Gaza derail from ICE detention centre thread

[Arctish]

How the hell did this get derailed into the Palestine/Israel conflict?

Sorry ZiprHead.

 

[laughing dog]

The IDF is not killing civilians by accident. They know civilians are in the area and it does not deter them.

2) It's a de-facto war. Going after enemy combatant is legitimate.

Civilians are not enemy combatants by definition.

None of the response justifies the killing of civilians. You confuse an explanation with a justification.

The IDF is aiming at combatants. In general they avoid pulling the trigger when they know civilians are in the area. The Palestinians are deliberately avoiding the IDF and shooting at civilians.

And members of terrorist organizations are enemy combatants.

Stop evading the issue - killing civilians is not self defense.

 

[laughing dog]

Wrong. I specifically said that one can be critical of Israel without being antisemitic. But to declare Israel's doings "evil" just for defending itself, a right she does not begrudge any other country, is anti-Semitic.

First, killing civilians is not self-defense. Second, you have no evidence about what AOC begrudges or does not begrudge any other country when it comes to self-defense or killing civilians. While it may be that AOC is anti-semitic, you have presented zero evidence to support your claim. You are entitled to your opinion, but you are not entitled to expect others to accept "truthiness" as fact.

So in WWII we should not have bombed German cities, nor invaded. Both inherently would kill civilians.

Shift the goal posts much? None of this has anything to with the topic of whether or not criticizing Israel for killing civilians is anti-semitic.

 

[Worldtraveller]

No one is confused about whose side you are on, whose arguments you always want to "compromise" with, and whose you are always willing to critique. Why pretend?

Meh. If you can't take me for what I write and must pretend I mean something else I didn't write you can fuck right off.

Ah yes, focus on the part of my post that's easy to respond to.

Fine, I sincerely apologize for the unfair intimation that you are an unwitting stooge for white nationalist propaganda.

What about the actual discussion, though?

I think you were unfair here, Poli.


JP isn't unwitting.

Glad I could help.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The point is, the fighting is mutual. As you say, it's war. If Israel has a right to drop explosives on Gaza, surely the Gazans have a right to do the same to Israel. Not that Rep. Omar would approve of civilians being targeted in either case.

You're neglecting the fact that outside the times of Israeli invasion basically every combat action the Palestinians take is a war crime.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

So in WWII we should not have bombed German cities, nor invaded. Both inherently would kill civilians.

Shift the goal posts much? None of this has anything to with the topic of whether or not criticizing Israel for killing civilians is anti-semitic.

I'm not shifting the goal posts at all. Rather, I'm pointing out the flaw in your position by looking at it in a different war.

If it's not proper to kill civilians in self defense then we were not allowed to bomb or attack Germany or the territories it occupied. If it is acceptable then why isn't it acceptable for Israel?

 

[Arctish]

The point is, the fighting is mutual. As you say, it's war. If Israel has a right to drop explosives on Gaza, surely the Gazans have a right to do the same to Israel. Not that Rep. Omar would approve of civilians being targeted in either case.

You're neglecting the fact that outside the times of Israeli invasion basically every combat action the Palestinians take is a war crime.

Remember when we discussed those teenagers in Gaza playing soccer in a stadium that were killed by the IDF in retaliation for a Hamas attack on an Israeli military target? One of the links I provided mentions them. I remember you making up a story about the kids watching the attack and then providing cover for the Hamas guys by kicking a soccer ball around (I know, it makes no sense but you said it). The attack on the IDF wasn't a war crime. The murder of those kids was. So if you want to talk about war crimes, let's start with that one, but let's take it to a new thread.

In this thread we are discussing Rep. Omar's tweet within the context of current events at the time she made it and her life experiences. Some people here were awfully quick to assume her tweet was motivated by anti-Semitism and awfully slow to consider how it fits in with her life experiences.

She knows what it is to be a civilian caught in the crossfire of war. She knows what it is to be helplessly hiding under her bed with family members and hoping no one blows the house to smithereens. She knows what it means to be a refugee and utterly dependent on donated aid. And even though she wasn't in Somalia during the worst part of the famine, she most likely has a keen understanding of the evil of leaders like Mohammed Farah Aidid, who use hunger and desperation as weapons and who intercept humanitarian aid and block its distribution for political gain.

IMO her experiences far outweigh any other motive behind her reaction to what was happening in Gaza. And since her criticisms appear to be focused on Zionism and Zionist policies, not on Judaism or Judaic practices, I think you'd have to be deliberately conflating terms to accuse her of anti-Semitism.


*** I also think the deliberate conflation of terms is part of the Standard Book of Zionist Apologetics, probably in one of the early chapters since it's deployed so quickly and so often. But that's a topic for another thread.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The point is, the fighting is mutual. As you say, it's war. If Israel has a right to drop explosives on Gaza, surely the Gazans have a right to do the same to Israel. Not that Rep. Omar would approve of civilians being targeted in either case.

You're neglecting the fact that outside the times of Israeli invasion basically every combat action the Palestinians take is a war crime.

Remember when we discussed those teenagers in Gaza playing soccer in a stadium that were killed by the IDF in retaliation for a Hamas attack on an Israeli military target? One of the links I provided mentions them. I remember you making up a story about the kids watching the attack and then providing cover for the Hamas guys by kicking a soccer ball around (I know, it makes no sense but you said it). The attack on the IDF wasn't a war crime. The murder of those kids was. So if you want to talk about war crimes, let's start with that one, but let's take it to a new thread.

In this thread we are discussing Rep. Omar's tweet within the context of current events at the time she made it and her life experiences. Some people here were awfully quick to assume her tweet was motivated by anti-Semitism and awfully slow to consider how it fits in with her life experiences.

She knows what it is to be a civilian caught in the crossfire of war. She knows what it is to be helplessly hiding under her bed with family members and hoping no one blows the house to smithereens. She knows what it means to be a refugee and utterly dependent on donated aid. And even though she wasn't in Somalia during the worst part of the famine, she most likely has a keen understanding of the evil of leaders like Mohammed Farah Aidid, who use hunger and desperation as weapons and who intercept humanitarian aid and block its distribution for political gain.

IMO her experiences far outweigh any other motive behind her reaction to what was happening in Gaza. And since her criticisms appear to be focused on Zionism and Zionist policies, not on Judaism or Judaic practices, I think you'd have to be deliberately conflating terms to accuse her of anti-Semitism.


*** I also think the deliberate conflation of terms is part of the Standard Book of Zionist Apologetics, probably in one of the early chapters since it's deployed so quickly and so often. But that's a topic for another thread.

Civilians get caught in the crossfire. That has nothing to do with the fact that Hamas targets civilians.

 

[Derec]

Are you saying the killing of those boys playing soccer in a stadium on November 10th was deliberate? Because it looked deliberate, but you usually don't acknowledge things like that.

You really think anybody was playing soccer there in the middle of a fucking war?
Did you read your own article?

CNN has found no evidence that anyone was killed while playing football.
[..]
Valcke's statement was criticized by Israeli media, which reported that the stadium was used by Hamas militants to fire rockets at Jerusalem and Tel Aviv.

Firing rockets at Israeli cities is fine. IDF firing missiles at missile launching locations is not, apparently.

I haven't fully investigated this source but reputable outlets like The Hill, The New York Times, Reuters, etc. have carried his writings, so he's not just some random guy on the internet.

He may not be 'some random guy' but he is definitely an anti-Israel, pro-Hamas propagandist.

^This is what was going on when Omar made that tweet. Evil doings indeed.

Defending yourself from Hamas aggression and terrorism is not "evil doings".
Why is Ilhan Omar not attacking Hamas for what they are doing?

Seriously. Fuck Netanyahu

Any "fucks" you want to send to Hamas leadership and terrorists?

and fuck the IDF sniper who shot a 13 year old boy in the stomach as he played soccer outside his home.

What evidence is there that he was playing football? What evidence is there that he was killed by an "IDF sniper"? Has the incident ever been investigated by any impartial, disinterested body?
Or are you just implicitly believing anything spoken by the Hamas rulers of Gaza?

If I believed in God I would pray he strike them both dead with a rancid pig trough.

Kind of how I feel about Haniyeh and Sinwar.

She was paying attention to the facts. She was probably paying more attention to what was happening in Gaza than you did. She's paying attention to facts now. And again, she's probably paying more attention to them than you are.

I fully believe Ilhan Omar knows what is going on in Gaza. She can't claim ignorance (like AOC did after running her mouth on Israel right after she won the primary) as an excuse.
Therefore the only explanation of why she calls Israel's self-defense "evil doings" and has not found it worthy to attack the truly evil doings of Hamas and PIJ is anti-Semitism, pure and simple.

 

[Derec]

I'm sure she would agree with you that civilians get caught in crossfire which is why IMO she criticized Israel the day after it conducted a massive bombing and shelling of Gaza.

She did not mention any civilians in her tweet. She was just going on about supposed "evil doings" of Israel while ignoring the evil doings of Hamas and Islamic Jihad.

Gaza is full of civilians, and shelling is pretty indiscriminate. There were a lot of children hiding under beds the day before, and given her personal experiences it's natural she would react strongly to that.

Then maybe she should attack Hamas for shooting rockets from civilian areas or storing explosives next to apartment buildings etc.
But no, not a single word even mildly critical of Hamas.

I also believe she saw the blockade and the attack on the Turkish flotilla carrying aid to Gaza two years before as the same sort of 'evil doings' Mohammed Farah Aidid had been responsible for in Somalia.

That flotilla was a scam. In reality, much more tonnage of goods than what could be carried in that bogus flotilla enters Gaza from Israel through the Kerem Shalom crossing every week.

The Israelis weren't letting the Gazans starve, but they weren't letting the donated food into Gaza as it arrived, either.

BS. The only times Kerem Shalom gets closed is when there is a security issue, like when "peaceful protesters" from Gaza set fire to the terminal on their side.
Israel to reopen Gaza crossing after rioters burn it for 3rd time
Evil doings that do not warrant Ilhan Omar's attention.

And that's another situation sure to provoke a strong reaction from a former refugee who was once dependent on humanitarian aid for food and basic necessities.

Indiscriminate firing of artillery rockets at cities is fine, according to this "former refugee" since the targets are Jews, right?

Like I said, I think her life experiences far outweigh any other motive behind her tweeted reaction to what was happening in Gaza. And I think it informs her opinions of ICE, the detention centers, asylum seekers, and the humanitarian crisis at the border.

BS.

 

[Derec]

So she made that tweet during Operation Pillar of Defense, and a day after intense Israeli tank, artillery, and missile fire into Gaza that imperiled the lives of hundreds of thousands of civilians.

These civilians are imperiled by the goal of Hamas to destroy Israel and make the Land of Israel judenrein.
Why is Ilhan Omar ignoring the evil doings of Hamas (and Islamic Jihad) other than anti-Semitism?

You don't think it's possible she was responding to the humanitarian crisis in Gaza and the lack of concern shown by the powers-that-be in Washington? You think her motive for tweeting a prayer people would awaken and see the evil doings of Israel could only be hatred of Jews? I think you're wrong.

If anything the powers that be in Washington were too critical of Israel and pressured them into ending the operations before the job was done. That way, Hamas could regroup, resupply (from Iran mostly) and another miltiary action became necessary in 2014.

I think that as someone with first hand experience of war, who knows what it means to be hiding in your home and praying no one decides to blow it up, she has some pretty strong opinions on this issue. She's probably the last person in Washington who would approve of a missile strike into Gaza or Tel Aviv, no matter who was the target.

I have first hand experience of war too, so she is not somehow unique here. And note that you added "or Tel Aviv". Nowhere have I see her condemn anything Hamas did, including shooting rockets at Israeli civilians as well as shooting rockets from civilian areas.

]She also knows just how much the destitute and refugees in camps need donated aid. I doubt she will ever look favorably on those who would withhold it for political reasons.

Palestinians are not refugees in any real sense of the word. It's just that UNRWA is applying a unique definition of "refugee" that applies only to Palestinians and makes refugee status heritable in perpetuity.

I wonder, do you think Palestinians have a right to defend themselves?

Yes. They should defend themselves from the Hamas occupation of Gaza.

You noted that Operation Pillar of Defense was in response to thousands of artillery rockets being shot at Israeli towns and cities, but don't note that the rocket fire was in response to Operation Returning Echo, an Israeli strike that killed a Hamas leader which broke the 2011 ceasefire.

You mean the guy responsible for the cross-border attacks in August 2011 in which 8 Israelis were killed? Should Israel not respond to such blatant act of aggression?

Of course there was a reason for Operation Returning Echo. It was retaliation for pre-ceasefire cross border raids which were a response to the blockade which was a response to Hamas gaining control of Gaza, etc., etc.

Oh yes, you do mean that guy. And before Hamas gained control of Gaza, there was the Second Intifada in which a lot of Israelis were murdered by Palestinian terrorists.
Including Sbarro bombing that killed 15 civilians, including children, and injured 130.

Courtesy of Hamas.

The point is, the fighting is mutual. As you say, it's war. If Israel has a right to drop explosives on Gaza, surely the Gazans have a right to do the same to Israel. Not that Rep. Omar would approve of civilians being targeted in either case.

One side is engaging in aggression here, and that is the Palestinians. They are also targeting civilians, which is a war crime. They are also using civilian areas, including hospitals, for military purposes, which is another war crime.

 

[Derec]

Not to the dead civilians. And somehow, the IDF manages to kill many more civilians than the Hamas, etc... despite the alleged efforts to limit the casualties.

Inability to cause bigger casualties is not a moral virtue.

And, the IDF goes along with it. Brilliant. Nothing in your response rebuts my observation that killing civilian is not self-defense, no matter how you shift those goalposts.

Targeting civilians (what Palestinian terrorists engage in) is not self defense. On the other hand, civilians can be inadvertent casualties of legitimate self defense operations.
Also, just because Hamas calls certain casualties "civilian" does not mean they were really civilian. The numbers of "civilian casualties" during the three Gaza wars that Hamas rulers of Gaza publish and that the Western media uncritically disseminate are as bogus as a $3 bill.

Bombing a Hamas headquarters or rocket cache and killing a civilian who is nearby is what happens in war. Bombing a pizza restaurant frequented by children is terrorism, and what Hamas is engaging in.

Asking for evidence for claims of fact is not goal-post shifting. Given your penchant for goal-post shifting (see above). I am surprised at your misuse of that term.

You are the goal-post shifter on this forum. But be that as it may, I have provided evidence.

Please note that I am not defending the killing of civilians by anyone - unlike you.

I see you condemn the evil doings of Hamas all the time. NOT!

Since you admit it is not clear what she is singling out, you really have no rational basis for your deductions or claims. Ms. Omar may be an anti-semite, but you have produced zero evidence to support your claims.

I am not admitting anything. Her statement is general, and should be taken generally and we should not try to put in conditionals that are not in her statement.
Note also that she attacks Israel (and calls Israeli acts of self-defense "evil doings") but she is not saying anything about what Hamas is doing. I think that shows anti-Semitism on her part.

 

[Arctish]

You really think anybody was playing soccer there in the middle of a fucking war?
Did you read your own article?

I read every article I linked and several others. Did you?

In November 2012 the cease fire negotiated in 2011 in still in effect and it had been weeks since the last exchange of any sort. On November 8th, IDF forces invaded Gaza and one of them killed a 13 year old boy playing soccer outside his house.

Hamas responded by blowing up a tunnel* and then 2 days later firing an anti-tank round at an IDF military target, wounding 4 Israeli soldiers. Later that day, Israel retaliated by firing an artillery round at a group of boys playing soccer in a stadium, and another at a tent full of mourners at a funeral.

Hamas responded to the Israeli response with a volley of over 100 rockets on the 12th-13th, and then Israel began Operation Pillar of Defense the 14th.

Ilhan Omar's tweet was made on the 16th.


*I don't know if Israel was using the tunnel to send soldiers into Gaza, but the destruction of the tunnel injured an Israeli. I also don't know if Israel or Hamas built it. But even assuming it was a Hamas tunnel, blowing it up would have been a defensive act.

Firing rockets at Israeli cities is fine. IDF firing missiles at missile launching locations is not, apparently.

If you're going to play the Idiot card, I'm not interested in playing along.

Evil doings are evil because of the inherent characteristics of the act, not because of who is doing them to whom. It doesn't matter if the soccer players were Jewish, Muslim, Christian, Wiccan, or what-the-fuck-ever. It was evil to shoot the 13 year old and kill the others with artillery fire.

If you're going to defend evil because of your own bigotry and bias, then stop pretending you're on some kind of moral high ground. Just admit you hate Muslims and don't care if their kids are murdered.

I haven't fully investigated this source but reputable outlets like The Hill, The New York Times, Reuters, etc. have carried his writings, so he's not just some random guy on the internet.

He may not be 'some random guy' but he is definitely an anti-Israel, pro-Hamas propagandist.

^This is what was going on when Omar made that tweet. Evil doings indeed.

Defending yourself from Hamas aggression and terrorism is not "evil doings".
Why is Ilhan Omar not attacking Hamas for what they are doing?

Seriously. Fuck Netanyahu

Any "fucks" you want to send to Hamas leadership and terrorists?

When they kill non-combatants I do, like when they bombed a falafel strand or when they blew up a city bus.

What, you don't remember? Figures.

and fuck the IDF sniper who shot a 13 year old boy in the stomach as he played soccer outside his home.

What evidence is there that he was playing football? What evidence is there that he was killed by an "IDF sniper"? Has the incident ever been investigated by any impartial, disinterested body?
Or are you just implicitly believing anything spoken by the Hamas rulers of Gaza?

So you didn't follow the links or do your own research.

If I believed in God I would pray he strike them both dead with a rancid pig trough.

Kind of how I feel about Haniyeh and Sinwar.

She was paying attention to the facts. She was probably paying more attention to what was happening in Gaza than you did. She's paying attention to facts now. And again, she's probably paying more attention to them than you are.

I fully believe Ilhan Omar knows what is going on in Gaza. She can't claim ignorance (like AOC did after running her mouth on Israel right after she won the primary) as an excuse.
Therefore the only explanation of why she calls Israel's self-defense "evil doings" and has not found it worthy to attack the truly evil doings of Hamas and PIJ is anti-Semitism, pure and simple.

Show

Please provide evidence Omar saw either one of those videos. The we'll talk about her opinion of them.

 

[Arctish]

She did not mention any civilians in her tweet. She was just going on about supposed "evil doings" of Israel while ignoring the evil doings of Hamas and Islamic Jihad.

She didn't mention a lot of things in her tweet. So what? Tweets used to be limited to 75 characters, so the tweets people sent out tended to be focused and pithy.

I remember there being a lot of sympathetic coverage of the rocket attack on Israel, of fearful Israeli children in tears and the grieving families of Israelis who were killed. There was almost nothing in the US news about the frightened and grieving families in Gaza. For whatever reason, the media in the US focused how Israelis were being affected. You had to go to international sources like the BBC to get reports on how Palestinians were faring. Perhaps that's what she meant by Israel having hypnotized the world. I don't know. But it seems pretty clear what she meant by 'evil doings', and given her history it seems pretty understandable why she'd call it that.

Then maybe she should attack Hamas for shooting rockets from civilian areas or storing explosives next to apartment buildings etc.
But no, not a single word even mildly critical of Hamas.

I also believe she saw the blockade and the attack on the Turkish flotilla carrying aid to Gaza two years before as the same sort of 'evil doings' Mohammed Farah Aidid had been responsible for in Somalia.

That flotilla was a scam. In reality, much more tonnage of goods than what could be carried in that bogus flotilla enters Gaza from Israel through the Kerem Shalom crossing every week.

Show

The Israelis weren't letting the Gazans starve, but they weren't letting the donated food into Gaza as it arrived, either.

BS. The only times Kerem Shalom gets closed is when there is a security issue, like when "peaceful protesters" from Gaza set fire to the terminal on their side.

During the blockade, Israel was diverting shipments of donated food, medicine, and other humanitarian aid and warehousing the stuff in Israel. An Israeli official was in charge of calculating how much food Israel would allow the Gazans to import on a weekly basis, He was quoted speaking about 'putting the Gazans on a diet'. If you don't know any of this, then you should look into it. But if you already know about this and are just pretending the whole thing is about a land crossing, that's disingenuous.

Indiscriminate firing of artillery rockets at cities is fine, according to this "former refugee" since the targets are Jews, right?

WTF are you talking about?

Get that knot out of your undies and pay attention to what she actually says. Clearly, you could learn something.

 

[Derec]

I read every article

You ignoring the facts and erroneously claiming Israel killed soccer players determined that was a lie.

I linked and several others. Did you?

Yes.

In November 2012 the cease fire negotiated in 2011 in still in effect and it had been weeks since the last exchange of any sort. On November 8th, IDF forces invaded Gaza and one of them killed a 13 year old boy playing soccer outside his house.

We do not know that. I googled his name. The only references to what you are saying come from anti-Israel sources like electronic intifada (intifada is the word used by Palestinian terrorists for a period of increased terrorist activity). By the way, EI story claims he was shot with a bullet, but this report (by very anti Israel British propagandist Harry Fear who even later converted to Islam) claims that it was a tiny piece of (miracle) shrapnel. Which is it? If they can't even agree as to what kind of projectile killed him, why are they (and you) so sure IDF was responsible? It could have been a wayward round/shell from a Hamas training exercise or a wayward round from an intra-Palestinian clan dispute. It could even have been a piece of shrapnel from one of those home-made grenades Hamas has Gaza boys throw at IDF troops. We only have his friends' and family's word that he was playing football at the time.
To reiterate: we simply do not know what happened. There was no independent investigation into the kid's death, and we can't simply believe what Hamas is saying.

Hamas responded by blowing up a tunnel*

That makes no sense. It is Hamas that digs tunnels to attack inside Israel. IDF blows up the tunnels when they find them.

and then 2 days later firing an anti-tank round at an IDF military target, wounding 4 Israeli soldiers. Later that day, Israel retaliated by firing an artillery round at a group of boys playing soccer in a stadium, and another at a tent full of mourners at a funeral.

Again, even the CNN article you posted says there is no evidence they were playing football. And it also says that the stadium was used for shooting rockets at Israel.

Ilhan Omar's tweet was made on the 16th.

And not a word of condemnation for the evil doings of Hamas. The very point I was making.

but even assuming it was a Hamas tunnel, blowing it up would have been a defensive act.

Hamas and PIJ use tunnels to attack inside Israeli territory. There is nothing "defensive" about them.

If you're going to play the Idiot card

Huh?

Evil doings are evil because of the inherent characteristics of the act, not because of who is doing them to whom. It doesn't matter if the soccer players were Jewish, Muslim, Christian, Wiccan, or what-the-fuck-ever. It was evil to shoot the 13 year old and kill the others with artillery fire.

Again, from the CNN article you posted

CNN has found no evidence that anyone was killed while playing football.
[...]
Valcke's statement was criticized by Israeli media, which reported that the stadium was used by Hamas militants to fire rockets at Jerusalem and Tel Aviv.

Why do you keep ignoring that and keep insisting on Hamas propaganda that they were killed while playing football. They were probably a rocket firing team.

And we just don't know what really happened to the 13 year old, as there was no independent investigation.

If you're going to defend evil because of your own bigotry and bias,

You are confusing me with Ilhan Omar.

then stop pretending you're on some kind of moral high ground. Just admit you hate Muslims and don't care if their kids are murdered.

A libelous statement! I do not like the religion, sure, but I do not wish death on any innocents. However, you cannot blindly believe Hamas propaganda, as they are known to lie.

When they kill non-combatants I do, like when they bombed a falafel strand or when they blew up a city bus.

But shooting 100s of rockets at Israeli cities and towns is ok? Must make Israel judenrein, right?

What, you don't remember? Figures.

There are 1000s of Hamas terrorist attacks. Difficult to remember them all.

So you didn't follow the links or do your own research.

I did both. That led me to conclude that there was no independent investigation into the 13 year old's death.

Please provide evidence Omar saw either one of those videos. The we'll talk about her opinion of them.

Why? I did not claim she saw them. And she could not have seen them in 2012 as they are much more recent. But the evil doings of Hamas were very well known in 2012. That she chose not to condemn Hamas despite that speaks volumes.

 

[Derec]

She didn't mention a lot of things in her tweet. So what? Tweets used to be limited to 75 characters, so the tweets people sent out tended to be focused and pithy.

140 characters actually. And one can write multiple tweets on the same subject. There is simply no excuse for her not to condemn evil doings of Hamas. But I guess Hamas has hypnotized her ...

I remember there being a lot of sympathetic coverage of the rocket attack on Israel, of fearful Israeli children in tears and the grieving families of Israelis who were killed.

So she can't claim ignorance of the evil doings of Hamas. And during the so-called Second Intifada, Hamas committed many suicide bombings against Israeli civilians, including children. That too was very well covered and Ilhan Omar has absolutely no excuse ignoring what Hamas is doing.

There was almost nothing in the US news about the frightened and grieving families in Gaza.

Like these?

That's genocidal propaganda aimed at children. By Ilhan Omar's good friends, the Hamas.

For whatever reason, the media in the US focused how Israelis were being affected. You had to go to international sources like the BBC to get reports on how Palestinians were faring. Perhaps that's what she meant by Israel having hypnotized the world.

Is BBC not part of the world?

I don't know. But it seems pretty clear what she meant by 'evil doings', and given her history it seems pretty understandable why she'd call it that.

I agree it's "pretty clear". I also think it is pretty clear why she is ignoring the actually evil doings of Hamas.

During the blockade, Israel was

The blockade that started when Hamas took control of Gaza is still in effect.

diverting shipments of donated food, medicine, and other humanitarian aid and warehousing the stuff in Israel. An Israeli official was in charge of calculating how much food Israel would allow the Gazans to import on a weekly basis, He was quoted speaking about 'putting the Gazans on a diet'. If you don't know any of this, then you should look into it. But if you already know about this and are just pretending the whole thing is about a land crossing, that's disingenuous.

I know about it. I am afraid you have bought another piece of Palestinian propaganda. The putting Gazans on a diet was a joke, a reference to high obesity rates among Palestinians.
Gaza's weight-loss centers

In reality, the amount of food is calculated to avoid an acute food crisis, even if it was the only source of food. But the food imported from Israel is hardly the only source of food. Gaza has ample agricultural production; they grow plenty of crops and raise a lot of chickens, sheep etc.
Fresh food markets in Gaza are well stocked.

There is even a French fry factory for fuck's sake!
French-fry factory offers rare jobs for Gaza women

Indiscriminate firing of artillery rockets at cities is fine, according to this "former refugee" since the targets are Jews, right?

WTF are you talking about?

About the indiscriminate shooting of rockets at Israeli cities and towns that "former refugee" Ilhan Omar does not see fit to condemn.

Get that knot out of your undies and pay attention to what she actually says. Clearly, you could learn something.

What she doesn't say says even more than what she says.

 

[Arctish]

I read every article

You ignoring the facts and erroneously claiming Israel killed soccer players determined that was a lie.

I linked and several others. Did you?

Yes.

I provided sources for the information I presented. The least you can do is show where you are getting your information, especially if you're going to call me a liar.

In November 2012 the cease fire negotiated in 2011 in still in effect and it had been weeks since the last exchange of any sort. On November 8th, IDF forces invaded Gaza and one of them killed a 13 year old boy playing soccer outside his house.

We do not know that. I googled his name. The only references to what you are saying come from anti-Israel sources like electronic intifada (intifada is the word used by Palestinian terrorists for a period of increased terrorist activity). By the way, EI story claims he was shot with a bullet, but this report (by very anti Israel British propagandist Harry Fear who even later converted to Islam) claims that it was a tiny piece of (miracle) shrapnel. Which is it? If they can't even agree as to what kind of projectile killed him, why are they (and you) so sure IDF was responsible? It could have been a wayward round/shell from a Hamas training exercise or a wayward round from an intra-Palestinian clan dispute. It could even have been a piece of shrapnel from one of those home-made grenades Hamas has Gaza boys throw at IDF troops. We only have his friends' and family's word that he was playing football at the time.
To reiterate: we simply do not know what happened. There was no independent investigation into the kid's death, and we can't simply believe what Hamas is saying.

Here's one for starters: The Jerusalem Post, it in their Timeline of 2012 Gaza escalations:

November 8

In a firefight with Palestinians, apparent IDF fire kills a 13 year old Palestinian boy

Middle East Monitor, among other news outlets, reported the deaths of the boys playing soccer 2 days later: Remembering Israel’s ‘Operation Pillar of Defence

What happened?
Tensions between the Israeli occupying forces and Gaza escalated in the days leading up to the military operation. On 10 November, Israel responded to an attack on a military jeep by killing four Palestinian teenagers while they played football in a Gaza sports stadium.

There are other reports that back up my statements. Show me the ones that back up yours.

I'm not even going to bother with the rest of your post. It just looks like standard Zionist apologist boilerplate with a side order of undated, sourceless videos and pictures. .

We got off onto this discussion when you claimed Ilhan Omar is anti-Semitic and posted a partial tweet in which she criticized the 'evil doings' of Israel as proof. And when it was pointed out that the tweet was sent during Operation Pillar of Defense and her personal experiences of war in Somalia and as a refugee in Kenya probably factored into her reaction, you completely ignored that part. All you did was post the same brainless Israel = Jews, therefore criticism of Israeli policy = anti-Semitism dogma we've seen a thousand times.

 

[laughing dog]

All you did was post the same brainless Israel = Jews, therefore criticism of Israeli policy = anti-Semitism dogma we've seen a thousand times.

And we will that brainless canard trotted out every time, because the state of Israel is sacrosanct.

 

[Derec]

I provided sources for the information I presented.

You provided sources that debunked your claims, as I have shown. Repeatedly.

Here's one for starters: The Jerusalem Post, it in their Timeline of 2012 Gaza escalations:

November 8

In a firefight with Palestinians, apparent IDF fire kills a 13 year old Palestinian boy

Emphasis added. They do not know either, since, for the millionth time, there never was an independent investigation into this case.
No matter how many newspaper articles you post, they all go back to the same claims by the family and the Hamas.

Btw, one possibility I just thought of. If the doctor (who supposedly treated the kid) is right abut the 2mm holes in the kid's chest, then what could account for it is that he and his friends were building a nail bomb and it exploded accidentally. A small finishing nail would be the right size.

Middle East Monitor, among other news outlets, reported the deaths of the boys playing soccer 2 days later: Remembering Israel’s ‘Operation Pillar of Defence

The CNN article about the same incident you posted earlier said that there was NO EVIDENCE they were killed while playing soccer. Since the stadium was used by Hamas to launch rockets into Israel, much more likely they were a rocket launch team. The dead teenagers, 16-18 years old, are certainly the right age to be Hamas terrorists.

Besides, MEMO is a pro-Hamas rag.

There are other reports that back up my statements. Show me the ones that back up yours.

I do not claim to know what exactly happened to the kid. I was just showing that we do not know what happened. And I stand by that.

I'm not even going to bother with the rest of your post. It just looks like standard Zionist apologist boilerplate with a side order of undated, sourceless videos and pictures.

And your posts are standard Hamas apologist boilerplate. I showed the evil doings of Hamas, that were known or should have been known to Ilhan Omar. I also showed that the Hamas claim that Israel is somehow almost starving Gazans is a vicious lie.

We got off onto this discussion when you claimed Ilhan Omar is anti-Semitic and posted a partial tweet in which she criticized the 'evil doings' of Israel as proof.

No, that was the whole tweet. Nothing partial about it.

And when it was pointed out that the tweet was sent during Operation Pillar of Defense and her personal experiences of war in Somalia and as a refugee in Kenya probably factored into her reaction, you completely ignored that part. All you did was post the same brainless Israel = Jews, therefore criticism of Israeli policy = anti-Semitism dogma we've seen a thousand times.

Nobody said that Israel==Jews. So let's drop that straw man right away.

I know that the tweet was sent during the Operation Pillar of Defense. I can read dates on tweets. My point is that she calls Israel defending themselves "evil doings" but Hamas shooting 1500 rockets at Israeli civilians, not to mention the long history of Hamas terrorist attacks (like the Sbarro bombing) and the well known genocidal goals of Hamas warrant no condemnation by her. Why such blatant onesidedness?

I do not see why her experiences in Somalia and Kenya should cause her to exaggerate Israel's fault while completely ignoring the truly "evil doings" of Hamas. Other than anti-Semitism of course.
Again, why is she ignoring the EVIL DOINGS OF HAMAS. Why are you, laughing dog and Ilhan Omar so hypnotized by them?

 

[laughing dog]

Again, why is she ignoring the EVIL DOINGS OF HAMAS. Why are you, laughing dog and Ilhan Omar so hypnotized by them?

You'd have to ask her. Most people do not go around defending Hamas's killing and terrorizing of civilians. On the otherhand, there a lots of people hypnotized by Israel and who will defend any atrocity committed by its gov't.