Is a Hidden God the Same as No God?

[Jarhyn]

What would it even mean to "worship" such a "God"?

To seek to understand all structure that may be found within reality, and understand such things through their expressions?

To attempt to encode true language about the thing that is nature?

So, doing science and using reason and logic amid observations.

 

[Elixir]

I think that oftentimes, there is a mind virus involved, a big fat gross case of "organized religion", but conspiracy theorists can easily be atheists, as can incels.

Nah. I reject the mind virus argument and substitute my own!
What appears organized, only reflects the ubiquity of the human tendency to cling to what we think we know. Nobody is immune, but at least scientific methodology provides a means of minimizing its effects, whereas religion amplifies it.

 

[ideologyhunter]

Man has always found patterns, balances, and intricate mechanisms in nature -- and then assumed there must be agency behind them. But we now understand what causes eclipses, moon phases, comets, planetary orbits, rainbows, salt crystals, parallel ripples in seabed sand, the Northern Lights, and wonders of nature like the 1931 version of Greta Garbo. No one today would have to create a designer who, with an impulse of creation, made those things appear. If you understand moon phases, you'd laugh at a supernatural explanation. (I could almost see a religion based on Garbo, tho'.) Yet the pre-scientific faiths persist, because the story elements are compelling. (Unless you focus on the crazy parts, as I do.) There's going to be a demand for 'em for generations to come, but perhaps a tapering-off demand.

 

[unapologetic]

Define atheist? I list the personality traits...

Personality traits have nothing to do with it.
Would someone with better language skills than I, please explain these terms to SIB:

Theist =
Atheist =
Gnostic =
Agnostic =

SIB, after you have digested these terms, please plot yourself on the following graph. then update your profile.
Your comments clearly show you to be a believer. That's OK. Believers can post here. But I hate liars.

 

[unapologetic]

How would an atheist with those traits react when challenged?

We are challenged every single day. We are surrounded by brainwashed sheep. That is why we act so angry. (we don't start angry)
You would feel the same if you were a christian living in an is-lame-ick country.

I am simple minded, I don't understand blind faith.

That's ironic. You keep espousing your blind faith.

The one Hallmark of the archetype of "believer" is that it almost universally opens them up to some form of external control.

That is the purpose of religion. The first four 'commandments' are about loyalty/obedience to the cult.

 

[Jarhyn]

You're missing gnostic Agnostic: someone who knows that we cannot know whether a god exists.

 

[Jarhyn]

The one Hallmark of the archetype of "believer" is that it almost universally opens them up to some form of external control.

That is the purpose of religion. The first four 'commandments' are about loyalty/obedience to the cult.

I would disagree. That is A purpose of religion. Often enough it is about teaching good reasons for self-discipline, and holding those solid against the ravages of time.

Education used to be done in a temple and what you got at a temple was an education (or a sexually transmitted disease, or both).

Today, academia has supplanted the church as a source of knowledge, and of far better knowledge based on sounder principles, but we operate much with the same decorum and structures of discussion, debate, and defense of thesis in new ways as churches did in the old ways.

 

[unapologetic]

Often enough it is about teaching good reasons for self-discipline,

Under threat of eternal damnation? Sorry, It's always about control. External-discipline. I practice self-discipline without a god looking over my shoulder. What your cult teaches is that you are too weak to control yourself, you need the cult to control you. (with god's help)

 

[Jarhyn]

Often enough it is about teaching good reasons for self-discipline,

Under threat of eternal damnation? Sorry, It's always about control. External-discipline. I practice self-discipline without a god looking over my shoulder. What your cult teaches is that you are too weak to control yourself, you need the cult to control you. (with god's help)

The threat of eternal damnation came later, I think?

The religion was, for many, a handy tool to keep the cultural philosophy alive, and some bad actors parasitized the phenomena since it had no resistance to bad action.

It was like proto-academia with a parasite vulnerability.

 

[unapologetic]

The threat of eternal damnation came later, I think?

Irrelevant.
The current state is that the christian cult is running a heaven/hell protection racket. Not serving humanity.

 

[ideologyhunter]

Most Christians I know don't focus on the hell part. They have a fuzzy feel-good sense of being in a club that really pays benefits to members. If they're old enough to have been through multiple deaths in their families, they believe there will be some big reunion in the next life, and that their loved ones are in heaven, waiting for them. The ones who are big on the hell teachings tend to be extremist on all the teachings: literalism, Biblical morality point for point, the need for a "personal relationship with Jesus Christ", whatever the hell that really means. Those are also the folks who would hardly appreciate my humor, so I don't discuss faith with them, and I may have a faulty sense of their priorities. In today's America, they also skew toward Trumpism, one additional and huge reason I don't have much to say to them. Dogs? Sure. Favorite coffee shop? Let's talk. Trump or Jesus? No, dawg. I'm sure we'd eye each other like we were encountering aliens.
And yes, a hidden god either is no god or just as well might be nonexistent. I'm going with no god.

 

[Jarhyn]

The threat of eternal damnation came later, I think?

Irrelevant.
The current state is that the christian cult is running a heaven/hell protection racket. Not serving humanity.

The current state of the Christian cult does not speak to "religion" as a whole, either today OR throughout history.

It did and still does have function in society even if that function is now so overrun with parasites it is in many places worse than the disease of ignorance that it first helped treat.

 

[Swammerdami]

... wonders of nature like the 1931 version of Greta Garbo. ... (I could almost see a religion based on Garbo, tho'.)

We may need to revoke my atheist card if goddess worship is disallowed. But I'm afraid we may have another religious war on our hands. I am a devout Marilynist.

Googling "Goddess Alexandra Snow" will reveal another opportunity for goddess worship. But I'm afraid Goddess Snow -- despite her magnificence -- is a vengeful deity, attracting followers in need of punishment.