomprehension.
The lifeblood of biblical literalist foolishness.

Funny how that works. Same as for Sasquatch and aliens.

 

[steve_bank]

The description of a unicorn as according to the bible is

Irrelevant. That’s an old book written by ignorant sheep herders that has been translated and re-translated, edited and recompiled into various forms to accommodate the dogma of various cults and political entities.

Written by ignorant sheep herders? Well they must have been special to write such literature. Language translations will be thousands but as dscovered fron the dead sea scrolls, dated a thousand years earlier than the oldest existing bible. When comparing. The narrative story haven't changed.

You still don’t have any more evidence of giant humans battling dinosaurs -or even co-existing with dinosaurs except in modern avian form.

That was my own hypotheical suggestion in a previous discussion, a plausibilty, not really a claim without the evidence. But its a matter of time. Dating and timelines, keep changing with continual investigative progression.

Horses more closely resemble unicorns than birds resemble the Dino in your gladiator drawing. Case closed; unicorns are more likely to have impaled gladiators than that particular Dino is to have battled them. QED

The dino and gladiator drawing was excreationist's post.

The not so horse-like description in the bible:

KJV Isaiah 34:7 “And the unicorns shall come down with them, and the bullocks with the bulls; and their land shall be soaked with blood, and their dust made fat with fatness.”

KJV Psalm 29:6 “He maketh them also to skip like a calf; Lebanon and Sirion like a young unicorn.”

KJV Deuteronomy 33:17 “His glory is like the firstling of his bullock, and his horns are like the horns of unicorns: with them he shall push the people together to the ends of the earth: and they are the ten thousands of Ephraim, and they are the thousands of Manasseh.”

Have you ever heard of hyperbole, exaggeration, and daydreaming, or poetry?

Oh yes. I've seen the extremes of all the above from atheists.

Could unicorn horns be a phallic symbol? Certainly bulls are symbolic of male virility. As is the Chisrtian god

Making sense out of the bible s like making sense out of Bob Dylan's drug inspired ramblings.

Are you trying to make sense of it, by applying hyperbole, exaggeration, and daydreaming, or poetry?

I am tying to understand why a great many people try to fit reality into short odd sayings written thousands of tears ago by unknown authors.

It is a giant Rorschach Test.

 

[steve_bank]

Making sense out of the bible s like making sense out of Bob Dylan's drug inspired ramblings.

At least Bob knows how to rhyme when he issues threats of eternal damnation.

“Look out kid, it’s something you did.
Can’t say when but you’re doing it again!”

DeBabble caint touch that!

Some quote Dylan as Chrtons quote scripture.

People raised Dylan to prophet status until he went electric at a Newport Folk Festival. For his devotees it was like Jesus saying he wasn't really the savior.

Dylan was a fraud as was Jagger and others. They got rich peddling counterculture nonsense. Jagger drives to a concert from his upscale hotel in a limo, puts on his rags costume, performs, puts his suit back on, and goes backs to his hotel.

At least Dylan was honest about it. He classified himself as an entertainer. In an old video bio he is in a room typing with Joan Baez in the room. He looks up and says people are going to go crazy figuring out these words.

He said publicly there is no intended meaning, if you find meaning that's up to you.

It all goes to my belief that without religion people will find something to believe in. Today it is pop culture.

 

[skepticalbip]

...

ETA:
As an example of the Roman's ability to move massive stones, the Lateranense Obelisk was moved from where it stood in Egypt to the port, loaded on a barge, transported across the Mediterranean, unloaded and set up in Rome where it still stands today. The obelisk is 32 meters (~105 feet) high and weighs 455 tons. Since they could do that, it should be obvious that they could handle even more massive stones.

That would be the best, the Romans could do, moving one weighty object that size.

Not at all. That was the most massive obelisk that the Egyptians had built. The Romans took it as a war prize (a souvenir). If the Egyptians had built a larger one then the Romans would have taken it instead.

It wasn't moved to demonstrate their ability to handle massive stones, that was a given. It was done simply because they wanted it in Rome as a reminder to the citizens of Rome that their military had conquered Egypt.

But the blocks in Baalbek are much larger. The largest thought/estimated to be 1600 tons!!

And? The fact that you don't understand how ancient cultures were capable of doing such things only demonstrates your personal ignorance of their technology. The fact that you believe they couldn't have a technology you personally don't understand demonstrates your arrogance.

But then that is typical of the religious and the ancient alien believers. They assume that they know everything possible of knowing. When confronted with something they don't otherwise understand the religious "know" god did it while the alien interventionists "know" that it was done by aliens.

 

[Learner]

That would be the best, the Romans could do, moving one weighty object that size. But the blocks in Baalbek are much larger. The largest estimated to be 1600 tons!!

And yet it is well documented on when it was built, and it was built mostly by human hands (some animals were involved) using human techniques that are all fairly well understood.

I have no doubt about the types of techniques that could have been used, which maybe similar to the Romans techniques. This is not what I'm talking about Building such collossal structure of pure solid mass e,g., placing blocks of 1000 + tons, on top of each other, several block high... seems proportionately too large in scale, size and weight, even for the Romans, despite them having advanced building techniques of their time.

 

[excreationist]

I am trying to understand why a great many people try to fit reality into short odd sayings written thousands of tears ago by unknown authors.

It is a giant Rorschach Test.

In this thread I'm saying that I think the Bible is very special in this way... it can lead to modern people believing that the earth is flat or that the universe is about 6000 years old.... it can justify slavery (some pastors in the civil war) or be against slavery ("there is no slave or free"), etc.

 

[SIB]

Narwhal. There is some thing, its just not what we think it is.

So for me the discussion gets back to seeing what beliefs match what we see the best. An all evil bible god is as reliable as an all loving god. They just don't add up.

The bible is a book. So I have no idea why anybody would decide reliability of beliefs about how the universe works based on it. Its like basing things on what they knew 2000 years ago. They just didn't know enough.

Now, the bible does a great job of describing of what it means to be human to me. It also demonstrates that when we are self centered we make some descisions that are unhealthy.

About the only people I see being unreliable ar e the ones using it as literally true or literally false. It just doesn't make sense.

 

[Learner]

...

ETA:
As an example of the Roman's ability to move massive stones, the Lateranense Obelisk was moved from where it stood in Egypt to the port, loaded on a barge, transported across the Mediterranean, unloaded and set up in Rome where it still stands today. The obelisk is 32 meters (~105 feet) high and weighs 455 tons. Since they could do that, it should be obvious that they could handle even more massive stones.

That would be the best, the Romans could do, moving one weighty object that size.

Not at all. That was the most massive obelisk that the Egyptians had built. The Romans took it as a war prize (a souvenir). If the Egyptians had built a larger one then the Romans would have taken it instead.

It wasn't moved to demonstrate their ability to handle massive stones, that was a given. It was done simply because they wanted it in Rome as a reminder to the citizens of Rome that their military had conquered Egypt.

That is an amazing feat, but unfortunately moving that massive obelisk is nothing compared to megaliths even heavier than the 1600 ton blocks in Baalbek.

A snippet of the discription:

There are no measurements given, but from the scale depicted by the human figures, these megaliths are much larger (as much as 2 to 3 times larger) than the largest known megaliths in the world. (Example: The Pregnant Woman Stone of Baalbek, Lebanon weighs in at approximately 1,260 tons). Some of these megaliths could easily weigh upwards of 3,000 to 4,000 tons."

https://www.ancient-code.com/larger-than-baalbek-huge-megaliths-found-in-russia-defy-explanation/

But the blocks in Baalbek are much larger. The largest thought/estimated to be 1600 tons!!

And? The fact that you don't understand how ancient cultures were capable of doing such things only demonstrates your personal ignorance of their technology. The fact that you believe they couldn't have a technology you personally don't understand demonstrates your arrogance.

And...

Your eyes deceive you (plural), spatial reasoning observations escapes you. Your obelisk scenario plus the technology they possessed just can't compete with the above or what's shown in the picture below... blocks placed on blocks:

But then that is typical of the religious and the ancient alien believers. They assume that they know everything possible of knowing. When confronted with something they don't otherwise understand the religious "know" god did it while the alien interventionists "know" that it was done by aliens.

That argument : ancient alien baloney will be redundant like the pink unicorn argument. I wasn't doubting the tecnical ability method, just the proportionate scale. The Obelisk comparison is not a good comparison.

 

[steve_bank]

For me aliens from Mars did it is on rte same order as god did it based on a few lines in Genesis.

Seeing aliens is the same as seeing angels.

 

[Learner]

For me aliens from Mars did it is on rte same order as god did it based on a few lines in Genesis.

Seeing aliens is the same as seeing angels.

From Mars sounds interesting, but extra-terrestials, not being of this earth, technically sounds right.

 

[bilby]

Building such collossal structure of pure solid mass e,g., placing blocks of 1000 + tons, on top of each other, several block high... seems proportionately too large in scale, size and weight, even for the Romans, despite them having advanced building techniques of their time.

Seems to you.

That word “seems” renders your entire argument a mere demonstration of your own personal ignorance.

You can’t even begin to imagine how they could possibly have done it? Well, we can put you down as both ignorant and unimaginative. Sucks to be you.

 

[steve_bank]

For me aliens from Mars did it is on rte same order as god did it based on a few lines in Genesis.

Seeing aliens is the same as seeing angels.

From Mars sounds interesting, but extra-terrestials, not being of this earth, technically sounds right.

I can't speak for all atheists, some probably beielve in magic and ET visitations.

To me a belief that a god created everything we see in the universe and ETs building the pyramids are both the same forms of myths.

Even though how the pyramids were built has been demonstrated, there are ET believers who insist the pyramids could not have been built without advanced technology humans then did not have.

 

[excreationist]

More about how special the Bible is....

Ezekiel 23:20
New International Reader's Version

There she had longed for her lovers. Their private parts seemed as big as those of donkeys. And their flow of semen appeared to be as much as that of horses.

Not many "holy" books have things like that.... but Christians don't think things like that should be removed from Bibles aimed at kids....

Bible Gateway passage: Ezekiel 23 - New International Reader's Version

Samaria and Jerusalem Are Like Two Impure Sisters - A message from the LORD came to me. The LORD said, “Son of man, once there were two women. They had the same mother. They became prostitutes in Egypt. They have been unfaithful to me since they were young. In that land they allowed their...

www.biblegateway.com

 

[excreationist]

Not many "holy" books have things like that.... but Christians don't think things like that should be removed from Bibles aimed at kids....

Well the CEV version makes it less explicit....

Bible Gateway passage: Ezekiel 23:20 - Contemporary English Version

She eagerly wanted to go to bed with Egyptian men, who were famous for their sexual powers.

www.biblegateway.com

She eagerly wanted to go to bed with Egyptian men, who were famous for their sexual powers.

And here's the Good News Translation:

She was filled with lust for oversexed men who had all the lustfulness of donkeys or stallions

Then there are the KJVs:

Whose flesh is like the flesh of donkeys,
And whose issue is like the issue of horses.

I guess many readers wouldn't know exactly what "flesh" and "issue" mean....

 

[Learner]

Building such collossal structure of pure solid mass e,g., placing blocks of 1000 + tons, on top of each other, several block high... seems proportionately too large in scale, size and weight, even for the Romans, despite them having advanced building techniques of their time.

Seems to you.

That word “seems” renders your entire argument a mere demonstration of your own personal ignorance.

You can’t even begin to imagine how they could possibly have done it? Well, we can put you down as both ignorant and unimaginative. Sucks to be you.

Lol, seems ... is merely a word, inserted to express a humble opinion. Its not an expression claiming an absolute declaration... especially (if you can entertain the idea I have a little rationality), when I am fully aware, it is difficult to prove WHO built those structures... It must suck to be you when you can't find a real argument here, but you'll keep trying.

 

[steve_bank]

Aliens built the pyramids, god built the universe. Six of one half a dozen the other. Flip sides of the same coin.

 

[skepticalbip]

For me aliens from Mars did it is on rte same order as god did it based on a few lines in Genesis.

Seeing aliens is the same as seeing angels.

From Mars sounds interesting, but extra-terrestials, not being of this earth, technically sounds right.

Even though how the pyramids were built has been demonstrated, there are ET believers who insist the pyramids could not have been built without advanced technology humans then did not have.

Edward Leedskalnin built his 'coral castle' in the early 1900s single handedly with no machinery. He cut and shaped the blocks of coral (some weighing a few tons) then moved them to his site and positioned them, again with no machinery or help. Of course, those who attribute anything they don't understand to either magic or aliens have spun their various tales trying to explain to their satisfaction. Him having done something they can't understand proves to them that he had magical powers, alien help, or was himself an alien.

 

[Elixir]

For me aliens from Mars did it is on rte same order as god did it based on a few lines in Genesis.

Seeing aliens is the same as seeing angels.

From Mars sounds interesting, but extra-terrestials, not being of this earth, technically sounds right.

And we know how important it is that explanations “sound right” to the religiously indoctrinated.

 

[bilby]

Building such collossal structure of pure solid mass e,g., placing blocks of 1000 + tons, on top of each other, several block high... seems proportionately too large in scale, size and weight, even for the Romans, despite them having advanced building techniques of their time.

Seems to you.

That word “seems” renders your entire argument a mere demonstration of your own personal ignorance.

You can’t even begin to imagine how they could possibly have done it? Well, we can put you down as both ignorant and unimaginative. Sucks to be you.

Lol, seems ... is merely a word, inserted to express a humble opinion. Its not an expression claiming an absolute declaration... especially (if you can entertain the idea I have a little rationality), when I am fully aware, it is difficult to prove WHO built those structures... It must suck to be you when you can't find a real argument here, but you'll keep trying.

Humility is the one thing absent from your posting history. Somebody once told you that your opinion was as good as anyone else’s. That person was very badly wrong, and did you a huge disservice. Your claim to being humble is self-refuting nonsense.

Opinions are like arseholes; Everybody has one, and mostly they’re full of shit.