• Welcome to the new Internet Infidels Discussion Board, formerly Talk Freethought.

Civilization Manifesto of the Intellectuals of the Planet

Do you agree that families should be required to have no more than 1 child?

  • Yes.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • No.

    Votes: 3 100.0%
  • Special opinion.

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    3

Alexander Potemkin

New member
Joined
Feb 29, 2024
Messages
2
Gender
Male
Overpopulation of the planet - over 8 billion - requires this. The planet's resources are being depleted. When I look at Islamic websites, I resent the joyful faces that declare: "I have 155 children, I have 86 children, I have 83 children". 40% of the planet's agrarian area is already dead. It is the main resource for feeding the population. Other resources are also being depleted. The consumer world is ruining the planet. Immediately it is necessary to adopt the law: "1 family - 1 child". Those who violate it will be severely sanctioned. It is this strictest law that will save the planet.

Between 1930 and 2022, the world population increased about fourfold, but this increase varies considerably depending on the country.

Developing countries have had a negative experience with fertility reduction policies in the form of family planning programmes. But many sociologists were convinced that technological advances would raise living standards and that population growth was a minor factor. Excuse me, but this is totally absurd. To prevent conflicts regarding the ongoing “Controlling the Growth of the World’s Population” programme, a consensus must be reached at the highest level of the United Nations on population policy in countries with rapid population growth, such as Bangladesh, Brazil, Colombia, Egypt, Ethiopia, India, Indonesia, Mexico, Nigeria, Pakistan, Philippines, Thailand, Turkey and Vietnam, which account for half of the global increase. France, which had great influence in Africa and partially in Asia, did not embrace the demographic targeting programme and did not help with fertility reduction policies in the countries it influenced, including in Francophone Africa, where fertility rates are still high. It is obvious that business, which benefits from consumer growth to increase revenues, is the main lobbyist encouraging population growth. Since 1984, China has also joined in supporting measures to curb population growth. However, the social conditions of some countries have been so supportive of large families that even a long-standing programme has been powerless to counter them, e.g., population growth in Pakistan, Indonesia, Ethiopia, Egypt and Brazil. If humanity does not return to population control reforms today, it will be doomed to poverty and hunger due to overpopulation and overconsumption. It has already become evident that rapid population growth at the national level limits a country’s resources, increases the load on government budgets and entails severe environmental consequences.

In Iran, the family planning programme has been abandoned since 1979. The minimum age of marriage was lowered to the age of 9 for boys and 12 for girls. This is a disgrace to the human intelligence! The government changed its political course in 1989 after realising that rapid population growth would quickly exhaust its ability to provide food, education, housing and jobs. It was proclaimed that Islam only blesses two-child families. In 1993, laws were passed that deprived third and subsequent children of food stamps and social subsidies, and their mothers of maternity leave. Completing a family planning training course became a condition for marriage. As a result, modern contraceptive use rose from 26% in 1975 to 59% in 2002, while total fertility fell from 6.2-6.5 children per woman in the early 1970s to 2 children per woman in 2002. Bravo! In India, the government started implementing a fertility reduction policy in 1952. Monetary incentives for sterilisation were introduced and then decisions were made to forcibly sterilise two-child males. The campaign has been running for several years, but has proven a failure. The country’s supreme court later ordered the closure of all sterilisation camps. This is a shame and not a smart decision.

China’s birth control policy has included both voluntary family planning programmes and coercive measures introduced in the country since 1960. The one-child policy was launched in 1978 and continued until 2021. Neither changing demographics nor harsh international criticism has influenced the PRC government’s position. The one-child policy included controls, rewards and punishments. After the birth of her first child, a woman was required to use an intrauterine device (IUD). If the married couple already had two children, the woman (or. less often. the man) had to be sterilised. Any pregnancy, without prior official authorization, was terminated by abortion. The incentive package included regular allowances for an only child, priority access to health and education services and advantages for parents in finding a good job and respect in the workforce. Exceeding the permitted number of children entailed punitive sanctions, including heavy fines of four to eight times the average annual income for the second and subsequent children, wage arrears or loss of employment, confiscation or destruction of the family home or property and political persecution. In urban areas, total fertility fell to 1.4 children per woman. In 1984, the government began to modify the one-child policy in rural areas. In 18 provinces of the country, women were allowed to have a second child if the first one was a girl. In five provinces, all rural married couples were allowed to have two children. In the other five ethnic minority-dominated provinces, a three-child limit was set. Two provinces and four districts with provincial status retained the one-child norm. The exact value of the total fertility rate in rural areas is unknown, but it is estimated to be two children per woman. According to Chinese officials, since 1979, the one-child policy has prevented 200 million births. The one-child policy reduced the total fertility rate to 1.3 children per woman, down from 6.5 in 1950. The birth control practices and the current laws of the Chinese government were remarkable. Unfortunately, since 2021, these regulations have been repealed.

In African countries, there are 4.7 children to every woman, compared to an average of 1.8 in high-income countries. The problem is that these countries lack modern contraceptives, and have a high number of unwanted teenage pregnancies.

Mandatory use of effective male contraception should be the most important family planning measure for controlling the growth of the population worldwide:

  • medications to help sterilise sperm;
  • medications to decrease libido and suppress the erectile function. Contraceptive manufacturers supplying to third world countries should be exempted from income and import-export taxes to make contraception more accessible to the people of these countries.
Currently, there are several types of male contraception in the world, both traditional (condoms) and rare, some of which are under development and testing.

Scientists, biotechnologists and the global pharmaceutic industry should be engaged in selecting male contraceptives for safe use and providing remedies. Making them available to people in developed and developing countries is a vital necessity. I suggest the following: after the birth of the first child in a family, fathers should be sterilised. However, this is an important issue that needs to be discussed at our meetings of intellectuals. The policy of the World Health Organisation (WHO), which avoids mentioning the increased public health risks of using existing contraceptives, is a subject of serious criticism. The UN persistently promotes hormonal contraceptives, virtually ignoring any other method of birth control. Health organisations, which should be serious about addressing all the factors contributing to the rising incidence of breast cancer worldwide, should encourage alternative forms of family planning that do not involve the carcinogenic synthetic hormones used in female contraceptives. Popular female oral contraceptives, when released into wastewater, are not only a chemical pollutant, but also cause endemic feminisation of male fish worldwide. By covering up for the pharmaceutical industry. WHO is hiding a serious environmental problem. Current wastewater treatment protocols in many countries around the world do not include harsh restrictions for pharmaceuticals. Of the many constituents filtered through modern wastewater treatment plants, oestrogen from female contraceptives is the most common. Therefore, endocrine disruptors appear in fresh water and have a negative impact on fish populations. Chemical oestrogen is particularly dangerous because it is more effective in low doses than natural steroids and is more difficult to degrade. Feminisation of fish is widespread in UK rivers, affecting up to 25% of male fish, but this is also true on other continents. Males begin to produce a protein that is normally only produced by females. Thus, a reproductive duct is formed and egg development begins. About 9% of the world’s women who take oral contraceptives still become pregnant. Worldwide, about 10 million babies a year are born this way. It takes a woman at least a couple of weeks to realise she is pregnant. Due to birth control pills and oestrogen exposures to the foetus, neither a healthy diet nor folic acid supplementation can save you. Children conceived this way may not have birth defects such as heart abnormalities or missing limbs, but in the future, they will develop either prostate cancer, low sperm counts in boys, or breast cancer in girls. The dose of oestrogen in the pill, which is about 0.3 mcg/kg a day, not only changes the physiology of the human reproductive system, but also affects how organ cells will respond to future hormonal changes. Economics, science and media centres try not to cover the results of such research on this catastrophic issue to prevent the risk of losing a huge market for sales and advertising.
 
We have already had this discussion, mostly without the bizarre and crazy woo parts.

https://iidb.org/threads/we-are-overloading-the-planet-now-what.27921/

Overpopulation isn't a thing.

Exponential population growth was solved in the 1950s; Only slow implementation and demographic lag (it takes 20-30 years for reduced birthrates to result in reduced numbers of women of child-bearing age) have prevented population from ceasing to grow already, and it will stabilise in the next few decades unless something radical changes.

Your crazy conspiracy theories about oral contraception are both conspiracy theories, and crazy.

The oral contraceptive is one of the two most maligned, and most beneficial, inventions of the twentieth century (the other being nuclear power*).














* Seriously, don't go there, until you have read the other threads on these topics. I have enough on my plate, without re-hashing well worn arguments yet again.
 
We have already had this discussion, mostly without the bizarre and crazy woo parts.

https://iidb.org/threads/we-are-overloading-the-planet-now-what.27921/

Overpopulation isn't a thing.

Exponential population growth was solved in the 1950s; Only slow implementation and demographic lag (it takes 20-30 years for reduced birthrates to result in reduced numbers of women of child-bearing age) have prevented population from ceasing to grow already, and it will stabilise in the next few decades unless something radical changes.

Your crazy conspiracy theories about oral contraception are both conspiracy theories, and crazy.

The oral contraceptive is one of the two most maligned, and most beneficial, inventions of the twentieth century (the other being nuclear power*).














* Seriously, don't go there, until you have read the other threads on these topics. I have enough on my plate, without re-hashing well worn arguments yet again.

And the fact is, it's an argument I don't want to have again here, today, and one that nobody involved in the past ones probably wants again either.
 
Overpopulation of the planet - over 8 billion - requires this. The planet's resources are being depleted.
Overpopulation is not the problem.
Overconsumption is the problem.

Were everyone willing to live like a 3rd world subsistence farmer Earth could doubtless support 20 billion humans. But that's not the case. Even 3rd world subsistence farmers are starting to realize how much they're being gypped by the 1st world elite, and resenting it. They want their share of the resources.

Expecting them to shut up and maintain the status quo because us rich folks feel entitled to our privileged consumption patterns is not a viable long term strategy.
Tom
 
Overpopulation is not the problem.
Overconsumption is the problem.

Were everyone willing to live like a 3rd world subsistence farmer Earth could doubtless support 20 billion humans.
So if we have 20 billion humans it's no longer an overconsumption problem or an overpopulation problem?
 
Overpopulation is not the problem.
Overconsumption is the problem.

Were everyone willing to live like a 3rd world subsistence farmer Earth could doubtless support 20 billion humans.
So if we have 20 billion humans it's no longer an overconsumption problem or an overpopulation problem?
We don't have 20 billion humans.

If we ever do, we'll sort it out.
In the meantime, let's talk about the current problems which revolve around consumption. Instead of changing the subject that might be a problem in the distant future. Overpopulation is not a problem now, and probably will never be one.
Tom
 
Overpopulation of the planet - over 8 billion - requires this. The planet's resources are being depleted.
Overpopulation is not the problem.
Why is anyone still arguing with this guy? He doesn't engage; he doesn't address counterarguments; he makes drive-by posts. He's the Potemkin village of discussion.

Overconsumption is the problem.

Were everyone willing to live like a 3rd world subsistence farmer Earth could doubtless support 20 billion humans.
I doubt it. Show your work. The last time everyone was willing to live like a 3rd world subsistence farmer Earth could support about 20 million humans. The fundamental principles of ecology and economics don't appear to have changed a lot since then, so why would the carrying capacity be three orders of magnitude different now?
 
... in countries with rapid population growth, such as Bangladesh, Brazil, Colombia, Egypt, Ethiopia, India, Indonesia, Mexico, Nigeria, Pakistan, Philippines, Thailand, Turkey and Vietnam, which account for half of the global increase. ...

Skimming Alexander's post, this mention of Thailand caught my eye. I had checked that stat recently and seen Thailand with a very low 0.3% growth rate. I spot-checked a few of the other countries Alexander lists here; several also have low growth rates.

@Alexander Potemkin -- where did you get your data? Is Wiki's  List of countries by population growth rate in error? Part of the confusion may be ABSOLUTE growth vs growth RATE, but Thailand's population isn't large enough to show up on the absolute list either.
 
Overpopulation of the planet - over 8 billion - requires this. The planet's resources are being depleted.
Overpopulation is not the problem.
Overconsumption is the problem.

Were everyone willing to live like a 3rd world subsistence farmer Earth could doubtless support 20 billion humans. But that's not the case. Even 3rd world subsistence farmers are starting to realize how much they're being gypped by the 1st world elite, and resenting it. They want their share of the resources.

Expecting them to shut up and maintain the status quo because us rich folks feel entitled to our privileged consumption patterns is not a viable long term strategy.
Tom

Third world subsistence farmers are concerned with one thing: feeding their family. They haven't got time for much else. Maybe a cheap bottle of booze and fucking but that's about it. And if a typhoon should destroy their rice crop and strip the fruit off the trees, they are in for a year of hurt.
I've walked the streets of Abuyog and the dirt roads of Hampipila. No one looked upon me in a negative way. They had to know I wasn't from around there. No one striped me of my precious Levis or my dollars. They just stared at my blond hair. Why did people with so little not want what I had? My guess is they weren't exposed to a lifetime of capitalism, a barrage of advertisement indoctrinating them to the endless pursuit of more and more useless shit.
 
I suspect that if everyone lived like 3rd world subsistence farmers, people would be a lot happier on average.
I've spent considerable time living with and among dirt-floor-poor people, and the thing that really really really sticks in my memory is that in all cases I was welcomed. Not because I brought anything to their table, just because I was. But drop one of the people who unquestioningly accepted me, into downtown wherever or into a rural 'Murkin community, and chances are they'd be shunned and possibly jailed for being dirty or poorly clad or being the wrong color or having an accent...
I think it was bobcat goldthwait who joked about "They're starving? They live in a fucking desert! Why don't they MOVE?"
Maybe THAT is why they don't move (or rather, why they wouldn't even if they could).
 
I suspect that if everyone lived like 3rd world subsistence farmers, people would be a lot happier on average.
I've spent considerable time living with and among dirt-floor-poor people, and the thing that really really really sticks in my memory is that in all cases I was welcomed. Not because I brought anything to their table, just because I was. But drop one of the people who unquestioningly accepted me, into downtown wherever or into a rural 'Murkin community, and chances are they'd be shunned and possibly jailed for being dirty or poorly clad or being the wrong color or having an accent...
I think it was bobcat goldthwait who joked about "They're starving? They live in a fucking desert! Why don't they MOVE?"
Maybe THAT is why they don't move (or rather, why they wouldn't even if they could).
Actually, it was the late great Sam Kinison who said that.
 
I suspect that if everyone lived like 3rd world subsistence farmers, people would be a lot happier on average.
I've spent considerable time living with and among dirt-floor-poor people, and the thing that really really really sticks in my memory is that in all cases I was welcomed. Not because I brought anything to their table, just because I was. But drop one of the people who unquestioningly accepted me, into downtown wherever or into a rural 'Murkin community, and chances are they'd be shunned and possibly jailed for being dirty or poorly clad or being the wrong color or having an accent...
I think it was bobcat goldthwait who joked about "They're starving? They live in a fucking desert! Why don't they MOVE?"
Maybe THAT is why they don't move (or rather, why they wouldn't even if they could).
Actually, it was the late great Sam Kinison who said that.
Right! Mea Culpa.
Thank you!
 
Back
Top Bottom