Extremist pastor in New Jersey claims Trump was chosen by god

[funinspace]

Have fun with your collection of Christian sock puppets...

I don't mean to speak for others out of turn (if that is what you meant).

Below is generally what I meant about 'sock puppets', aka a meme that you have created that purport to represent what most all Christians think.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sockpuppet_(Internet)

A strawman sockpuppet is a false flag pseudonym created to make a particular point of view look foolish or unwholesome in order to generate negative sentiment against it. Strawman sockpuppets typically behave in an unintelligent, uninformed, or bigoted manner and advance "straw man" arguments that their puppeteers can easily refute. The intended effect is to discredit more rational arguments made for the same position.

 

[ideologyhunter]

Romans 13:1: Let everyone obey the higher authorities, for there is no authority that does not come from God, and those we have, have been established by God.
Therefore, the orange comb-over was chosen by our God and Redeemer. So who the fuck put Barack in power?

 

[jab]

Romans 13:1: Let everyone obey the higher authorities, for there is no authority that does not come from God, and those we have, have been established by God.
Therefore, the orange comb-over was chosen by our God and Redeemer. So who the fuck put Barack in power?

good point--there seem to be two different, but overlapping positions for doctrinally correct Christians--1. God chooses all rulers--some bad, some good, to suit his greater purpose, and so at this point he has chosen Trump as American Prez. 2. God has especially chosen Trump as American Prez because, on balance he will do good at making America Greatly Christian again.

remember that the West Burrownian Baptists were claiming Obama was the anti-Christ.

 

[Elixir]

I came at an early age, to the conclusion that only those parts of religions that are common to most or all of them are likely to be true in the least. So I'll wait to believe for the day when Christianity and Islam join hands with Hindus, rejoicing in Allah/Jehovah/Brahma-Shiva-Vishnu's infinitely wise choice of Saint Skidmark for the Presidency.

For today, I'm worshiping Adam Schiff.

 

[southernhybrid]

We already knew that Pompeo has claimed that god sent us Trump. Thanks a lot asshole god. But, instead of starting a new thread, I'll just add some more shit about Pompeo, who is much scarier than that crazy pastor since he actually has a big role in government.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/30/us/politics/pompeo-christian-policy.html

When Secretary of State Mike Pompeo sat down for an interview with the Christian Broadcasting Network in a hotel in Jerusalem earlier this month, he made a remark that was perhaps the most revelatory of any in his nearly one year in office.

An evangelical Christian, Mr. Pompeo had just returned from tours of the Church of the Holy Sepulcher, built on the ground where Jesus is said to have been crucified and buried, and of tunnels beneath the Western Wall, by the holiest site in Judaism. The interviewer posed a question around a biblical tale about a queen who saved Jews from slaughter by a Persian official: Did Mr. Pompeo think President Trump had been “raised for such a time as this, just like Queen Esther, to help save the Jewish people from the Iranian menace?”

“As a Christian, I certainly believe that’s possible,” Mr. Pompeo said. “It was remarkable — so we were down in the tunnels where we could see 3,000 years ago, and 2,000 years ago, if I have the history just right — to see the remarkable history of the faith in this place, and the work that our administration’s done, to make sure that this democracy in the Middle East, that this Jewish state, remains. I am confident that the Lord is at work here.”

We now have idiots in power who are basing policy on the myth of the rapture. Jesus fucking Christ!

Mr. Pompeo talks about the rapture. “We will continue to fight these battles,” he said at a “God and Country Rally” in 2015, because there is a “never-ending struggle” until “the rapture.”

“Be part of it,” he said at the meeting, at the Summit church in Wichita, Kan. “Be in the fight.”

In November, Mr. Pompeo told a reporter for The New York Times Magazine that the Bible “informs everything I do.” The reporter noticed an open Bible in his office, with a Swiss Army knife marking his place at the end of the book of Queen Esther.

 

[Brian63]

We now have idiots in power who are basing policy on the myth of the rapture. Jesus fucking Christ!

It is not that we have it just "now," as if this is a new phenomenon that came out of nowhere. Having religious beliefs enforced on others has been occurring already throughout human history. It is part of the package deal that comes with religious beliefs in general.

 

[southernhybrid]

We now have idiots in power who are basing policy on the myth of the rapture. Jesus fucking Christ!

It is not that we have it just "now," as if this is a new phenomenon that came out of nowhere. Having religious beliefs enforced on others has been occurring already throughout human history. It is part of the package deal that comes with religious beliefs in general.

True when it comes to extremist religious views, but I've never seen anything quite like this in my lifetime. Jimmy Carter was an evangelical Christian when he was in office. Not once do I remember him ever using his religious beliefs to influence policy. One can be religious without forcing your beliefs on others. One can hold office and be religious while maintaining the separation of church and state. Trump has purposely promoted things that evangelicals want just to keep his base happy. One of the saddest things to me personally is that back in the day, evangelicals supported the separation of church and state. I was raised by such people. They hated the mixing of religion with government.

 

[Brian63]

Well I agree with some of that, disagree with other parts. If a person espouses maintaining a church/state separation, there can still be (and will be) other ways that their religious beliefs get imposed. Since a person's religious views influence other views they hold, their ethics for instance, and their ethical views influence what public policies they enforce, in effect their religious beliefs will get imposed on us. It just takes some extra steps to get there. A person's views on politics, religion, science, philosophy, psychological biases, etc. cannot be isolated from each other so cleanly. They all impact each other, and since the choices that other people make also impact people external to them, then each of those views affects the rest of us as well. So when people say that we should not try to change people's religious beliefs because they are not harming anyone, that is incorrect. The harm may be more subtle and not as blatant, but there is still some damage being done.

 

[braces_for_impact]

The issue of Christianity pushing their views and influencing policy had definitely gotten worse, but I don't think it's something new because of Trump. Dubbya and friends also based an awful lot of policy on their version of Christian theology.

It's been endemic for some time with regards to certain types of policy, like the Israel peace process, for example.

But, it seems that the current crop of evangelical leaders have really used Trump to consolidate their power, and he's used them for the same purpose. It's a win/win for them at a time when evangelicals need all the help they can get because frankly, they're losing members faster than they'll ever be able to replace them now, and the only way to not lose all their influence, wealth and power is to use the power of the government to protect them and their privilege. As usual, they're being very short sighted, and don't realize the trouble this will cause then down the road.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk

 

[Toni]

Here's the thing: It's not all of Christianity who believes that Trump was sent here to herald/bring about end times and all of that crap. I have a number of deeply Christian friends and relatives who are quite liberal, progressive, well educated, and as anti-Trump as one can get. I have a couple of relatives who are full on board the cuckoo Trump Train, too. But the overwhelming majority of Christians that I know personally are not on the cuckoo Trump Train.

 

[southernhybrid]

Here's the thing: It's not all of Christianity who believes that Trump was sent here to herald/bring about end times and all of that crap. I have a number of deeply Christian friends and relatives who are quite liberal, progressive, well educated, and as anti-Trump as one can get. I have a couple of relatives who are full on board the cuckoo Trump Train, too. But the overwhelming majority of Christians that I know personally are not on the cuckoo Trump Train.

Even my evangelical parents always voted for Democrats. My father voted for Obama, a few weeks before his own death in 2012. My mother has despised Trump for decades. Although, she now has dementia, she still knows that Trump is president and when I mention that to her, she says something like, "I don't know how anyone could vote for that horrible man".

I have a very close white Christian friend who is much younger than me. She agrees with just about every one of my values and she never, ever tries to influence anyone with her religion. She has never criticized my atheism. I have also been fortunate to make friends with quite a few Christians who are active in the black church. They are among the most wonderful, caring, tolerant people I've ever had the pleasure to meet. So I totally agree that it's wrong to stereotype all Christians. Some have values much more similar to mine compared to some atheists that I've known over the last 20 years, and I know a lot of atheists who live here in Georgia.

I agree that some of this started while W was president, but with Trump, we've entered a very dangerous period of time. Our governor here in Ga. who many of us strongly believe won a very close race due to voter suppression, is about to sign a bill that would limit abortion to six weeks, or when a fetal heartbeat can be heard. Hopefully, the courts will negate that law, as the courts have already done in Kentucky, which passed the same law. Ironically enough to me, is the fact, if it weren't for science and technology, the fetal heartbeat wouldn't be able to be heard until about 16 - 20 weeks. These are the same people who often deny science, especially when it comes to anything that disagrees with their primitive beliefs.

 

[Gun Nut]

Below is generally what I meant about 'sock puppets', aka a meme that you have created that purport to represent what most all Christians think.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sockpuppet_(Internet)

A strawman sockpuppet is a false flag pseudonym created to make a particular point of view look foolish or unwholesome in order to generate negative sentiment against it. Strawman sockpuppets typically behave in an unintelligent, uninformed, or bigoted manner and advance "straw man" arguments that their puppeteers can easily refute. The intended effect is to discredit more rational arguments made for the same position.

So that IS what you meant... I invited anyone to show me where I was wrong about the core / basis / all of Christianity (the socks, I guess you mean) having a foundational belief that "God does all the stuff that matters". Name one single instance of a church / sect / group that identifies with Christianity that does not believe that fundamentally... or retract your claim that I am speaking out of turn.

 

[funinspace]

Below is generally what I meant about 'sock puppets', aka a meme that you have created that purport to represent what most all Christians think.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sockpuppet_(Internet)

A strawman sockpuppet is a false flag pseudonym created to make a particular point of view look foolish or unwholesome in order to generate negative sentiment against it. Strawman sockpuppets typically behave in an unintelligent, uninformed, or bigoted manner and advance "straw man" arguments that their puppeteers can easily refute. The intended effect is to discredit more rational arguments made for the same position.

So that IS what you meant... I invited anyone to show me where I was wrong about the core / basis / all of Christianity (the socks, I guess you mean) having a foundational belief that "God does all the stuff that matters". Name one single instance of a church / sect / group that identifies with Christianity that does not believe that fundamentally... or retract your claim that I am speaking out of turn.

First off, I never even suggested that you were "speaking out of turn".

Here is the president of one Christian seminary (pages 18-19):
https://okobserver.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Jan18Digital.pdf

God does not elect presidents. Or mayors. Or candidates for any other elected office in the U.S. “We, the People” elect, or at least our designated representatives do, such as the electors in the Electoral College.

Theologically, I have two huge objections to anyone’s claim that so-and-so is “God’s candidate.”

<snip>
God does not elect persons for offices in the U.S. Voters do. I stand by that statement regardless of whether my chosen candidate wins.

Gary Peluso-Verdend is president of Phillips Theological Seminary in Tulsa

PS Oddly enough, it is usually posters with more unusual Christian theological views that throw out the gauntlet of "show me one sect that (or doesn't) believes XYZ"... I think the last one that did that to me was a LDS type.

 

[Gun Nut]

So that IS what you meant... I invited anyone to show me where I was wrong about the core / basis / all of Christianity (the socks, I guess you mean) having a foundational belief that "God does all the stuff that matters". Name one single instance of a church / sect / group that identifies with Christianity that does not believe that fundamentally... or retract your claim that I am speaking out of turn.

First off, I never even suggested that you were "speaking out of turn".

Here is the president of one Christian seminary (pages 18-19):
https://okobserver.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Jan18Digital.pdf

God does not elect presidents. Or mayors. Or candidates for any other elected office in the U.S. “We, the People” elect, or at least our designated representatives do, such as the electors in the Electoral College.

Theologically, I have two huge objections to anyone’s claim that so-and-so is “God’s candidate.”

<snip>
God does not elect persons for offices in the U.S. Voters do. I stand by that statement regardless of whether my chosen candidate wins.

Gary Peluso-Verdend is president of Phillips Theological Seminary in Tulsa

PS Oddly enough, it is usually posters with more unusual Christian theological views that throw out the gauntlet of "show me one sect that (or doesn't) believes XYZ"... I think the last one that did that to me was a LDS type.

good article. The pastor was writing about what he personally believes. He was also writing about taking responsibility and not letting your trust in God's Will disable you from making choices... free will and all that.

 

[ideologyhunter]

Actually, if we're talking Biblegod, the deity of genocide and slave-beating, why not add the imposition of the Orange One to his deeds?