Is there a scientific theory that explains the quality of pain in terms of the physical universe?

[DBT]

The brain both responds and reacts to information acquired by its senses. That being the evolved function of a brain as an information processor. The ability to consciously move your arm at will requires information input and processing, this being the function of a brain, and without it there are no consciously willed actions, decisions, thoughts, feelings or anything else.

 

[untermensche]

The brain both responds and reacts to information acquired by its senses. That being the evolved function of a brain as an information processor. The ability to consciously move your arm at will requires information input and processing, this being the function of a brain, and without it there are no consciously willed actions, decisions, thoughts, feelings or anything else.

You can't show me any behavior of the brain that is not a reflexive reaction.

But coherent thoughts cannot be put together by a reflex.

The thing that has a thought knows it is having the thought and it has that thought within the milieu of a lifetime of experiences.

 

[fromderinside]

You can't show me any behavior of the brain that is not a reflexive reaction.

But coherent thoughts cannot be put together by a reflex.

The thing that has a thought knows it is having the thought and it has that thought within the milieu of a lifetime of experiences.

Wrong. Well with you that's not true since you can't be shown anything.

Wrong again. At the simplest level all coherent thought is the product of neuron work which is entirely reflexive, dependent on mechanics of nerve conduction. However this is not reflex in the classical sense of knee jerk ideas.

Most things going on in the brain are complex with interactions up and down tracts, across tracts, and among tracts. Almost no attending or awereness related nervous activity is reflex activity. If, in the seventies if you you had read operant and respondent conditioning material ( Operant conditioning  Classical conditioning you'd have actually learned something about behavior. Of course one needs to also study relevant sensory and learning neuroscience to understand how the brain gets it done.

 

[untermensche]

You can't show me any behavior of the brain that is not a reflexive reaction.

But coherent thoughts cannot be put together by a reflex.

The thing that has a thought knows it is having the thought and it has that thought within the milieu of a lifetime of experiences.

Wrong. Well with you that's not true since you can't be shown anything.

Wrong again. At the simplest level all coherent thought is the product of neuron work which is entirely reflexive, dependent on mechanics of nerve conduction. However this is not reflex in the classical sense of knee jerk ideas.

Most things going on in the brain are complex with interactions up and down tracts, across tracts, and among tracts. Almost no attending or awereness related nervous activity is reflex activity. If, in the seventies if you you had read operant and respondent conditioning material ( Operant conditioning  Classical conditioning you'd have actually learned something about behavior. Of course one needs to also study relevant sensory and learning neuroscience to understand how the brain gets it done.

You don't have the slightest clue what a thought is or how one could possibly be experienced.

You have nothing but ignorant pretension.

You pretend to know things.

While I know things.

Like: I must do something with my mind to make my arm move as I desire.

And: Coherent thoughts put together are no reflex.

Contemplation is the antithesis to reflex.

The mind contemplates.

The brain is reflexive.

 

[DBT]

The brain both responds and reacts to information acquired by its senses. That being the evolved function of a brain as an information processor. The ability to consciously move your arm at will requires information input and processing, this being the function of a brain, and without it there are no consciously willed actions, decisions, thoughts, feelings or anything else.

You can't show me any behavior of the brain that is not a reflexive reaction.

But coherent thoughts cannot be put together by a reflex.

The thing that has a thought knows it is having the thought and it has that thought within the milieu of a lifetime of experiences.

You are falsely stating 'reflex' in an instance where the ability to respond in highly complex ways is not a case of reflex but information processing and decision making based on set of criteria. You use your claim of 'reflex' in an attempt to justify your completely inexplicable autonomy of mind claim.

 

[fromderinside]

You don't have the slightest clue what a thought is or how one could possibly be experienced.

You have nothing but ignorant pretension.

At least I have a track record.
Self-administration of D-Ala2-Met-enkephalinamide at hypothalamic self-stimulation sites. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7378834

which has lead to articles by others such as Mind-Wandering With and Without Intention https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5004739/


in 2016


When you have done anything near what I did about 40 years ago you can spout such trash as you just did. Until then I'd appreciate that you leave your piss for people like The Donald.

I'd rather you stick to statements for which you can publicly find reference for support. Hand waving about experience with patients is all well and good. Without solid supporting information, however, they are just statements by twiddle dum about some imaginary tea party. Please try to contribute rather than pontificate sir.

 

[untermensche]

You don't have the slightest clue what a thought is or how one could possibly be experienced.

You have nothing but ignorant pretension.

At least I have a track record.
Self-administration of D-Ala2-Met-enkephalinamide at hypothalamic self-stimulation sites. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7378834

That study is nothing but sick torture of rats.

It explains absolutely nothing about anything.

You have a track record of shitting all over the place and rolling in the shit.

You have a track record of not being able to put together a coherent thought.

The day you explain one thing in plain language is the first day you will have use.

 

[DBT]

Lighten up Mr Untermesche.

 

[untermensche]

Lighten up Mr Untermesche.

Torturing rats for no reason is the real cruelty here.

 

[fromderinside]

Hail antivivisectionist untermenche the spouter. View his conquests and tremble.

Here. Have a stone.

It's the only thing you would have to defend yourself if it weren't for those like pre-human ancestors devising ways to combine stone and wood into spears arrows and bows, Egyptian surgeons and engineers, Muslim scientists, Italian artists and thinkers, French, German, English, Chines, and Russian scientists, engineers, architects, and entrepreneurs, all including vivisection to improve and prove their conjectures.. it's called mo=del experimentation. Such sets the stage so you and your lot could charter ships to sail here so you could spout shit like that with impunity.

Grow up.

Your stuff is chanting, It's certainly not coherent anything.

Not personal at all. Based on evidence for all to see.

 

[untermensche]

I have nothing to defend myself from.

I do not torture animals for no good reason.

I understand there is reflexive activity and even reflexive movement.

When you fall your arm reflexively extends out. In the elderly it results in a lot of broken wrists.

But there is calm calculated premeditated voluntary movement too.

To confuse one with the other is not explanation of either.

 

[fromderinside]

A chant repeated adds nothing. It's still just a chant.

Try adding to the discussion for once.

 

[untermensche]

A chant repeated adds nothing. It's still just a chant.

Try adding to the discussion for once.

Calling clear experience a "chant" shows how lost some are.

The science has to explain experience. Not pretend it isn't there.

Science has to explain how the mind moves the arm. Not pretend it doesn't.

 

[DBT]

You have a Mantra that you chant. That much is clear and undeniable. Your chant ''I can lift my arm at will, therefore autonomy of mind'' while ignoring the underlying mechanisms and means for your experience.....is not so clear. Not clear at all. An invalid argument in fact.

 

[untermensche]

I state clear experience.

You for some insane reason call it a mantra.

And I state facts.

I must do something with my mind to make the arm move.

That is what science needs to explain.

Not pretend it isn't happening.

You have no clue what the underlying mechanisms are or what is happening when I do that something with my mind.

You can follow the command once given but where it comes from you cannot explain.

 

[fromderinside]

A person's reported experience is actually called a phenomenon. Repeating a phenomenon, saying it over and over, soon becomes a mantra.

You state your view of what you think you do and no more.

First you need operationally - a set of operations that are tied to verified observations - define mind. Then, perhaps, you'll be on track for doing more.

Science doesn't explain. Scientists conduct repeatable experiments based on verified observations to produce findings that actually can be used to explain verified observations.

The only pretending is your chanting.

I have many clues of the underlying mechanisms and what is happening when one is doing something.

You have chanted pablum.

 

[untermensche]

A person reports experienced phenomena.

The report is not the phenomena. It describes the phenomena.

The clear repeated experience is the arm will not move unless and until it is commanded to move.

The phenomena is the command. Not the reports about it.

And it is a phenomena in need of explanation.

Pretending it does not need to be explained or that it has been explained is ignorant stupidity.

 

[DBT]

I state clear experience.

You for some insane reason call it a mantra.

And I state facts.

I must do something with my mind to make the arm move.

That is what science needs to explain.

Not pretend it isn't happening.

You have no clue what the underlying mechanisms are or what is happening when I do that something with my mind.

You can follow the command once given but where it comes from you cannot explain.

Nobody is denying the fact that you claim your 'clear experience'

Or that you have the experience of conscious agency.

That is not the issue.

The issue is that you completely deny the underlying mechanisms and means of your 'clear experience'

 

[fromderinside]

Thanks for repeating to untermenche this is a science forum, one that rewards those who report research results arising from independent observation of events.

 

[untermensche]

I state clear experience.

You for some insane reason call it a mantra.

And I state facts.

I must do something with my mind to make the arm move.

That is what science needs to explain.

Not pretend it isn't happening.

You have no clue what the underlying mechanisms are or what is happening when I do that something with my mind.

You can follow the command once given but where it comes from you cannot explain.

Nobody is denying the fact that you claim your 'clear experience'

Or that you have the experience of conscious agency.

That is not the issue.

The issue is that you completely deny the underlying mechanisms and means of your 'clear experience'

You have no understanding of any underlying mechanisms for the initiation of voluntary motion.

The mantra here is "underlying mechanisms, underlying mechanisms, underlying mechanisms, underlying mechanisms..."

Without any known mechanism in mind.

This is no further than the experiential stage.

But it is the experience of doing something with the mind that needs to be explained and understood.

Not shoved under the rug in a pretense that there is some understanding of the initiation of conscious willed voluntary movement.