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How should west respond to Russian invasion of Ukraine?

 
 
 
People here complain about US politicians being assholes, and they are. I admit russian ones are assholes too.
But apparently these Ukrainians are different, very different. If you believe the usual suspects here they are incredible human beings....... Then I watch Sharij who is clearly well versed in ukro-politics and he has all the documentation which clearly shows that ukro-policitians are way worse than anything in US and even EU. Who for me to believe?

By the way, I grew up near the other kid who almost became Prime Minister of Russia (he was offered a post but refused) He is still a politician but not as prominent as in the late 1990s.
I did not knew him well, he was really a next door neighbor of my older cousins.
Few years ago he was running for Duma again and was campaigning here. People here did not like him and told him that.
 
barbos said:
People here complain about US politicians being assholes, and they are. I admit russian ones are assholes too.
But apparently these Ukrainians are different, very different. If you believe the usual suspects here they are incredible human beings....... Then I watch Sharij who is clearly well versed in ukro-politics and he has all the documentation which clearly shows that ukro-policitians are way worse than anything in US and even EU. Who for me to believe?

By the way, I grew up near the other kid who almost became Prime Minister of Russia (he was offered a post but refused) He is still a politician but not as prominent as in the late 1990s.
I did not knew him well, he was really a next door neighbor of my older cousins.
Few years ago he was running for Duma again and was campaigning here. People here did not like him and told him that.
Click to expand...
Tell Vlad we hope he loses
 
Tigers! said:
barbos said:
People here complain about US politicians being assholes, and they are. I admit russian ones are assholes too.
But apparently these Ukrainians are different, very different. If you believe the usual suspects here they are incredible human beings....... Then I watch Sharij who is clearly well versed in ukro-politics and he has all the documentation which clearly shows that ukro-policitians are way worse than anything in US and even EU. Who for me to believe?

By the way, I grew up near the other kid who almost became Prime Minister of Russia (he was offered a post but refused) He is still a politician but not as prominent as in the late 1990s.
I did not knew him well, he was really a next door neighbor of my older cousins.
Few years ago he was running for Duma again and was campaigning here. People here did not like him and told him that.
Click to expand...
Tell Vlad we hope he loses
Click to expand...
He knows that without telling.
We hope he wins. I hope that too. And I am not even a fun of Putin and russian government in general.
But they and russian public in general have no choice but to fight off the western aggression.
 
Meanwhile, Greece blocked EU's 21st sanctions packet. Not because Greece puppet government likes Russia but becasue Greek LNG tankers oligarch said it would bankrupt him.
Germany and France secretly trying to get exemption for themselves too.

Unrelated to that, German business people even went to Baku to secretly meet with russians there.
Merz himself in recent interview admitted that german economic problems are due to cutoff of cheap and reliable russian gas :)

none of that looks good for "Ukraine"
 
barbos said:
People here complain about US politicians being assholes, and they are. I admit russian ones are assholes too.
But apparently these Ukrainians are different, very different. If you believe the usual suspects here they are incredible human beings....... Then I watch Sharij who is clearly well versed in ukro-politics and he has all the documentation which clearly shows that ukro-policitians are way worse than anything in US and even EU. Who for me to believe?

By the way, I grew up near the other kid who almost became Prime Minister of Russia (he was offered a post but refused) He is still a politician but not as prominent as in the late 1990s.
I did not knew him well, he was really a next door neighbor of my older cousins.
Few years ago he was running for Duma again and was campaigning here. People here did not like him and told him that.
Click to expand...
The difference between North America and Europe/EU with Russia is we consider it a fundamental right to call out politicians assholes without being dragged away by the government.

Trump ries to suppress free speech but the courts are genially parenting it. So far.

We have a free press. A free press is in part was why pressure built to end the Vietnam War. Everyday in the news people saw the difference between what the government siaid and the reality in VN. From the government it was we are wining, we just need more troops. WE are kiling ore of hem then we are looting. And so on.

We see the global news media take up the obvious difference between Trump's claims and the reality of the war. Congress has yet to assert itself, we will see how the mid term elections go.

Russia has no free speech and no free press. People have no idea what is going on.
 
barbos said:
So Syrsky was fired too. I wonder if he can go back to Russia and retire there, close to his family.
Click to expand...
Your jibber jabber does nothing to change the reality of the Russian situation in the war.

Many casualties, inflation, fuel shortages. All because of Putin's lust for power.
 
Spain started to use gas reserved for the winter. This is going to be cold winter in Europe.
Speaking of winter. I watch an youtube channel with foreigners living in Russia.
they all "complain" that homes in Russia are very warm compared to Europe.
Spain does not really have heating in homes. They have electric heaters but electricity is expensive.
GB is obviously much worse.

Here is a french girls complaining about cold in France after her return visit from Russia.
By the way, she speaks russian without any accent, I mean none, and her russian is more fluent than mine. But to be fair, her father was russian and she spent some time in Russia with russian grandparents as a kid but according to her, her russian was not that good before she moved to Russian 3 years ago. And she studied to be an actress. So that played a role in her perfect russian.
Russian pronunciation is quite easy if you try but grammar is not. The other guy (american and an actor too) on that channel who studied russian as an adult still have minor and weird (not really american) accent in some places. British guy too, have shown great improvement since the beginning.
I watch their channel a lot. It started as English language school and still is, but it evolved into a talk show with foreigners about stuff. They have had Chinese, Korean, Japanese, Indian, Argentinian, Peruvian, British, French, Italian, american, new guy from turkey, Kenya (I think) and Ghana.

Her last name is russian and even conjugated to a russuan form. I doubt it is the same in her passport.
Russian names usually do not get conjugated when girls inherit them from their russian fathers.
<Removed By Moderator>
 
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All that still has nothing to do with Putin's catastrophic failure and Russian suffering.

Given what has been in the media about his personality and what I saw of Putin my guess it is a toxic environment to be around him. Anger, outbursts, and abusive language.

All that frustration and anxiety has to come out.
 
steve_bank said:
The difference between North America and Europe/EU with Russia is we consider it a fundamental right to call out politicians assholes without being dragged away by the government.
Click to expand...
That's not really that fundamental. It's more of a cultural thing.
Yes, In US/EU you can do that and the government is happy to pretend that they listen to you.
In Russia we had experimented with that in the 90s, it turned into a shit show, so gradually they reverted to the usual russian version of "proper" behaviour. Personally, I think it's not good, but then again, I remember 90s. Westerners always notice that russians are more direct and don't like to obfuscate what they think like British for example.
In the West they have much longer history of "rule of law and so called democracy" than in Russia and really the rest of the world. I mean go trash Japan or Korea when it comes to free speech with regards to speaking trash about government.
 
Putin is sitting well and watching how The Orange is screwing himself and EU in the ME.
I mean that's my read of Putin's plan. Iran war is great for both Russia and China.
How fucking stupid that was of the Pentagon/CIA to fail to understand that Iran is not going to fold.
How fucking stupid it was. Russia did not fold from your attempts, and you thought that Iran would.
Stupidity is incredible.
 
Barbos

You live in a dictatorship. You know it and we know it. Russian people are suffering for it.

Our issues with Trump are irrelevant to Putin and Russia.

Over here in Seattle if i pare it down to essentials I can eat very well on about $300 a month. Just for myself.

Fish, chicken fruits, fresh vegetables, milk, coffee. Rice, beans, potatoes.

Seattle is one of the most expensive places to live in the USA. My typical monthly total expenses for food,, electricity, rent, Internet - cell phone, and non food spending is around $2000 a month. Sometimes more sometimes less.

What does it cost to live in a Russian city like Moscow for a regular comfortable life? No luxuries just good food, good clothes, and a decent place to live?

Propaganda aside, that is really all that maters, how people live. We have a housing shortage crisis driving up rent and hone prices and Trump causedd inflation is affecting food prices. High gas prices caused by the Iran war are affecting people.

We will see in the mid terms if republicans get voted out. Unlike Russia over here in the long run people do have a say in politics.

So the question for you is the war worth it for the Russian people?
 
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steve_bank said:
barbos said:
People here complain about US politicians being assholes, and they are. I admit russian ones are assholes too.
But apparently these Ukrainians are different, very different. If you believe the usual suspects here they are incredible human beings....... Then I watch Sharij who is clearly well versed in ukro-politics and he has all the documentation which clearly shows that ukro-policitians are way worse than anything in US and even EU. Who for me to believe?

By the way, I grew up near the other kid who almost became Prime Minister of Russia (he was offered a post but refused) He is still a politician but not as prominent as in the late 1990s.
I did not knew him well, he was really a next door neighbor of my older cousins.
Few years ago he was running for Duma again and was campaigning here. People here did not like him and told him that.
Click to expand...
The difference between North America and Europe/EU with Russia is we consider it a fundamental right to call out politicians assholes without being dragged away by the government.

Trump ries to suppress free speech but the courts are genially parenting it. So far.

We have a free press. A free press is in part was why pressure built to end the Vietnam War. Everyday in the news people saw the difference between what the government siaid and the reality in VN. From the government it was we are wining, we just need more troops. WE are kiling ore of hem then we are looting. And so on.

We see the global news media take up the obvious difference between Trump's claims and the reality of the war. Congress has yet to assert itself, we will see how the mid term elections go.

Russia has no free speech and no free press. People have no idea what is going on.
Click to expand...
Oh, they're starting to figure it out. Things blowing up in your neighborhood will do that.


Looks like Russia is headed towards another mobilization. Internal security in getting beefed up. Fear ads are being posted to sign up before you're called up, alluding to having some control over where you might be sent. More criminals are being scraped from the prisons.
All this give more validity to the claim that Russia is losing more soldiers on the battlefield than they are able to recruit.
 
TV and credit cards said:
Oh, they're starting to figure it out. Things blowing up in your neighborhood will do that.
Click to expand...
That's the way it looks to me.

I don't much trust modern media coverage. Especially dramatic video coverage from war zones. But my YouTube is full of stuff about Russian infrastructure going BOOM, and shortages of basics like fuel and stuff.
Don't know but I am glad I'm not in Russia at this time.
Tom
 
TomC said:
TV and credit cards said:
Oh, they're starting to figure it out. Things blowing up in your neighborhood will do that.
Click to expand...
That's the way it looks to me.

I don't much trust modern media coverage. Especially dramatic video coverage from war zones. But my YouTube is full of stuff about Russian infrastructure going BOOM, and shortages of basics like fuel and stuff.
Don't know but I am glad I'm not in Russia at this time.
Tom
Click to expand...
There's a number of YouTube channels covering the war. Most I won't bother with. I look at the name of the channel and ask, who the hell are you? DW News I'll watch or any known news source. DW reports regularly.
 
DW, BBC, France24, and NHK from Japan are on local PBS stations every weeknight.

On the grud coverage in Gaza and Ukraine.

If you think mainstream media is completely untrustworthy than certain forces have succeeded. You do not know what to believe. Then people like Trump advances his own narrative as truth.
 
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barbos said:
steve_bank said:
You live in a dictatorship.
Click to expand...
No, but you live in bullshitership.
Click to expand...

Has hthee war been good for Russians, yes or no?

Are you afraid to say no?

What is the price of a kilo of potatoes or chicken or beef in Russia?

When I go up on our roof deck to have coffee and take in the view of Seattle and the bay I do nit have to worry about drones. The biggest threat is being crapped on by seagulls.

Russia is a dctrship.

Putin
Suppression of opposition candiates
No free speech or press.
Cliosure of independent non government media.
Arbitrary arrest.

Don;t know about you, that is what we kind of consider a dictatorship, one man rule.

That is what Trump dreams of.
 
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