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Good news atheists: Danish government to protect your religious beliefs from being mocked

But are the laws enforceable???

Technically, yes. Practically, I don't think any prosecutor would want to enforce it for fear of being laughed out of court. That being said, I don't forget that police have in rare cases arrested serious criminals for the petty offense like jaywalking when the officers have wanted to buy themselves time to a build a better case to give to the prosecution's office to prosecute. Of course, the defense lawyers have a field day and argue about police harassment. But it serves the purpose. Al Capone, despite being a career criminal and notorious gangster, for example, was not convicted for the offense of massacre but tax evasion when they wanted him off the streets. So, it is entirely possible that a prosecutor could at some point decide to prosecute someone for a law (any law) that remains on the books.

Buddhism doesn't have a supreme being, either. Buddha is not a deity, merely an ideal example of a person.
I do know that Buddhism is arguably atheistic, but I'm unsure what point you're trying to convey here.

Peace.
 
...I wasn't planning on doing that.

The Danish government is right to ask what WAS a person planning to achieve by publically burning a quran?

The honest answer would surely be that the act was intended to troll muslims.

So what? Who says someone can't use their free speech rights to troll others?
 
The government arresting me for burning a book I own is tyranny.
What if you hold a press conference for the purpose of burning 500 Qurans you purchased, with the stated goal of starting a riot?

The underlined part is the only part that would make it potentially illegal, and the rest of its is completely irrelevant. If the stated purpose is to incite violence, then act of burning qurans could be replaced with saying a "prayer" on the street and it should be treated the same under any defensible law.

The government should have no power to decide what people should be offended by, because all such decisions are purely arbitrary and biased by completely non-rational subjective preferences.

Also, no one ever says they are doing it to start a riot, so that hypothetical applies only a law that would never be enforceable. Virtually never is there remotely enough evidence to support any rational conclusion that person's intent was to start a riot, given that there is always many other highly plausible motives to do and say things that others find offensive. So, determining such intent should not be left up to the courts (aka, the state) to arbitrarily decide.

In fact, in a highly Muslim neighborhood, two men kissing could start a riot. Should that be illegal, just because some close-minded fascists who react to other's personal actions with violent rioting? That amounts to nothing short of giving into terroristic demands by destroying the freedoms that terrorist are opposed to

Fascism doesn't take hold because people are permitted to say offensive or things or even to say pro-fascist things. It takes hold when people permit their government to decide what can be said.
 
FreeThought Forum mods?
Twitter?

Shit, are you that ignorant about what "free speech" means? It doesn't mean other private citizens can't stop you from speaking on forums they control. It means the government can't criminalize your speech.
 
Take it up with governments around the world which routinely limit free speech.

Me ignorant?

Try defaming someone rich and see whose side courts take.

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Pop over to Germany and exercise your free speech opinion that the holocaust was a hoax
 
There's heaps of 'privately controlled' Internet forums which cannot legally permit denial of the holocaust.
rationalskepticism.org won't let you deny the holocaust because German law prevents them from doing so.
 
Take it up with governments around the world which routinely limit free speech.



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Pop over to Germany and exercise your free speech opinion that the holocaust was a hoax

Yes, there are sadly too many governments paving the way to fascism by restricting speech where there is no valid evidence of harm caused by the speech itself. Emotional effects of speech can never cause harm in itself to the listener. The listener has total power over all emotional and psychological impact of the speech on them. While the courts have on rare occasions ignored this scientific reality, it is always a dangerous and regrettable thing when they do.


Try defaming someone rich and see whose side courts take.


You are begging the question there. 99.99999% of the time, highly offensive and insulting things are said about rich and powerful people and it is not defamation and they have no legal recourse.
Defamation is not a crime in any reasonable system, and not a crime in the US. No one can go to jail for defaming another person. Defamation is a purely civil issue, and something one party must sue another party for in a claim of tangible injury. The speech must be specifically and explicitly directed at the individual claimant in the suit. In most states the claimant must prove that what was said is objectively false, meant to be taken literally and seriously (not as mockery or satire), and that it was said publicly in a manner that caused other people to alter the actions towards the claimant in a way that harmed them financially.

IOW, they must prove what cannot be proven even in 99.99% of instances of the most offensive, insulting speech you can imagine.
With most offenses, its not even a possibility that it can be defamation because what was said is a purely subjective opinion that can never be true or false. IOW, and opinion that "Person X is an ugly, stupid, fat, immoral, scumbag, who shouldn't be trusted, and he only has sex with naive girls that he can manipulate into bed." can never be defamatory because it is pure opinion and none of those traits have objective referents against which they can be shown to be false.

And even false statements are not defamatory when said about people that are known to the general public. The courts have ruled that it must be proven that the speaker knew their claims were false and said them with malice to harm the person.

Finally, what theists say about atheists on a regular basis is objectively more defamatory than just about everything that has ever led to a defamation suit. They say that atheists are thought by the supreme creator of all moral goodness to be so evil that they will suffer for eternity. That is actually not a matter of personal opinion. It is mutliple assertions of fact that are objectively true or false. Whether a person is actually evil is a matter of opinion, but whether they are thought to be evil and will be punished by the creator of all moral goodness is either true or not. And, any rational analysis suggest that it is almost certainly false and there is no reasonable basis for the speaker to ever think it is true.
It is an idea that causes real tangible harm to atheists, has cost them jobs, promotions, income, etc..
Yet, no atheist would ever win a defamation lawsuit against a theist for such slander. This shows both how hard it is to sue someone even when the speech is technically defamation, and it shows why it should be nearly impossible, because even with those criteria, it is applied in such an arbitrary and subjective way, where offensive slander said in the guise of religions get a free pass because we are supposed to just expect such things from worldviews that are founded in made up lies and hatred (aka all Abrahamic religions).
 
Person X is an ugly, stupid, fat, immoral, scumbag, who shouldn't be trusted, and he only has sex with naive girls that he can manipulate into bed."

That's a fine treatise, but -
If the rest of your post was true, you would have replaced Person X with Donald Trump. :p
 
@ronburgundy
If a US court rules (in a civil trial) that you have defamed someone (by your free speech) and you ignore that ruling and refuse to pay the costs awarded to the plaintiff you, guess what the government does next.
Civil law is still law and it's an institution of The State.
Therefore anti-defamation laws are as much a limit on free speech as any other law.
 
@ronburgundy
If a US court rules (in a civil trial) that you have defamed someone (by your free speech) and you ignore that ruling and refuse to pay the costs awarded to the plaintiff you, guess what the government does next.
Civil law is still law and it's an institution of The State.
Therefore anti-defamation laws are as much a limit on free speech as any other law.

Again, your "free speech right" is that the government will not prosecute you for your speech. Your free speech right does not mean there will not be consequences from your speech from other private citizens.
 
Great.
So what's all the fuss about this guy's free speech having 'consequences'?
I've got the right to as much free speech as my fellow citizens allow me to have.
 
Buddhism doesn't have a supreme being, either. Buddha is not a deity, merely an ideal example of a person.
I do know that Buddhism is arguably atheistic, but I'm unsure what point you're trying to convey here.

Peace.

The point was a mainstream belief that is commonly considered a religion but which lacks a deity. Thus it is clear that religion need not have a supreme being. I wouldn't call it atheistic, though, as it does have faith in a supernatural system.
 
Great.
So what's all the fuss about this guy's free speech having 'consequences'?
I've got the right to as much free speech as my fellow citizens allow me to have.

Holy crap, are you deliberately being stupid at this point? I've tried to make it very, very, very simple for you.

Free speech is about government not prosecuting speech.

This thread is about a case of a government prosecuting a person's speech.
 
You say that as though the government is somehow separate from the will of citizens to restrict the so-called free speech of certain other citizens.
 
If I want to gatecrash a private meeting of some feminist pro-choice collective holding up my freshly painted anti-abortion placard, who is going to intervene and prevent me from exercising my free speech? Private citizens or the police?
 
Who other than "The Government" prevents you from exercising freedom of speech?

Don't say Church or Mosque or Synagogue. You can go and blashpheme as much as you like UNLESS the government doesn't want you to incite religious hostility.

Don't say civil law suits for defamation are a 'private' matter. Those courts are operated by the government and their rulings are enforced by the government.
 
FreeThought Forum mods?
Twitter?

The use of either medium of communication suspends your first ammendmant right since the speech is through someone else's server which is legally considered private property.
 
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