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Columbia University is colluding with the far-right in its attack on students

Mike Lee was suspended from Sonoma State University following an announcement on Tuesday that the liberal arts college north of San Francisco had agreed with Students for Justice in Palestine (SJP) to become the first US university to refuse to work with Israeli academic institutions.
This is quite deplorable. SJP is an extremist anti-Israel group that should be kicked off campus instead of caved to.
“None of us should be on the sidelines when human beings are subject to mass killing and destruction,” Lee said in a message to students announcing the move.
Like the human beings being killed and kidnapped on 10/7? You know, the thing that started this war.
“SSU will not pursue or engage in any study abroad programs, faculty exchanges, or other formal collaborations that are sponsored by, or represent, the Israeli state academic and research institutions,” he wrote.
And yet Palestinian institutions are fine? What an idiot!
Lee added that the university will only engage with Israeli academics “acting in a personal capacity”. He also said the college would review its investments to find “ethical alternatives” to Israel and set up a Palestine studies programme
Again. Working with Israeli institutions is disallowed, but he is setting up a "Palestine studies programme" that will no doubt propagandize against Israel.

And you are upset that I compare this antisemitic shit with "Kauft nicht bei Juden"? This guy should be fired, not merely placed on leave.
 
The right of the Jewish people to the land of Israel is eternal and indisputable and is linked with the right to security and peace; therefore, Judea and Samaria will not be handed to any foreign administration; between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty
What relevance does that have? There are no protests in US cities or on university campuses chanting or displaying this slogan. Nobody in Congress is endorsing this slogan that I know of, while Jamaal Bowman has explicitly defended the "from the river to the sea" slogan in his debate with George Latimer.
 
While you are free to hold any opinion you wish, no rational observer is required to accept your idiosyncratic definition of “caving in” (which includes agreeing to discuss an issue in the future”) or conflate protesting the massive destruction and misery on the civilian population of Gaza as “anti Israel”.
It may include that but is much more than that. It also includes having so-called "Palestinian Studies" and hiring Palestinian professors, which can then spread propaganda. It includes dropping any discriplinatory actions against anti-Israel students violating university rules.
Hiring professors to teach subjects is nit caving in. It is called education, one of the primary reasons of the university.

I realize to strong law and order types feel punishing transgressors is important, but that is not a primary function of a university. Modelling good judgment and rationality is the proper role.

Derec said:
Yes, there are anti- Israel protesters and antisemitic ones snd pro- terrorism ones but they are not the only ones. It is very possible they are not even “most”!
Whether or not they are the majority, they are significant portion of the total.
“Significant portion” means at least one?
Derec said:
Occupation of quads, in and of itself, is a nothing burger.
It is not as serious as breaking and entering a building, but it is nothing. It is trespassing at least. When students refuse to leave, it is legitimate for police to remove them and for the university to discipline them.
Legitimate does not mean wise or successful.
Derec said:
Peaceful protest on a campus is a learning experience and should be treated as one by the administration of institutions of higher learning, not as an exercise in kneejerk authoritarian dumbness in response to the pearl clutching of goosetepping braying jackasses.
What to you is "peaceful protesting"? Is occupying the quad that nobody else can use it really peaceful? How about harassing university officials at their homes? What about breaking and entering into Hamilton Hall?
The answers to your questions 2-4 (in order) are
2) Yes,
3) depends on what is called harrassment, and
4) depends on the effect of the occupation.
 
Mike Lee was suspended from Sonoma State University following an announcement on Tuesday that the liberal arts college north of San Francisco had agreed with Students for Justice in Palestine (SJP) to become the first US university to refuse to work with Israeli academic institutions.
This is quite deplorable. SJP is an extremist anti-Israel group that should be kicked off campus instead of caved to.
So much for the free exchange of ideas.
 
The right of the Jewish people to the land of Israel is eternal and indisputable and is linked with the right to security and peace; therefore, Judea and Samaria will not be handed to any foreign administration; between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty
What relevance does that have?

The Likud Party has roots in terrorism. So it kinda seems relevant to a claim (that I don't agree with) that the phrase from the River to the Sea (originating even earlier than this but exemplified here) is a dog whistle to terrorists for genocide.
 
Business titans privately urged NYC mayor to use police on Columbia protesters, chats show - The Washington Post - "A WhatsApp chat started by some wealthy Americans after the Oct. 7 Hamas attack reveals their focus on Mayor Eric Adams and their work to shape U.S. opinion of the Gaza war."
Business executives including Kind snack company founder Daniel Lubetzky, hedge fund manager Daniel Loeb, billionaire Len Blavatnik and real estate investor Joseph Sitt held a Zoom video call on April 26 with Mayor Eric Adams (D), about a week after the mayor first sent New York police to Columbia’s campus, a log of chat messages shows. During the call, some attendees discussed making political donations to Adams, as well as how the chat group’s members could pressure Columbia’s president and trustees to permit the mayor to send police to the campus to handle protesters, according to chat messages summarizing the conversation.

...
The messages describing the call with Adams were among thousands logged in a WhatsApp chat among some of the nation’s most prominent business leaders and financiers, including former Starbucks CEO Howard Schultz, Dell founder and CEO Michael Dell, hedge fund manager Bill Ackman and Joshua Kushner, founder of Thrive Capital and brother of Jared Kushner, former president Donald Trump’s son-in-law.

...
The chat was initiated by a staffer for billionaire and real estate magnate Barry Sternlicht — who never joined directly, instead communicating through the staffer, according to chat messages and a person close to Sternlicht. In an Oct. 12 message, one of the first sent in the group, the staffer posting on behalf of Sternlicht told the others the goal of the group was to “change the narrative” in favor of Israel, partly by conveying “the atrocities committed by Hamas … to all Americans.”

...
Cypriot Israeli real estate billionaire Yakir Gabay wrote in a statement shared by a spokesperson that he joined the group because he wanted to “share support at a difficult and painful time,” to aid the victims of Hamas attacks, and to “try and correct the false and misleading information intentionally spread worldwide to deny or cover up the suffering caused by Hamas.”
NYC Deputy Mayor Fabien Levy: “The insinuation that Jewish donors secretly plotted to influence government operations is an all too familiar antisemitic trope that the Washington Post should be ashamed to ask about, let alone normalize in print.”

What a big baby. This has nothing to do with being Jewish.
 
The Likud Party has roots in terrorism.
How so?
So it kinda seems relevant to a claim (that I don't agree with) that the phrase from the River to the Sea (originating even earlier than this but exemplified here) is a dog whistle to terrorists for genocide.
"From the river to the sea" as used by anti-Israel protesters certainly is a phrase supportive of Palestinian terrorism.
gaza protesters.png
This is from a recent protest at CUNY. Note the "victory to the Palestinian resistance" line. "Palestinian resistance" is an euphemism for Palestinian terror groups like Hamas, Islamic Jihad, PFLP etc.
 
Hiring professors to teach subjects is nit caving in. It is called education, one of the primary reasons of the university.
It is caving in when these professors are more interested in propaganda than education. We have seen it before when universities hired left-wing extremist professors, many from violent groups like Black Panthers (like Ericka Huggins) or Weather Underground (like Bill Ayers).

I realize to strong law and order types feel punishing transgressors is important, but that is not a primary function of a university. Modelling good judgment and rationality is the proper role.
It is certainly not good judgment to let loud and obnoxious extremists determine how a university should be run. You would not support it if, say, extreme anti-abortion activists had taken over quads and issued demands, and you should not be supportive of extreme Israel haters either.
“Significant portion” means at least one?
No.
Legitimate does not mean wise or successful.
It is certainly not wise or successful to cave in to extremists who extort universities into giving them what they want.

What to you is "peaceful protesting"? Is occupying the quad that nobody else can use it really peaceful? How about harassing university officials at their homes? What about breaking and entering into Hamilton Hall?
The answers to your questions 2-4 (in order) are
2) Yes,
3) depends on what is called harrassment, and
4) depends on the effect of the occupation.
2. So you think occupying an area that does not belong to you and denying the use of university space to others is legitimate and should not be punished?
3. Making noise in a neighborhood early in the morning and dumping fake dead bodies on people's lawn. Do you think that is right? Would you think the same if it was fake bloody aborted fetuses instead?
4. Whether or not an occupation is successful depends on the testicular (and ovarian) fortitude of the administration of the university under attack. But you think breaking and entering and occupying buildings is ok as long as they get the universities to cave to them?

Btw, there have been more such occupations recently.

19 protesters arrested after trying to occupy Penn's Fisher-Bennett Hall
ABC 6 said:
According to the university, 19 people, including seven Penn students, were arrested. Twelve people were issued citations for failure to disperse and failure to follow police commands and were later released.
Seven protesters remain in custody awaiting felony charges, including one for assaulting a police officer.
All these creeps should be prosecuted, and those who are students should be expelled. Unfortunately, Larry Krasner, Philadelphia DA is a fauxgressive who is unlikely to prosecute.

Pro-Palestinian protesters occupy University of Chicago campus building

CBS News said:
Pro-Palestinian protesters occupied a University of Chicago campus building Friday afternoon and evening, as Alumni weekend began on campus.
The protesters entered and occupied the University of Chicago Institute of Politics, 5707 S. Woodlawn Ave. Organizers calling themselves UChi Occupation said the Institute of Politics was the first college building to be occupied in Chicago in connection with the widespread campus protests.
[...]A banner unfurled in front of the building proclaimed that the Institute of Politics was now named the "Casbah Bassel Al-Araj," referring to a Palestinian writer and activist who was killed during a shootout with an Israeli counterterrorism unit during a raid in the West Bank.

No word of any arrests, but the Cook County DA, Kim Foxxx, is another far left winger.
Btw, this Bassel Al-Araj was a terrorist who died in 2017 during a shootout with IDF.
Palestinian suspect killed in gunfight with IDF troops in West Bank

To its left, another banner unfurled from the front porch read: "1. Free Palestine, 2. Abolish the University, 3. Land Back, 4. F**k Gentrification, 5. F**k 12 [police]."
A litany of unhinged far left demands, but "abolish the University" one is new. :banghead:

Among those affected by these thugs was Heidi Heitkamp, who is working for the university now.
Protesters Stormed an Ex-Senator’s Office and Demanded She Leave. She Refused.
NY Times said:
ormer Senator Heidi Heitkamp was sitting in her second floor office at the University of Chicago’s Institute of Politics, preparing to appear on a television news show on Friday afternoon, when three pro-Palestinian protesters in masks and sunglasses burst in and ordered her to leave the building.
Ms. Heitkamp, the director of the institute and the only staff member left in the building, refused to go, slowing what had apparently been an effort to take over the building, the latest tactic in demonstrations over the Israel-Hamas war that have taken place on the University of Chicago campus and across the country.
“They desperately wanted me out,” Ms. Heitkamp recalled. “I told them, ‘I’m not going to leave. This is our building.’ And I planted my feet.” She added, “I’m a stubborn old woman.”
Ms. Heitkamp, who represented North Dakota as a Democrat in the Senate, said she tried to engage in a dialogue with the protesters about their goals and why they had targeted the institute, even as she heard others smashing furniture in other rooms.
Btw, do you still insist that destroying university property is a legitimate protest tactic? Or only when you agree with them?
 
So much for the free exchange of ideas.
Nothing is absolute. A Neonazi group would not be tolerated on campuses.
You disguise your antifa affiliation well.
Derec said:
Neither should SJP.
If and when yiou head an institution of higher learning or become a major benefactor, you can try. It will quickly lise its best faculty and will attract goosestepping authoritarians.
 
Hiring professors to teach subjects is nit caving in. It is called education, one of the primary reasons of the university.
It is caving in when these professors are more interested in propaganda than education. We have seen it before when universities hired left-wing extremist professors, many from violent groups like Black Panthers (like Ericka Huggins) or Weather Underground (like Bill Ayers).
You must be using the royal “we”.


Derec said:
It is certainly not good judgment to let loud and obnoxious extremists determine how a university should be run. You would not support it if, say, extreme anti-abortion activists had taken over quads and issued demands, and you should not be supportive of extreme Israel haters either.
Please stop telling me what I would think. I don’t agree with every protest on my campus and we’ve had some real doozies. But I don’t think they should have been banned or shut down. Unlike you, I believe those are educational opportunities for the free exchange of ideas that students can handle.

Derec said:
2. So you think occupying an area that does not belong to you and denying the use of university space to others is legitimate and should not be punished?
3. Making noise in a neighborhood early in the morning and dumping fake dead bodies on people's lawn. Do you think that is right? Would you think the same if it was fake bloody aborted fetuses instead?
4. Whether or not an occupation is successful depends on the testicular (and ovarian) fortitude of the administration of the university under attack. But you think breaking and entering and occupying buildings is ok as long as they get the universities to cave to them?
My answers are
2) Yes
3) Right? No in any case, but punishment (if any) depending on the extent,
4) Depending on the building, it may be ok regardless of the eventual resolution.

Derec said:
Btw, do you still insist that destroying university property is a legitimate protest tactic? Or only when you agree with them?
There’s punishment boner driven straw man rearing its ugly head.
 
Front and center, obviously well done sign that says "From the River to the Sea". That's a dog whistle for genocide.


The right of the Jewish people to the land of Israel is eternal and indisputable and is linked with the right to security and peace; therefore, Judea and Samaria will not be handed to any foreign administration; between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty
Three questions:
1. How many Arabs live under Israeli rule in Israel without being murdered?
2. How many Jews live under Palestinian rule in Gaza and the West Bank without being murdered?
3. Are you under the impression that "dog whistle for X" is purely a function of syntax and is independent of who is doing the whistling and which dogs are being whistled at?
 
" Useful idiot" is a term of art. Wikipedia defines it thus:
Wikipedia said:
A useful idiot or useful fool is a person who thinks they are fighting for a cause without fully comprehending the consequences of their actions, and who is cynically manipulated by the cause's leaders or by other political players.[1][2] The term was often used during the Cold War to describe non-communists regarded as susceptible to communist propaganda and psychological manipulation.[1]
It fits well those who are not Hamas supporters but get manipulated by those who are to blame Israel for everything and to protest against Israel.

Excellent point. I see that it can also be applied to those who do not favor killing, injuring, and starving innocent people in Gaza but get manipulated by those who blame Hamas exclusively for all of it and believe that Israel is beyond reproach. There are "useful idiots" on both sides. Those are the ones who consistently defend just one side of the conflict and dismiss all criticism of the other side.
But there's nobody who says Israel has done no wrong.

And you're not rebutting the fact that the injuring and "starving" (remarkably ineffectively) innocent people in Gaza is a Hamas mission objective, to be used as a weapon against Israel.
 
You not believing doesn't make it so.
A 57% poll to the contrary doesn’t make most people think 10/7 was the “right” thing to do.
English failure??

57% of the people in Gaza think 10/7 was the right thing to do even given the response. You appear to be interpreting this backwards.
Given the response and BLINDLY ASSUMING ITS ACCURACY.
Sorry - guess I wasn’t clear.
In short, I doubt it.
Just because it says something you don't want to hear doesn't make it wrong. Note how negatively it portrays food distribution--that's not what Hamas would want to hear so I figure it's reasonable. And it's consistent with the polling over time.
 
Hamas is a terrorist organization whose actions are unjustifiable and unforgiveable. The difference between you and me is that when I meet a terrorist, my first thought is to eschew their methods, not to try and match their level of depravity in my actions toward them, still less to draw new innocents into the cycle of violence who weren't already.
So your response to terror is to give them what they want because the alternative is too bloody?
 
This shit has been going since the 10/7 attacks btw.
This protest, clearly supportive of the Hamas massacre in Israel, happened just one day after the massacre.
protesters-nyc-100823.jpg

From here.

You are correct. That non-violent protest happened after 10/7. Also, the non-standard message someone wrote "By Any Means Necessary" is deplorable and immoral.
Front and center, obviously well done sign that says "From the River to the Sea". That's a dog whistle for genocide.


The right of the Jewish people to the land of Israel is eternal and indisputable and is linked with the right to security and peace; therefore, Judea and Samaria will not be handed to any foreign administration; between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty
Whataboutism.
 
This shit has been going since the 10/7 attacks btw.
This protest, clearly supportive of the Hamas massacre in Israel, happened just one day after the massacre.
protesters-nyc-100823.jpg

From here.

You are correct. That non-violent protest happened after 10/7. Also, the non-standard message someone wrote "By Any Means Necessary" is deplorable and immoral.
Front and center, obviously well done sign that says "From the River to the Sea". That's a dog whistle for genocide.


The right of the Jewish people to the land of Israel is eternal and indisputable and is linked with the right to security and peace; therefore, Judea and Samaria will not be handed to any foreign administration; between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty
Whataboutism.

It wasn't but your interpretation leads to your concession.
 
Hamas is a terrorist organization whose actions are unjustifiable and unforgiveable. The difference between you and me is that when I meet a terrorist, my first thought is to eschew their methods, not to try and match their level of depravity in my actions toward them, still less to draw new innocents into the cycle of violence who weren't already.
So your response to terror is to give them what they want because the alternative is too bloody?
No, my response to terror is to first of all calm the fuck down, then design an effective response based on interventions that are known to work, rather than committing acts of panicked retributive violence that look to the entire rest of the world like attempted genocide.
 
" Useful idiot" is a term of art. Wikipedia defines it thus:
Wikipedia said:
A useful idiot or useful fool is a person who thinks they are fighting for a cause without fully comprehending the consequences of their actions, and who is cynically manipulated by the cause's leaders or by other political players.[1][2] The term was often used during the Cold War to describe non-communists regarded as susceptible to communist propaganda and psychological manipulation.[1]
It fits well those who are not Hamas supporters but get manipulated by those who are to blame Israel for everything and to protest against Israel.

Excellent point. I see that it can also be applied to those who do not favor killing, injuring, and starving innocent people in Gaza but get manipulated by those who blame Hamas exclusively for all of it and believe that Israel is beyond reproach. There are "useful idiots" on both sides. Those are the ones who consistently defend just one side of the conflict and dismiss all criticism of the other side.
But there's nobody who says Israel has done no wrong.

I think it fair to say that many people blame Hamas exclusively for many of the wrongs that Israel is accused of--for example, targeting civilians and failing to allow enough humanitarian supplies into the area to prevent starvation and treat health crises.


And you're not rebutting the fact that the injuring and "starving" (remarkably ineffectively) innocent people in Gaza is a Hamas mission objective, to be used as a weapon against Israel.

A remarkable case in point. The IDF isn't there to distribute food, and humanitarian aid organizations unanimously blame Israel for blocking adequate supplies to get to the population. The claim (not fact) that the starvation regime is what Hamas wants is an obvious effort to deflect blame from the force that is actively blocking the aid. The "Hamas made us do it" excuse flies in the face of Israel's legal obligation to prioritize the health and safety of civilians in a war zone that they control.
 
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