Ideology doesn't seem to be so important during the pandemic

[ZiprHead]

Libertarians: Now give me back the rest of my money you stole.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Maybe if these corporations didn’t spend the last Republican windfall they got in the form of tax cuts on buying back their own stock, they’d have the rainy day fund to weather this storm.

Poor people, bills, and booze? None and neither do you. It’s just another shit assumption you make that people who don’t have the intellectual ability or talents to live in anything other than poverty are in their situation due to laziness and a lack of willpower.

Don't blame the airlines--you can't have substantial rainy day funds in the presence of strong unions.

 

[ZiprHead]

Maybe if these corporations didn’t spend the last Republican windfall they got in the form of tax cuts on buying back their own stock, they’d have the rainy day fund to weather this storm.

Poor people, bills, and booze? None and neither do you. It’s just another shit assumption you make that people who don’t have the intellectual ability or talents to live in anything other than poverty are in their situation due to laziness and a lack of willpower.

Don't blame the airlines--you can't have substantial rainy day funds in the presence of strong unions.

Bullshit. They were given a huge windfall in the recent tax break. They used the money to buy back stock instead of saving for a rainy day. I say use their stock as collateral to get a loan. They need no more of our help.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Libertarians: Now give me back the rest of my money you stole.

This gives me an idea. We should have a Libertarian shadow President who has no real ability. He (or she) can just say funny stuff like this all year long while serious hard workers actually do real things. It would provide needed entertainment which is critical right now.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Maybe if these corporations didn’t spend the last Republican windfall they got in the form of tax cuts on buying back their own stock, they’d have the rainy day fund to weather this storm.

Poor people, bills, and booze? None and neither do you. It’s just another shit assumption you make that people who don’t have the intellectual ability or talents to live in anything other than poverty are in their situation due to laziness and a lack of willpower.

Don't blame the airlines--you can't have substantial rainy day funds in the presence of strong unions.

Bullshit. They were given a huge windfall in the recent tax break. They used the money to buy back stock instead of saving for a rainy day. I say use their stock as collateral to get a loan. They need no more of our help.

Saying bullshit doesn't make the problem go away. Unions demand the money be used for salaries. Saving for a rainy day isn't an option.

 

[ZiprHead]

Bullshit. They were given a huge windfall in the recent tax break. They used the money to buy back stock instead of saving for a rainy day. I say use their stock as collateral to get a loan. They need no more of our help.

Saying bullshit doesn't make the problem go away. Unions demand the money be used for salaries. Saving for a rainy day isn't an option.

Are their contracts up for renewal? They can't ask for anything until that time approaches.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

Government agencies are suspending regulation.
Police aren't arresting people for victimless crimes.

Seems like a lot of politicians are becoming more libertarian because of the panICdemic.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Bullshit. They were given a huge windfall in the recent tax break. They used the money to buy back stock instead of saving for a rainy day. I say use their stock as collateral to get a loan. They need no more of our help.

Saying bullshit doesn't make the problem go away. Unions demand the money be used for salaries. Saving for a rainy day isn't an option.

Are their contracts up for renewal? They can't ask for anything until that time approaches.

But when the contracts are up the rainy day funds get drained. There's no point in having them in the first place.

 

[ZiprHead]

Are their contracts up for renewal? They can't ask for anything until that time approaches.

But when the contracts are up the rainy day funds get drained. There's no point in having them in the first place.

Any bullshit excuse to suck up to big business and excuse their greed.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Are their contracts up for renewal? They can't ask for anything until that time approaches.

But when the contracts are up the rainy day funds get drained. There's no point in having them in the first place.

Any bullshit excuse to suck up to big business and excuse their greed.

You're dodging the issue.

 

[Canard DuJour]

Has anyone else noticed that the predominantly conservative and libertarian ideology that governs us has taken more than a few hits from reality during the pandemic?

The champions of individuals taking responsibility for themselves to solve society's problems are recommending a lot of collective actions to reduce the impact of the virus.

The opponents of universal health care don't seem to be so adverse to it now.

The very same people who voted against the Keynesian stimulus in the Great Recession, and instead recommended austerity, seem to have embraced Keynesianism now. It is almost as if Say's law, that supply generates its own demand, is suspended.

How do you explain this? Isn't governing from a consistent ideology, which so many here have recommended to us, not appropriate when the shit hits the fan?

Excuse my language.

The British Conservative Party certainly seems to have found the magic money tree.

Boris Johnson's Tory govt committed, in its budget barely two weeks ago, to about the same level of public investment the Tories insisted, two months earlier, would have "bankrupted" Britain under Labour.

Barely two weeks later they've committed to spend however much more it takes to prevent catastrophic contraction of the economy.

Even the stupidest Daily Mail readers are now asking WTF, then, was all that austerity about?

 

[bilby]

Has anyone else noticed that the predominantly conservative and libertarian ideology that governs us has taken more than a few hits from reality during the pandemic?

The champions of individuals taking responsibility for themselves to solve society's problems are recommending a lot of collective actions to reduce the impact of the virus.

The opponents of universal health care don't seem to be so adverse to it now.

The very same people who voted against the Keynesian stimulus in the Great Recession, and instead recommended austerity, seem to have embraced Keynesianism now. It is almost as if Say's law, that supply generates its own demand, is suspended.

How do you explain this? Isn't governing from a consistent ideology, which so many here have recommended to us, not appropriate when the shit hits the fan?

Excuse my language.

The British Conservative Party certainly seems to have found the magic money tree.

Boris Johnson's Tory govt committed, in its budget barely two weeks ago, to about the same level of public investment the Tories insisted, two months earlier, would have "bankrupted" Britain under Labour.

Barely two weeks later they've committed to spend however much more it takes to prevent catastrophic contraction of the economy.

Even the stupidest Daily Mail readers are now asking WTF, then, was all that austerity about?

"Austerity is the idea that the global financial crash of 2008 was caused by there being too many libraries in Wolverhampton." - Alexei Sayle.

 

[Jokodo]

Has anyone else noticed that the predominantly conservative and libertarian ideology that governs us has taken more than a few hits from reality during the pandemic?

Libertarian? What planet are you on?

Democrats: YoU cAn'T cAsH tHe ChEcK iF yOu DoN't LiKe SoCiAlIsM.

Republicans: YoU cAn'T cAsH tHe ChEcK iF hE's NoT yOuR pReSiDeNt.

Libertarians: Now give me back the rest of my money you stole.

The day libertarians stop using public roads for their commute, or indeed any kind of technology even partially based on publicly funded research, and the employers among them start employing exclusively home schooled folks (and provide a private plane for the commuters among their workforce - if *they* use public roads it's still cheating), will be the day libertarians can rightly talk of "my money you stole".

 

[Canard DuJour]

"Austerity is the idea that the global financial crash of 2008 was caused by there being too many libraries in Wolverhampton." - Alexei Sayle.

Brilliant

 

[ZiprHead]

Any bullshit excuse to suck up to big business and excuse their greed.

You're dodging the issue.

You're creating an issue out of thin air.

 

[Bomb#20]

"Austerity is the idea that the global financial crash of 2008 was caused by there being too many libraries in Wolverhampton." - Alexei Sayle.

Brilliant

Brilliant what? Brilliant stand-up comedy? Brilliant propaganda? Brilliant choir preaching? Brilliant use of ridicule to get people to dismiss your opponent's idea without thinking about his argument?

You guys know Sayle was using a strawman, don't you? No supporter of austerity argued or believed the global financial crash of 2008 was caused by there being too many libraries in Wolverhampton; and Sayle almost certainly knew that. He was simply lying about his ideological opponents -- most likely because his ideological allies eat that stuff up. Austerity is the idea that, irrespective of what caused the global financial crash of 2008, the global financial crash of 2008 left the economy in such a poor state that excess libraries in Wolverhampton were a luxury Britain could no longer afford. The austerity meme is future-oriented, not past-oriented.

 

[laughing dog]

Bullshit. They were given a huge windfall in the recent tax break. They used the money to buy back stock instead of saving for a rainy day. I say use their stock as collateral to get a loan. They need no more of our help.

Saying bullshit doesn't make the problem go away. Unions demand the money be used for salaries. Saving for a rainy day isn't an option.

Where do you get such crapola? The fact is the airlines used their surpluses to buy back stock instead of investing in new planes or lowering fares or any other option. The notion that "the unions" moderated their demands because those of those buy backs is, to the say least, naive and unfounded.

At best, your argument is unsubstantiated which is a polite way of saying "bullshit".

 

[Canard DuJour]

"Austerity is the idea that the global financial crash of 2008 was caused by there being too many libraries in Wolverhampton." - Alexei Sayle.

Brilliant

Brilliant what? Brilliant stand-up comedy? Brilliant propaganda? Brilliant choir preaching? Brilliant use of ridicule to get people to dismiss your opponent's idea without thinking about his argument?

Brilliant satire of the claim that the GFC and subsequent great recession were caused by excessive public spending.

You guys know Sayle was using a strawman, don't you? No supporter of austerity argued or believed the global financial crash of 2008 was caused by there being too many libraries in Wolverhampton;

The UK Conservative Party and right wing press argued relentlessly that the GFC and subsequent great recession were caused by excessive public spending.

and Sayle almost certainly knew that. He was simply lying about his ideological opponents -- most likely because his ideological allies eat that stuff up. Austerity is the idea that, irrespective of what caused the global financial crash of 2008, the global financial crash of 2008 left the economy in such a poor state that excess libraries in Wolverhampton were a luxury Britain could no longer afford. The austerity meme is future-oriented, not past-oriented.

On the contrary, anti-austerian arguments were widely put that

- the people who provide and rely on public sevices did not cause the crash and it was therefore unfair to punish them

- fiscal consolidation in a downturn would, if anything, hinder recovery anyway

- austerity was thus a political choice motivated by ideology, not economic necessity

The Tories therefore needed to justify their attack on the public sector by arguing that excessive public spending had caused the crash and was hindering recovery. Which they did. Relentlessy. In fact you appear to be making the latter claim yourself.

 

[Bomb#20]

Austerity is the idea that, irrespective of what caused the global financial crash of 2008, the global financial crash of 2008 left the economy in such a poor state that excess libraries in Wolverhampton were a luxury Britain could no longer afford. The austerity meme is future-oriented, not past-oriented.

On the contrary, anti-austerian arguments were widely put that

- the people who provide and rely on public sevices did not cause the crash and it was therefore unfair to punish them

Nahum: "Alms for the poor, alms for the poor..."

Lazar: "Here, Reb Nahum, is one kopek."

Nahum: "One kopek? Last week you gave me two kopeks."

Lazar: "I had a bad week."

Nahum: "So, if you had a bad week, why should I suffer?"

- fiscal consolidation in a downturn would, if anything, hinder recovery anyway

- austerity was thus a political choice motivated by ideology, not economic necessity

And?

The Tories therefore needed to justify their attack on the public sector by arguing that excessive public spending had caused the crash and was hindering recovery.

"Therefore ... and ..."?!? They therefore needed to argue it was hindering recovery, which of course they'd have done regardless since that's the whole point of austerity. But why on earth would they have needed to argue it caused the crash? What, to counter the "unfair to punish them" argument? It takes all of a two second Fiddler on the Roof quote to dispose of that, er, argument.

Which they did. Relentlessy.

The UK Conservative Party and right wing press argued relentlessly that the GFC and subsequent great recession were caused by excessive public spending.

Well, it's possible they argued this. If so, you should have no difficulty finding a citation.

But maybe you don't need to quote them, because we can safely rely on your word to verify that you didn't hear arguments that excessive public spending was hindering recovery and merely imagine you were hearing arguments that it was Wolverhampton and not Lehman Brothers et al. who caused the crash, because you're such an expert at remembering and correctly reproducing opponents' arguments, even after ten-odd years...

In fact you appear to be making the latter claim yourself.

... even though you can't remember and correctly reproduce an opponent's argument after ten seconds. No, in point of fact I do not appear to be claiming excessive public spending was hindering recovery. You might want to consider working on your reading comprehension problem.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

Has anyone else noticed that the predominantly conservative and libertarian ideology that governs us has taken more than a few hits from reality during the pandemic?

Libertarian? What planet are you on?

Democrats: YoU cAn'T cAsH tHe ChEcK iF yOu DoN't LiKe SoCiAlIsM.

Republicans: YoU cAn'T cAsH tHe ChEcK iF hE's NoT yOuR pReSiDeNt.

Libertarians: Now give me back the rest of my money you stole.

The day libertarians stop using public roads for their commute, or indeed any kind of technology even partially based on publicly funded research, and the employers among them start employing exclusively home schooled folks (and provide a private plane for the commuters among their workforce - if *they* use public roads it's still cheating), will be the day libertarians can rightly talk of "my money you stole".

Muh ROADS! My gods you actually went there.