How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[Gun Nut]

US has privately warned Russia of consequences of using a nuclear weapon

We only see and hear what someone allows us to see and hear. Pewtin knows that escalating to nukes gets him nowhere. It is far more certain that such talk is meant to take attention away from his failures and merely be a distraction, a ploy for time. It's also a brag, not a threat.

Yes, your deranged neocon government privately threatened Russia with nukes.
Putin publicly reminded that Russia has nukes too.

I would like to publicly threaten those sub-humans with nukes. A clear message that if a microgram of nuclear material is utilized as any form of weapon anywhere, then the US will turn Moscow into a glass-topped desert while simultaneously watching each and every one of their silos and their surrounding 100 miles melt down... and then follow up by marching into (the former) Russian territory and camp out with a big fucking sign that says, "what are you going to do about it, pussys?"

 

[SLD]

But that doesn’t mean he can engineer an acceptable outcome in Ukraine. Ukraine will still not surrender.

You are still under false impression that Ukraine NATO is doing well in Ukraine.

Is that why people are fleeing your country?

 

[Jayjay]

But that doesn’t mean he can engineer an acceptable outcome in Ukraine. Ukraine will still not surrender. And they will not be defeated. Thus we are in for a long war, possibly up to five years or more.

EU can not survive for that long.

I hope to remember this prediction 5 years from now.

EU could crumble due to its own bickering. But the war is actually making it stronger, due to a common external enemy taking the blame for EU's internal problems. This winter will be cold in Germany, but next winter is going to be less so, and after that the Russian cheap gas is just a memory.

It's another question whether EU will get tired of supporting the war if it goes on that long. Probably the enthusiasm will diminish. But most of the military aid comes from US and UK.

 

[Jayjay]

This is a promising rumor, if it turns out to be true:



I guess we'll find out next week.

 

[steve_bank]

It was humongous blunder on the part of Putin.

Without the war where would the EU and NATO be in 5 or 10 year?. Where would the American European relations be?

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

It was humongous blunder on the part of Putin.

Without the war where would the EU and NATO be in 5 or 10 year?. Where would the American European relations be?

I guess it was but he is terrified of a free Ukraine right on his border because it brings democracy and accountability that much closer.

Kazakhstan has taken in 98,000 Russians in the past seven days. That's incredible. If this continues for long more people will have left Russia than have left Ukraine. And a veeeeeeeeery large percentage of these people are men of conscription age.

According to barbos and Poostain everything is going according to plan.

 

[steve_bank]

Add to tat impacting the global food supply especially those at the bottom. People will not forget.


Is or was Putin really afraid of a NATO invasion? Who knows.

He was raised in the Soviet system and was an intelligence operative. From a bio as East Germany collapsed he went around trying to get assistance form Soviet military and was ignored. By all accounts he is carrying a grudge against the west.

From what I read post fall, the Soviets may have been more afraid of the west than we were of the Soviets.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Add to tat impacting the global food supply especially those at the bottom. People will not forget.


Is or was Putin really afraid of a NATO invasion? Who knows.

He was raised in the Soviet system and was an intelligence operative. From a bio as East Germany collapsed he went around trying to get assistance form Soviet military and was ignored. By all accounts he is carrying a grudge against the west.

From what I read post fall, the Soviets may have been more afraid of the west than we were of the Soviets.

Post Gorbachev the fear of the west was pretty much gone. Unfortunately the USSR never had a legacy of law, it was up to that time an authoritarian state that lived by projecting terror. Unable to afford to keep up with the west it failed for good reason. Critically what it lacked was an understanding and appreciation within the population for personal freedom, entepreneurship, etc. Putin took advantage and has enriched himself beyond probably even his wildest dreams. So now we're back to Stalin but with a heavy, heavy, heavy helping of greed to go with the lust for power.

 

[ZiprHead]

Word is that the US is sending eighteen more HIMARs to Ukraine.

Russians go

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

But that doesn’t mean he can engineer an acceptable outcome in Ukraine. Ukraine will still not surrender.

You are still under false impression that Ukraine NATO is doing well in Ukraine.

Well, technically, as long as it is still called Ukraine, it is Russia that isn't where they wanted to be at this point (or several months ago). Ukraine hasn't exactly expelled Russia from their borders, but Zelensky wasn't supposed to still be President today.

 

[steve_bank]

Add to tat impacting the global food supply especially those at the bottom. People will not forget.


Is or was Putin really afraid of a NATO invasion? Who knows.

He was raised in the Soviet system and was an intelligence operative. From a bio as East Germany collapsed he went around trying to get assistance form Soviet military and was ignored. By all accounts he is carrying a grudge against the west.

From what I read post fall, the Soviets may have been more afraid of the west than we were of the Soviets.

Post Gorbachev the fear of the west was pretty much gone. Unfortunately the USSR never had a legacy of law, it was up to that time an authoritarian state that lived by projecting terror. Unable to afford to keep up with the west it failed for good reason. Critically what it lacked was an understanding and appreciation within the population for personal freedom, entepreneurship, etc. Putin took advantage and has enriched himself beyond probably even his wildest dreams. So now we're back to Stalin but with a heavy, heavy, heavy helping of greed to go with the lust for power.

You would think Russia and Iran right now would encourage republicans to support rule of law when it comes to Trump.

 

[TV and credit cards]

Word is that the US is sending eighteen more HIMARs to Ukraine.

Russians go

Time to quietly slip the Ukrainians some longer range missiles and hit some plump Russian targets in the backfield.

 

[steve_bank]

The state department is telling people in Russia with dual citizenship to get out, they may be drafted.

 

[Patooka]

NATO promised a war until the last ukrainian.

Where?

On the internet. One of your generals said that. He said it disapprovingly though.
And no, I am not searching for the link.

I stopped expecting you to back up any of your assertions a looong time ago.

 

[Oleg]

Claims that Russia is losing, that the referenda are shams, and that mobilizing 300,000 old men without enough equipment won't fix their problems rest on a mode analysis that privileges white, western "science" over traditional Russian ways of knowing.

 

[Patooka]

Claims that Russia is losing, that the referenda are shams, and that mobilizing 300,000 old men without enough equipment won't fix their problems rest on a mode analysis that privileges white, western "science" over traditional Russian ways of knowing.

I'm usually fluent in Reich-wing snark, but I have no fucking idea what this is supposed to mean. Is this some sort of "Tucker Carlson is right, Russia is winning" sort of attempt?

 

[SLD]

Claims that Russia is losing, that the referenda are shams, and that mobilizing 300,000 old men without enough equipment won't fix their problems rest on a mode analysis that privileges white, western "science" over traditional Russian ways of knowing.

I'm usually fluent in Reich-wing snark, but I have no fucking idea what this is supposed to mean. Is this some sort of "Tucker Carlson is right, Russia is winning" sort of attempt?

I took it as pure sarcasm. Pretty funny that way!

 

[Hermit]

Claims that Russia is losing, that the referenda are shams, and that mobilizing 300,000 old men without enough equipment won't fix their problems rest on a mode analysis that privileges white, western "science" over traditional Russian ways of knowing.

I'm usually fluent in Reich-wing snark, but I have no fucking idea what this is supposed to mean. Is this some sort of "Tucker Carlson is right, Russia is winning" sort of attempt?

Perhaps Oleg doesn't know either. Maybe he just decided to copy/paste this tweet because he likes the sound of it.

As of 14 hours ago "traditional Russian ways of knowing" is a thing. The expression was minted by the author of the tweet linked to above. Google found it and two other instances. One is a retweet. The other another c/p job in a Czech forum.

 

[dannyk]

I don't have much expertise in the Russian/Ukraine situation but what happens next if Russia annexes parts of Ukraine. What should the western response be?

 

[Patooka]

I don't have much expertise in the Russian/Ukraine situation but what happens next if Russia annexes parts of Ukraine.

That's already happened. Eight years ago.

Annexation of Crimea by the Russian Federation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

What should the western response be?

Sanctions on Russia and military aid to Ukraine. Pretty much what it is doing now. There should also be a commitment to help in rebuilding Ukraine like Germany/Japan post WWII in my opinion. Not because it's the right thing to do, but ex warzones are typically breeding grounds for corruption and extremism. Better to stop the problem before it becomes a problem.