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In defence of Trump

in the US, politics is not about a question with two sides having different ideas about how to solve it.
"hm, health care is a problem in that millions of people can't afford it and are getting sick and having their lives ruined by it. what should we do to fix this?"
Democrats: well we could think about expanding medicare, or introduce a public option, or reform to the medical industry... ooo or, we could give the insurance industry one of the biggest corporate hand jobs in the history of the human race and sell it to the public as making it so *everyone* has health insurance! bingo"
Republicans: LYNCH ALL THE NIGGERS

explain to me how you have a reasoned debate on a topic when those are your two options.

I think the problem is much deeper than that. The problem is that conservative quality media is dead. It went Fox news 100% in the 90'ies. In the good ol' days of the golden age of news we have both liberal and conservative quality and tabloid journalism. For whatever reason the conservatives weren't willing to pay to read quality news. So it died. While at the same time, quality news shifted generally towards the left. It's easy to see which news sources are which. Liberal media is full of bleeding heart liberal stories of how unfair life has treated some minority person, and articles of how some poor person "of colour" have managed to do something against the odds. Conservative papers focus on the stuff we're supposed to be afraid of. We are always under siege by some existential threat or another. That and to use a media bias political spectrum service.

Because the media landscape has shifted like this it defines are debates. There doesn't really exist a tool within society where which conservatives can sharpen their arguments or have their beliefs tested in a safe environment. Conservatives aren't going to read liberal media. So what are the stuck with? Facebook and tabloids. That's what informs them and why they behave so stupidly. And which explains the kind of dialogue you wrote.

I don't think conservatives are any dumber than liberals, on average. But we are social beings and if everybody around us say dumb shit, we are going to do dumb shit, most likely

BTW, I'm using the American terminology. In Europe our left are called socialists. In USA they are called liberals. The European socialists and the American liberals are the same kind of people.
 
Then you might ask, if they have so many supporters, then why not do their own hosting? Why not create their own infrastructure? Isn't that obvious? Because they can't. They don't have the money or resources. They are a marginalised group. No matter how crazy that sounds, it has to be true. Otherwise they wouldn't be at the mercy of cancel culture.

Honestly, it's hard to take your opinions on this seriously.
You seem to believe that a group that includes billionaires, top government officials, and folks like Sarah Palin and Ann Coulter are poor, marginalized underdogs.

What's with that?
Tom
 
The public discourse is overwhelmingly liberal, ie the stuff the media talks about, isn't relevant for lots of people. They are voting conservative. And voting blindly for bullshit reasons because they have no intellectual voices in their medias clarifying their thoughts.

What conservative public intellectuals do we have now? It's pretty much Jordan Petersen. That's it. Isn't there? For public intellectuals to be motivated to be public intellectuals, they need to get paid for their work. If they aren't, they're not going to put up with that bullshit. While the list of public intellectuals on the left is very very long. It's a lucrative business.

The fact that conservative political candidates are winning elections despite zero intellectual backing is pretty telling. It's not good for the future of mankind. Not for the left or right. I think it's the internet that is to blame. It's a shift in technology. To be a public intellectual before the Internet you needed another set of skills than to be one today. For whatever reason the left intellectuals are better at it. The Conservative intellectuals (they do exist) are failing to break through the barrier to be seen on the media stage. So the Right do nothing than read tabloids and send fake news to eachother. Which is what then will inform their voting. Which explains the list of Conservative candidates you posted.

public conservative intellectuals? George Will, David Frum, Bill Kristol, any economist taken seriously by the big t.v. networks in the States.

They're not household names as their Liberal equivalents are
That's the point you keep missing. They pretty much used to be the household names in intellectual conservatism (i.e. mostly wrong, but generally intellectually, if not morally, consistent). Since about the middle of Obama's first term they have been sidelined more and more by the racist xenophobes that have now pretty much taken over the GOP in the US.
 
Banning Trump from Twitter and Facebook is just admitting that our arguments suck.
Ok, now you're just basically trolling.

Or you are epically missing a lot of information/context. I'm done with you.

Ya, it's not like arguments help convince the uneducable of that which does not feel good to them. In other words, you can't talk someone out of being stupid.
Sometimes, "sit down, shut up, and let the adults in the room keep you safe from your own gang of fools", is all that is left to say.
How many times have you talked an infant out of crying? Sometimes you just have to let the babies cry until they are distracted by something else.
 
Then you might ask, if they have so many supporters, then why not do their own hosting? Why not create their own infrastructure? Isn't that obvious? Because they can't. They don't have the money or resources. They are a marginalised group. No matter how crazy that sounds, it has to be true. Otherwise they wouldn't be at the mercy of cancel culture.

Honestly, it's hard to take your opinions on this seriously.
You seem to believe that a group that includes billionaires, top government officials, and folks like Sarah Palin and Ann Coulter are poor, marginalized underdogs.

What's with that?
Tom

Does the group include that? I get the impression that QAnnon are just a bunch of incells sitting in their moms basement making videos. The top government officials claiming affiliation is just throwing them a bone for some support. I think these people have zero backing of any power. I think these people are disempowered. I'm not saying that conservatives as a whole are disempowered. But the QAnnon people are.
 
Then you might ask, if they have so many supporters, then why not do their own hosting? Why not create their own infrastructure? Isn't that obvious? Because they can't. They don't have the money or resources. They are a marginalised group. No matter how crazy that sounds, it has to be true. Otherwise they wouldn't be at the mercy of cancel culture.

Honestly, it's hard to take your opinions on this seriously.
You seem to believe that a group that includes billionaires, top government officials, and folks like Sarah Palin and Ann Coulter are poor, marginalized underdogs.

What's with that?
Tom

Does the group include that? I get the impression that QAnnon are just a bunch of incells sitting in their moms basement making videos. The top government officials claiming affiliation is just throwing them a bone for some support. I think these people have zero backing of any power. I think these people are disempowered. I'm not saying that conservatives as a whole are disempowered. But the QAnnon people are.

You changed the subject from Parler to Qanon.

Let me know when you decide who you're talking about.
Tom
 
Does Zoid realize that a good percentage of these Trump supporters voted for Obama? Many of them never were conservatives, other than their fear of having their guns taking away, or their desire for a Christian theocracy. Some of them simply lost their minds after becoming victims of a charismatic cult leader.

I don't think Zoid has a clue as to what's going on in the US. And, btw there are plenty of intellectual conservative outlets and writers in the US but the Trump supporters aren't interested in reading them. Trump should have been banned from Twitter a long time ago, since he broke so many of Twitter's rules, but because he was the president, Twitter allowed him to remain right up until he incited violence and encouraged insurrection against his own country. Imo, the real reason they left him on was probably due to trying to push up the price of their stock.

Free speech has limits. We Americans were all taught that in grammar school. Making threats of violence toward someone has always been a crime in the US, as. has been making terroristic threats, etc.

And, for fuck's sake, Zoid, stop claiming that what Twitter and the rest of social media did was an example of cancel culture. It's not. Since when is condemning someone for inciting violence the same thing as condemning someone for something minor they said or did in many cases, decades ago? I don't know if this thread was simply started as a way to get dramatic replies, but it sure looks that way to me. :rolleyes:
 
I don't think Zoid has a clue as to what's going on in the US.

Well, it's not hard to understand why Zoid would be confused. Our president triumphantly proclaimed that he could shoot anybody he wants on 5th Ave and not lose any supporters.

It would be confusing to a member of a high quality culture like Denmark.
Tom
 
Speaking of trump being banned on twitter. I am about to get banned on russian forum for calling Trump motherfucker.
Moderator is a russian trumper in US and overall POS who gives warning for punctuation errors ( of course only to people who don't agree with him)
 
Speaking of trump being banned on twitter. I am about to get banned on russian forum for calling Trump motherfucker.
Moderator is a russian trumper in US and overall POS who gives warning for punctuation errors ( of course only to people who don't not agree with him)

So a Russian is accusing you of being a Russian troll.

Dammit! You just derailed me.
 
Speaking of trump being banned on twitter. I am about to get banned on russian forum for calling Trump motherfucker.
Moderator is a russian trumper in US and overall POS who gives warning for punctuation errors ( of course only to people who don't not agree with him)

So a Russian is accusing you of being a Russian troll.

Dammit! You just derailed me.
I mean he gave me another warning for insulting member of the government. Apparently it's a thing, even though Trump is not part of russian government....yet :)

Now I am waiting for Jan 21, so I can start insulting trump profusely.
 
warning for punctuation errors

Sounds like a GREAT idea to me...

Now I am waiting for Jan 21, so I can start insulting trump profusely.

Is the POS moderator retiring then? And Trump won't yet be part of Russian government?
No, POS moderator is not retiring. My only hope he gets COVID (he is in California)
And you can't exclude anything, even Trump getting into Russian politics :)
 
Sounds like a GREAT idea to me...



Is the POS moderator retiring then? And Trump won't yet be part of Russian government?
No, POS moderator is not retiring. My only hope he gets COVID (he is in California)
And you can't exclude anything

Then there's a chance for warnings for punctuation errors?

even Trump getting into Russian politics :)

"Even" Trump getting into Russian politics? Seems like a natural fit to me.
Putin needs experienced-yet-easily-manipulated salesmen to spread manure on his ideological plantings in the West. The perfect candidate should be an effective salesman, but too stupid to ever present a threat to Pootey Power. Shouldn't be hard for Uncle Vlad to assemble a few people to flatter Trump and get him in line... I hear people love him over there.
 
Then there's a chance for warnings for punctuation errors?
Yes, there are warnings and bans for everything. Rules are ridiculously long and frankly ridiculous there.
even Trump getting into Russian politics :)

"Even" Trump getting into Russian politics? Seems like a natural fit to me.
Putin needs experienced-yet-easily-manipulated salesmen to spread manure on his ideological plantings in the West.
Shouldn't be hard for Uncle Vlad to assemble a few people to flatter Trump and get him in line...
No thanks, keep him :)
 
Yes, there are warnings and bans for everything. Rules are ridiculously long and frankly ridiculous there.

Who's talking about there? I couldn't care less about there, I don't have to read stuff there.
I mean here!
 
Speaking of trump being banned on twitter. I am about to get banned on russian forum for calling Trump motherfucker.
Moderator is a russian trumper in US and overall POS who gives warning for punctuation errors ( of course only to people who don't agree with him)

I thought cancel culture was a purely American phenomenon.
 
"Even" Trump getting into Russian politics? Seems like a natural fit to me.
Meh. No matter how well briefed on what Putin wants him to say, once the mic is live, all bets are off. "Again, idiot, you say the quiet parts out loud! Gods dem even Moose and Squirrel not this much trouble!"

No, if Trump flees to Russia, he'll get an office in the back. Hot and cold running sycophants, all the conservative tv he can eat, and absolutely no output.
The only benefit to Putin would be that Vlad could start openly using some intel without compromising the actual source. They'll just pretend Trump brought it with him.
"My good friend Donald tells me you have a listening post in Flyspeckistan disguised as a used rug dealership."
"No, he didn't, we never told HIM about it."
"Well, someone tells him, and he tells me. Remove it or we will."
"Alright...jeez."
 
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