Is Christian authoritarianism here to stay?

[southernhybrid]

The link is just an opinion piece but I'd like to hear what others think regarding the claim. If you can, I suggest that you read the entire piece. I'm just copying a few bits below.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/16/opinion/trump-religion-authoritarianism.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage

Will President-elect Joe Biden’s victory force America’s Christian nationalists to rethink the unholy alliance that powered Donald Trump’s four-year tour as one of the nation’s most dangerous presidents? Don’t count on it.

The 2020 election is proof that religious authoritarianism is here to stay, and the early signs now indicate that the movement seems determined to reinterpret defeat at the top of the ticket as evidence of persecution and of its own righteousness. With or without Mr. Trump, they will remain committed to the illiberal politics that the president has so ably embodied.

In their responses to the election outcome, some prominent religious right leaders have enabled or remained true to the false Trumpian line of election fraud. Michele Bachmann, the former Minnesota congresswoman and 2012 presidential candidate, said, “Smash the delusion, Father, of Joe Biden is our president. He is not.” In Crisis Magazine, a conservative Catholic publication, Richard C. Antall likened media reporting on the Biden-Harris ticket’s victory to a “coup d’état.” Mat Staver, chairman and founder of Liberty Counsel, added, “What we are witnessing only happens in communist or repressive regimes. We must not allow this fraud to happen in America.”

Even as prominent Republican figures like George W. Bush and Mitt Romney slowly tried to nudge Mr. Trump toward the exit, leaders of the religious right continued to man the barricades. The conservative speaker and Falkirk Center fellow David Harris, Jr. put it this way:

If you’re a believer, and you believe God appointed Donald J. Trump to run this country, to lead this country, and you believe as I do that he will be re-elected the President of the United States, then friends, you’ve got to guard your heart, you’ve got to guard your peace. Right now we are at war.

After processing their disappointment, Christian nationalists may come around to the reality of Joe Biden’s victory. There is no indication, however, that this will temper their apocalyptic vision, according to which one side of the American political divide represents unmitigated evil. During a Nov. 11 virtual prayer gathering organized by the Family Research Council, one of the key speakers cast the election as the consequence of “the whole godless ideology that’s wanted to swallow our homes, destroy our marriages, throw our children into rivers of confusion.” Jim Garlow, an evangelical pastor whose Well Versed Ministry has as its stated goal, “Bringing biblical principles of governance to governmental leaders,” asserted that Mr. Biden and Ms. Harris are at the helm of an “ideology” that is “anti-Christ, anti-Biblical to its core.”

I noticed that this same woman has written on this subject numerous times over the past year or two. I've always thought it was a bit ironic that these Christian extremists believe that god chose Trump to lead them. If I still embraced the religion of my childhood, I'd be convinced that Trump was the anti-Christ. But no! We godless people are the ones who are hurting America. After all, programs that help the poor, older adults, and the sick certainly couldn't be Christian values. /s Tolerance, diversity and acceptance of those who are different from ourselves is ruining the country according to these extremists.

Anyway, basically the idea is that these extreme Christians are organized enough to turn the country into something resembling a theocracy, or at the very least make it harder for people with different view points, beliefs or lifestyles to be able to live their lives without being condemned or worse.

Is this writer over reacting? Should we fear this possibility? These Christians are a minority now, but they are far more organized than those of us who are non believers or have more liberal theistic beliefs. If this is something to be concerned about, how do the rest of us stop it? Or do you think the writer is overly worried, and this movement of crazy Christians will gradually fade away, as evangelicals and other extremist groups of Christians are becoming fewer in numbers? I'm not really sure what's going to happen after the worst president is gone. I'm not sure what I think about this myself, but it's certainly something to consider. What you y'all think?

 

[GenesisNemesis]

They have a shit ton of money and I don't see them running out of it any time soon.

 

[Elixir]

They have a shit ton of money and I don't see them running out of it any time soon.

It's not like they're going actually SPEND their god-given money on propping up their false idol. No, they spend it on fleecing the rubes into spending their money to do that.

 

[Keith&Co.]

And you don't have to win every time for this to continue. Or win at all in the future. Trump's tenure will become the 'good old days' they'll try to recapture for a good while. "And this time we'll put NINE godly judges on the bench!"

 

[Terrell]

I think so, at least for now. They got 3 appointments on SCOTUS, some of this should play out in the next decade or so. We'll see what laws that the Red States pass, for the purposes of getting SCOTUS rulings to overturn prior rulings. What will happen to Griswold, Baird, Lawrence, Obergefell, Barnette, or other decisions regarding individual rights; where they're incompatible with the whims of the Christian Nationalists/Dominionists?

 

[Politesse]

Their numbers are thinning.

 

[southernhybrid]

Their numbers are thinning.

Yes! That is why I'm not quite as worried as the writer of the article, but her point is that they are extremely well organized, which she feels is a problem. Atheists and liberal believers aren't very organized. Well, for one thing, we rarely agree on much of anything so that makes it difficult.

Do you think that they are becoming more radical because their numbers are thinning?

( I meant to put this in the general political forum, so if a mod feels it needs to be moved, that's fine. )

 

[Keith&Co.]

Their numbers are thinning.

Yeah, but i grew up in North Mormon. Mormons are rather thin on the ground in Utah, but they carefully hold the high ground, a force muliplier on their influence.
Thinning numbers isn't as important as freeing up countering votes.

 

[Politesse]

Their numbers are thinning.

Yes! That is why I'm not quite as worried as the writer of the article, but her point is that they are extremely well organized, which she feels is a problem. Atheists and liberal believers aren't very organized. Well, for one thing, we rarely agree on much of anything so that makes it difficult.

Do you think that they are becoming more radical because their numbers are thinning?

( I meant to put this in the general political forum, so if a mod feels it needs to be moved, that's fine. )

Maybe, but political radicalization is also a common feature of American society generally over the past decade, so it may just be a feature of our times. I certainly see the potential for their rhetoric becoming more extreme in the future, if they come to feel there is little hope and therefore little necessity of recruiting people from the mainstream discourse.

 

[repoman]

Christianity can often cut strongly against nationalism and racism, despite being authoritarian in many other ways like with LGBT issues.

The nutcase Pastor Steven Anderson for example

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Christianity has always been authoritarian. Most devout christians are absolute hypocrites who use their religious label merely as a license to further their own selfish interests. Those things that are good about christianity are good even without christianity and have always been good, no christianity needed.

As I've said before, the liberals are winning and have been winning for centuries, and will continue to win for centuries more. All those liberal victories is what gives these hypocrites a voice.

So don't hate or fear them, but certainly protect yourself from them. Maybe with time they will grow up too.

 

[Angry Floof]

I don't know what's going to happen with the current authoritarian trend in Christianity in the US, but whatever happens, Christianity will always, always contain the seeds that give rise to fascist societies, whether that begins with a Christian leader or a non-Christian who rides the wave to power (like Trump). And Biden's win is no guarantee that Christian authoritarianism will die down. It will more likely grow louder and more violent and more willing to destroy democracy and secular society.

As long as children and ignorant adults are taught to obey authority on pain of punishment, that questioning is a sin that will land you in hell or at the very least make you a bad human, that ancient texts are written by God hisownself and contain absolute truths, that the world works according to a narrow, rigid framework of us vs. them tribalism and abusive daddy figure atop a hierarchy, and that all this bullshit is somehow morally superior to the rest of the world, you will have the seeds of fascism ready to sprout when the wider society is no longer peaceful or otherwise keeping religion in check.

 

[ZiprHead]

I don't know what's going to happen with the current authoritarian trend in Christianity in the US, but whatever happens, Christianity will always, always contain the seeds that give rise to fascist societies, whether that begins with a Christian leader or a non-Christian who rides the wave to power (like Trump). And Biden's win is no guarantee that Christian authoritarianism will die down. It will more likely grow louder and more violent and more willing to destroy democracy and secular society.

As long as children and ignorant adults are taught to obey authority on pain of punishment, that questioning is a sin that will land you in hell or at the very least make you a bad human, that ancient texts are written by God hisownself and contain absolute truths, that the world works according to a narrow, rigid framework of us vs. them tribalism and abusive daddy figure atop a hierarchy, and that all this bullshit is somehow morally superior to the rest of the world, you will have the seeds of fascism ready to sprout when the wider society is no longer peaceful or otherwise keeping religion in check.

I like to think of it as their last gasp at trying to remain relevant. Their numbers are dropping like rocks down the side of a mountain during an avalanche while their mouths have only gotten bigger. I hope I'm right.

 

[Angry Floof]

I don't know what's going to happen with the current authoritarian trend in Christianity in the US, but whatever happens, Christianity will always, always contain the seeds that give rise to fascist societies, whether that begins with a Christian leader or a non-Christian who rides the wave to power (like Trump). And Biden's win is no guarantee that Christian authoritarianism will die down. It will more likely grow louder and more violent and more willing to destroy democracy and secular society.

As long as children and ignorant adults are taught to obey authority on pain of punishment, that questioning is a sin that will land you in hell or at the very least make you a bad human, that ancient texts are written by God hisownself and contain absolute truths, that the world works according to a narrow, rigid framework of us vs. them tribalism and abusive daddy figure atop a hierarchy, and that all this bullshit is somehow morally superior to the rest of the world, you will have the seeds of fascism ready to sprout when the wider society is no longer peaceful or otherwise keeping religion in check.

I like to think of it as their last gasp at trying to remain relevant. Their numbers are dropping like rocks down the side of a mountain during an avalanche while their mouths have only gotten bigger. I hope I'm right.

I hope you're right, too.

 

[ideologyhunter]

They own SCOTUS and are aligned with a party that is genius at ruling from a minority position.

 

[southernhybrid]

They own SCOTUS and are aligned with a party that is genius at ruling from a minority position.

That is what mostly concerns me. Regardless of how small their numbers are, they have become very powerful. SCOTUS is probably the best example, but think of how Trump has used evangelicals into believing him when he makes false claims about the recent election. And, it's not just SCOTUS that is now full of ultra conservative Christian judges. I think over 200 new judges have been appointed during Trump's presidency. These are life long appointments, so we should all be concerned to some extent.

They have done a masterful job of painting Democrats as socialists who want to take their rights away. When in fact, it's these Christian conservatives who want to take the rights away from various minority groups who have finally been obtaining the rights that they deserve. I doubt we will have a full fledged theocratic government, but we may be in danger of these people interfering and destroying the rights that have recently been established.

 

[repoman]

It is a bit more complicated, even non racist Christians feel like these left wing political concepts are a mental idol that is worshipped instead of God and that we are all God's children. They often ignore the mental idol of moderately regulated capitalism and many are ok with hypercapitalism.

Seems to be the opposite of 1970s style liberation theology.

 

[prideandfall]

What you y'all think?

20, 25 years ago i would have said that yes it's a looming threat - but i'll be honest, i've been quite surprised at how the US cultural zeitgeist has generally come to be indifferent to a lot of christian panic hot button issues.
the mainstream acceptance of homosexuality has been surprisingly robust, as well as backing down from the vilification of single women (and mothers) - though not entirely complete, compared to the mid-late 90s the change in the broad US cultural attitude towards things like that is astounding.

i'd put christianity now like a recurring cancer - it was a big threat at one time, we mostly beat it down, and yes the tumor hasn't totally gone away and every so often we get sick again and have to go through some more chemo and it's a nightmare, but it hasn't metastasized like we feared it could, and by and large we're surviving it alright.

 

[prideandfall]

aligned with a party that is genius at ruling from a minority position.

are they though? i don't know...
i don't think that having a temper tantrum and refusing to participate in the act of governance is really 'genius' so much as it is "effective because the democrats are collectively a pack of limp dick cucks who take it up the ass at every possible opportunity."

is there a case to be made that republicans are effective at strategic politicking? i mean, at least from an efficacy standpoint? or it is simply that their flailing works because the only other political party in the US is so pathetic?

 

[Politesse]

aligned with a party that is genius at ruling from a minority position.

are they though? i don't know...
i don't think that having a temper tantrum and refusing to participate in the act of governance is really 'genius' so much as it is "effective because the democrats are collectively a pack of limp dick cucks who take it up the ass at every possible opportunity."

is there a case to be made that republicans are effective at strategic politicking? i mean, at least from an efficacy standpoint? or it is simply that their flailing works because the only other political party in the US is so pathetic?

Well, they still occupy positions of considerable power sixteen years after the lost numerical majority, they must be doing something right. I would see the effective disarmament of the opposition party as part of their long-term strategy.

Though the Party business is something of a smokescreen anyway, as is the exploitation of religious biases to maintain interest in the scuffle. The reality of the matter is a nearly unchallenged plutocracy that neither Party has a serious interest in acknowledging, let alone dismantling. What good would it do the Democratic leadership to actually dismantle the base of Republican power in the national government? They would then be faced with the option of either enacting leftist legislation that would hurt their own bottom line as individuals, or watching their own party split down the middle. They will always say "stop" before things go too far and prevent the RNC from being decimated, as long as they have any power to do so. A loyal opposition is a powerful thing.