Gas almost $7 a gallon

[Derec]

And maximize profit they have. Record profits.

I am shocked that for-profit companies are seeking to maximize profits.

 

[Derec]

I'm just trying to make the point that the right believes that all bad things are caused by Biden; good things are just luck.

There are few people from the right on here, and nobody I have seen is claiming that. It's a strawman.
On the other hand, there is this sensitivity where any, even mild, criticism of Biden's performance gets dismissed as coming from "right wingers".

For both sides, Presidents have far less power and influence that what is commonly thought.

In the US we do not have a big government run oil company that Biden or Trump controls. That is right. Oil is produced, transported, refined and distributed by private companies, big and small. So the president's powers in that regard are indeed limited, one way or another.
Biden is not directly responsible for the gas price spike nor for the partial price reduction more recently.
However, presidents can affect the conditions under which the market operates. There is regulation. There is using federal government to refuse permits for oil pipelines. Biden killed Keystone XL, which would have opened US markets to more oil from Canada for example. There is also DAPL. Obama tried killing DAPL which would have made domestic oil industry much weaker had he proved successful given that DAPL is able to move 750kbbl/d of light sweet crude from the Bakken formation to refineries much more cheaply and safely than oil trains. Not to mention that pipeline transport uses less energy than trains as well.

Having said that, yes I think that Biden is doing a good job. Better than average.

Some things he is doing well. I do not think his response to inflation was all that great though. He let pandemic largess (expanded unemployment being the biggest, but there are other programs like direct stimulus payments and expanded subsidies for children) go on way too long, which was certainly inflationary. The subsidy (no payments and no interest accrual either) to student loan borrowers is still going on and he is unlikely to be ended anytime soon. Certainly not at the end of August which is the current deadline.
These criticisms are valid, and do not mean I am a "right winger" just because I realize that Biden is not infallible.

1,000 times greater than the Orange monster!

That's a high bar indeed! Barely a threshold.

 

[Hermit]

I'm just trying to make the point that the right believes that all bad things are caused by Biden; good things are just luck.

There are few people from the right on here, and nobody I have seen is claiming that. It's a strawman.

...the federal government does have many regulatory levers that impact gas prices.

 

[Derec]

Derec: I've posted my sources many times.

So have I. The problem is that you think May 2022 production is the reason gas prices went down between June and July 2022. That is not the case. They went down because of reduced demand due to high prices.

The problem is that you are getting your news from right wing sources which don't understand business.

BS. I get it from places like EIA.
That you use the boogieman of "right wing sources" every time somebody challenges the Biden administration is part of the problem. It makes any serious conversation difficult.

I'll give you a preview here, the price of oil is dependent upon the world market. Presidents have very little control over the price. Drilling went down under Trump; it's higher today. But it's because demand was lower during covid; it's higher today. See this link:

Price of oil is dependent on both supply and demand. Demand was pretty much destroyed in Spring of 2020 and price went way down. War in Ukraine affected supply and price went up. So far, no disagreement.
The president has more control than you acknowledge here, as federal government plays a role in regulation and permitting. For example, had Hillary been elected in 2016 and not reversed Obama's stupid decision to block DAPL, US oil industry would be less competitive as they would have to transport light sweet crude from Bakken by train instead of by pipeline.

Gasoline Prices Up Due to Global Supply-Demand Issues, Russian Invasion of Ukraine - FactCheck.org

U.S. presidents have little control over the price that consumers pay for gasoline. It depends mostly on the price of crude oil, which is set on the global market, based largely on worldwide supply and demand. Yet Republican campaign ads have falsely claimed or suggested that President Joe Biden...

www.factcheck.org

Is there a problem with that website's CSS? Or do they just like that 1995 look?
Also, the writer of that article, D'Angelo Gore, is a journalism major. He is not an economist nor an oil expert. Hardly an authority.

I agree we should not overstate the power US president has. We should not understate it either.

In May 2020, Trump's administration was only able to generate 9,713 of oil. In May 2022, The great Biden generated 11,595! Yahoo, here's the data:

Neither Trump not Biden administrations generated jack shit! It is private companies drilling and pumping. And the reason May 2020 was less is because of low demand due to COVID. Duh! That production would recover along with demand is natural.

What does any of this have to do with gas prices going down a bit recently? Production did not go up, it was demand that went down. Prices go high, demand goes down in response, prices go down. That means that most likely prices will stabilize and may even go up a little in the near future.

Your data goes only up to May. Let's look at this chart, also from EIA.

Finished gasoline production is lower than this time last year. And in fact, production went down some in that last data point. So, increased production is not the reason prices went down recently. It is the demand.

 

[Derec]

Hermit, are you denying that the federal government is in charge of regulation that can affect gas prices? Or what is your point?

 

[Hermit]

Hermit, are you denying that the federal government is in charge of regulation that can affect gas prices? Or what is your point?

My point is this: you claim

I'm just trying to make the point that the right believes that all bad things are caused by Biden; good things are just luck.

There are few people from the right on here, and nobody I have seen is claiming that. It's a strawman.

after having posted

...the federal government does have many regulatory levers that impact gas prices.

So you do sheet at least some blame for fuel prices home to Biden. Or isn't Biden part of the federal government?

 

[Derec]

My point is this: you claim

My claim nothing! Saying (quite correctly) that "the federal government does have many regulatory levers that impact gas prices" does not at all mean that I am saying that "all bad things are caused by Biden; good things are just luck". Are you having trouble with the meaning of English words or with the syntax of the language?

So you do sheet at least some blame for fuel prices home to Biden. Or isn't Biden part of the federal government?

Of course he does - he blocked KXL and he let pandemic largess go on too long, which is inflationary.
He also has some of the credit - he convinced MbS to increase supply some (has not yet borne fruit however) and he managed to herd cats and will likely pass a bill to help renewables and electric cars (this is a more medium term thing though, nothing short term). He also rebuffed the crazies in his own party who wanted him to shut down DAPL again.
So, like most presidents he is a mixed bag.

 

[Swammerdami]

Is anyone besides me old enough to remember the early 1970's when gas stations were charging DOUBLE for gasoline? Their pump meters went up to only 49.9¢ per gallon so to charge, say, 71¢ they set the meter to 35.5¢ and doubled the indicated total.

The dollar has lost a lot of its value since then so, adjusted per the CPI, the equivalent price of gasoline today is just about . . . 49¢.

Here in the Land of Smiles, we just smile and avoid unnecessary automobile travel but some Americans like to whine and whinge about the gasoline price. Do Europeans also whine and whinge, or is this, once again, an Anglophonic thing?

 

[Toni]

Derec: I've posted my sources many times.

So have I. The problem is that you think May 2022 production is the reason gas prices went down between June and July 2022. That is not the case. They went down because of reduced demand due to high prices.

The problem is that you are getting your news from right wing sources which don't understand business.

BS. I get it from places like EIA.
That you use the boogieman of "right wing sources" every time somebody challenges the Biden administration is part of the problem. It makes any serious conversation difficult.

I'll give you a preview here, the price of oil is dependent upon the world market. Presidents have very little control over the price. Drilling went down under Trump; it's higher today. But it's because demand was lower during covid; it's higher today. See this link:

Price of oil is dependent on both supply and demand. Demand was pretty much destroyed in Spring of 2020 and price went way down. War in Ukraine affected supply and price went up. So far, no disagreement.
The president has more control than you acknowledge here, as federal government plays a role in regulation and permitting. For example, had Hillary been elected in 2016 and not reversed Obama's stupid decision to block DAPL, US oil industry would be less competitive as they would have to transport light sweet crude from Bakken by train instead of by pipeline.

Gasoline Prices Up Due to Global Supply-Demand Issues, Russian Invasion of Ukraine - FactCheck.org

U.S. presidents have little control over the price that consumers pay for gasoline. It depends mostly on the price of crude oil, which is set on the global market, based largely on worldwide supply and demand. Yet Republican campaign ads have falsely claimed or suggested that President Joe Biden...

www.factcheck.org

Is there a problem with that website's CSS? Or do they just like that 1995 look?
Also, the writer of that article, D'Angelo Gore, is a journalism major. He is not an economist nor an oil expert. Hardly an authority.

I agree we should not overstate the power US president has. We should not understate it either.

In May 2020, Trump's administration was only able to generate 9,713 of oil. In May 2022, The great Biden generated 11,595! Yahoo, here's the data:

Neither Trump not Biden administrations generated jack shit! It is private companies drilling and pumping. And the reason May 2020 was less is because of low demand due to COVID. Duh! That production would recover along with demand is natural.

What does any of this have to do with gas prices going down a bit recently? Production did not go up, it was demand that went down. Prices go high, demand goes down in response, prices go down. That means that most likely prices will stabilize and may even go up a little in the near future.

Your data goes only up to May. Let's look at this chart, also from EIA.
View attachment 39745
Finished gasoline production is lower than this time last year. And in fact, production went down some in that last data point. So, increased production is not the reason prices went down recently. It is the demand.

Isn’t there a lag between production changes and price changes?

 

[ZiprHead]

While gas prices have begun to fall, the letters come as drivers continue to bear the burden of higher-than-average fuel costs at the same time as the four major oil companies announced quarterly earnings of nearly $50 billion combined. Exxon alone reported a profit of $17.9 billion – the highest quarterly profit reported by any oil company in history – while Chevron reported $11.6 billion, Shell reported $11.47 billion, and BP reported $8.45 billion. These are record-shattering figures for the companies and the result of them reaping enormous profits on the backs of hardworking families.

Pallone Demands Answers from Oil Companies on Record Breaking Profits Amid High Gas Prices

Chairman Pallone demands answers from Big Oil as companies reap record-breaking profits amid high gas prices.

energycommerce.house.gov

 

[TV and credit cards]

While gas prices have begun to fall, the letters come as drivers continue to bear the burden of higher-than-average fuel costs at the same time as the four major oil companies announced quarterly earnings of nearly $50 billion combined. Exxon alone reported a profit of $17.9 billion – the highest quarterly profit reported by any oil company in history – while Chevron reported $11.6 billion, Shell reported $11.47 billion, and BP reported $8.45 billion. These are record-shattering figures for the companies and the result of them reaping enormous profits on the backs of hardworking families.

Pallone Demands Answers from Oil Companies on Record Breaking Profits Amid High Gas Prices

Chairman Pallone demands answers from Big Oil as companies reap record-breaking profits amid high gas prices.

energycommerce.house.gov

And will we see so much as a windfall tax on these moneygrubbers?

It pales in comparison to the economic terrorism capitalism the LNG producers are perpetrating on the EU.

 

[Harry Bosch]

I'm just trying to make the point that the right believes that all bad things are caused by Biden; good things are just luck.

There are few people from the right on here, and nobody I have seen is claiming that. It's a strawman.
On the other hand, there is this sensitivity where any, even mild, criticism of Biden's performance gets dismissed as coming from "right wingers".

For both sides, Presidents have far less power and influence that what is commonly thought.

In the US we do not have a big government run oil company that Biden or Trump controls. That is right. Oil is produced, transported, refined and distributed by private companies, big and small. So the president's powers in that regard are indeed limited, one way or another.
Biden is not directly responsible for the gas price spike nor for the partial price reduction more recently.
However, presidents can affect the conditions under which the market operates. There is regulation. There is using federal government to refuse permits for oil pipelines. Biden killed Keystone XL, which would have opened US markets to more oil from Canada for example. There is also DAPL. Obama tried killing DAPL which would have made domestic oil industry much weaker had he proved successful given that DAPL is able to move 750kbbl/d of light sweet crude from the Bakken formation to refineries much more cheaply and safely than oil trains. Not to mention that pipeline transport uses less energy than trains as well.

Having said that, yes I think that Biden is doing a good job. Better than average.

Some things he is doing well. I do not think his response to inflation was all that great though. He let pandemic largess (expanded unemployment being the biggest, but there are other programs like direct stimulus payments and expanded subsidies for children) go on way too long, which was certainly inflationary. The subsidy (no payments and no interest accrual either) to student loan borrowers is still going on and he is unlikely to be ended anytime soon. Certainly not at the end of August which is the current deadline.
These criticisms are valid, and do not mean I am a "right winger" just because I realize that Biden is not infallible.

1,000 times greater than the Orange monster!

That's a high bar indeed! Barely a threshold.

It's still a little early, but I think that Biden will go down in history as a slightly better than average president. But yea, comparisons are important. And his comp is Trump. And trump attempted a coup. Trump's legacy is so bad, he's divided the country. There are two states that want to decertify the 2020 election today: Texas and Idaho. If Trump wins in 24, could potentially be the end of our democracy. So yea, I'm defensive of Biden. He's done a fine job. If Ukraine is able to successfully fend off the Russian invaders with Nato's help, and China settles down, he could go down as one of our best presidents on foreign policy in generations.

Secondly, I get tired of blaming Biden for inflation. It's simplistic. Did we have a little too much stimulus, sure. He should have dialed back some of the stimulus that the republicans started. Fine. Were we a little late in increasing interest rates, sure. But most of the factors that increased inflation (Russia, pandemonic) were out of Biden's control. You shouldn't be complaining about inflation! If we really wanted to control inflation, allow Mexicans south of the border to come in and work. That would eliminate the worker shortage and cut inflation in half immediately.

 

[ZiprHead]

 

[Harry Bosch]

I listened to the first five minutes then had to stop. It's absolute baloney. I have three engineers who work for me. Would like to have 4 at least. I've had to increase their wages by 30% in the last year. I've increased everyone's else's wages as well. I had to increase my prices to my customers. The customers have accepted so far. I would love to keep my prices the same, and grow sales as competitor's customers come to me. But it's impossible. I import an odd metal that quadrupled in price last year. I have to pass these costs on. I have several other business owners in my peer group. We talk about it all the time. We can't find workers. We can't find drivers. Most business owners hate hate hate to raise their prices because it can lead to customers looking elsewhere. Without customers, I'm sunk. I've raised prices 4 times in the last 2 years. And each time, I studied it for hours and couldn't sleep well until after the decision was made. I have one competitor who really targets my customers. But he has the same problem that I have. If he could find a way to do it cheaper and undercut me, he'd do it in a second. And vice-versa. I'm actually thinking about selling to him to get out of the stress. Again, all of my peers who own similarly sized businesses say the same thing. Anyone who thinks that labor shortage isn't leading to some inflation has no business experience. Okay - I'm off my rant!

 

[ZiprHead]

I listened to the first five minutes then had to stop.

That's interesting, considering the video is less than three minutes long.

 

[Harry Bosch]

I listened to the first five minutes then had to stop.

That's interesting, considering the video is less than three minutes long.

Yea, it seemed a lot longer when I'm living the situation that he dosn't understand!

 

[Hermit]

I listened to the first five minutes then had to stop. It's absolute baloney. I have three engineers who work for me. Would like to have 4 at least. I've had to increase their wages by 30% in the last year. I've increased everyone's else's wages as well. I had to increase my prices to my customers. The customers have accepted so far. I would love to keep my prices the same, and grow sales as competitor's customers come to me. But it's impossible. I import an odd metal that quadrupled in price last year. I have to pass these costs on. I have several other business owners in my peer group. We talk about it all the time. We can't find workers. We can't find drivers. Most business owners hate hate hate to raise their prices because it can lead to customers looking elsewhere. Without customers, I'm sunk. I've raised prices 4 times in the last 2 years. And each time, I studied it for hours and couldn't sleep well until after the decision was made. I have one competitor who really targets my customers. But he has the same problem that I have. If he could find a way to do it cheaper and undercut me, he'd do it in a second. And vice-versa. I'm actually thinking about selling to him to get out of the stress. Again, all of my peers who own similarly sized businesses say the same thing. Anyone who thinks that labor shortage isn't leading to some inflation has no business experience. Okay - I'm off my rant!

So sorry to hear about your troubles, but when it comes to deciding whether national statistics or personal experience is more significant I go for the former.

 

[Harry Bosch]

I listened to the first five minutes then had to stop. It's absolute baloney. I have three engineers who work for me. Would like to have 4 at least. I've had to increase their wages by 30% in the last year. I've increased everyone's else's wages as well. I had to increase my prices to my customers. The customers have accepted so far. I would love to keep my prices the same, and grow sales as competitor's customers come to me. But it's impossible. I import an odd metal that quadrupled in price last year. I have to pass these costs on. I have several other business owners in my peer group. We talk about it all the time. We can't find workers. We can't find drivers. Most business owners hate hate hate to raise their prices because it can lead to customers looking elsewhere. Without customers, I'm sunk. I've raised prices 4 times in the last 2 years. And each time, I studied it for hours and couldn't sleep well until after the decision was made. I have one competitor who really targets my customers. But he has the same problem that I have. If he could find a way to do it cheaper and undercut me, he'd do it in a second. And vice-versa. I'm actually thinking about selling to him to get out of the stress. Again, all of my peers who own similarly sized businesses say the same thing. Anyone who thinks that labor shortage isn't leading to some inflation has no business experience. Okay - I'm off my rant!

So sorry to hear about your troubles, but when it comes to deciding whether national statistics or personal experience is more significant I go for the former.

Okay. I concede. Paying more for workers dosn't lead to inflation or price increases.

 

[Hermit]

I listened to the first five minutes then had to stop. It's absolute baloney. I have three engineers who work for me. Would like to have 4 at least. I've had to increase their wages by 30% in the last year. I've increased everyone's else's wages as well. I had to increase my prices to my customers. The customers have accepted so far. I would love to keep my prices the same, and grow sales as competitor's customers come to me. But it's impossible. I import an odd metal that quadrupled in price last year. I have to pass these costs on. I have several other business owners in my peer group. We talk about it all the time. We can't find workers. We can't find drivers. Most business owners hate hate hate to raise their prices because it can lead to customers looking elsewhere. Without customers, I'm sunk. I've raised prices 4 times in the last 2 years. And each time, I studied it for hours and couldn't sleep well until after the decision was made. I have one competitor who really targets my customers. But he has the same problem that I have. If he could find a way to do it cheaper and undercut me, he'd do it in a second. And vice-versa. I'm actually thinking about selling to him to get out of the stress. Again, all of my peers who own similarly sized businesses say the same thing. Anyone who thinks that labor shortage isn't leading to some inflation has no business experience. Okay - I'm off my rant!

So sorry to hear about your troubles, but when it comes to deciding whether national statistics or personal experience is more significant I go for the former.

Okay. I concede. Paying more for workers dosn't lead to inflation or price increases.

Considering that wages have risen by 5% over the past year while prices have increased by 8.6% in the same period, it is indeed mathematically true that inflation has been driven by price increases. As Robert Reich said, keeping those two figures in mind, wage earners have suffered an income cut to the tune of 3.6 percentage points. The assertion that wages drive inflation is absolute baloney.

 

[TomC]

Gas was 3.21/g at the cheap place up the road. Closer to 3.40 nearer the highway.
Them city folks are dumb enough to pay it, I guess.
Tom