Libertarians set up freedom checkpoints

[Jimmy Higgins]

Hey, new fun on the cuckoo ranch, it seems that the various wacko groups can’t play nice together. One comes with a club name of Oath Keepers...
http://gawker.com/nevada-ranch-militias-turn-against-each-other-over-dron-1570140614


Who are some of these people…
http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2012/...pers-is-last-line-of-defense-against-tyranny/

The Tea Party Nation, one of the more extreme factions of the Tea Party movement, has dipped deeper into the conspiratorial waters of antigovernment lore, most recently promoting the Oath Keepers and other antigovernment “Patriots” as the last line of defense for Americans increasingly confronted with “a government verging on evil.”

One of the more extreme factions of the Tea Party? That isn't a good sign!

Alright, we'll call them anti-government loonies. The confusion occurs when the entire right-wing blogosphere, radio, and media empires ramp up the support for the loon bags. Sure, none of them really are umm... true libertarians, but then again it may be easy to confuse them for libertarians when so many make the claim that is what they are.

Might be time for libertarianism to get a recalibration. Of course, I think the whole libertarianism thing is ridiculous as it is like herding cats.. ie, the Ron Paul Exclusion principal: It is only possible to know whether two people claim to be libertarians or if their political ideals are congruent, but never both at the same time.

 

[funinspace]

Hey, new fun on the cuckoo ranch, it seems that the various wacko groups can’t play nice together. One comes with a club name of Oath Keepers...
http://gawker.com/nevada-ranch-militias-turn-against-each-other-over-dron-1570140614


Who are some of these people…
http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2012/...pers-is-last-line-of-defense-against-tyranny/

The Tea Party Nation, one of the more extreme factions of the Tea Party movement, has dipped deeper into the conspiratorial waters of antigovernment lore, most recently promoting the Oath Keepers and other antigovernment “Patriots” as the last line of defense for Americans increasingly confronted with “a government verging on evil.”

One of the more extreme factions of the Tea Party? That isn't a good sign!

Alright, we'll call them anti-government loonies. The confusion occurs when the entire right-wing blogosphere, radio, and media empires ramp up the support for the loon bags. Sure, none of them really are umm... true libertarians, but then again it may be easy to confuse them for libertarians when so many make the claim that is what they are.

Might be time for libertarianism to get a recalibration. Of course, I think the whole libertarianism thing is ridiculous as it is like herding cats.. ie, the Ron Paul Exclusion principal: It is only possible to know whether two people claim to be libertarians or if their political ideals are congruent, but never both at the same time.

When the ELF blew up a lab, or was spiking tree’s, would you expect the headline: "Progressives committed another environmental terrorist attack"?

Are teabaggers trying to get candidates elected from within the GOP or the LP?

Why did you mention the " right-wing blogosphere, radio, and media empires"? Oh, cuz maybe the term right winger fits pretty well?

Like I already said, sure there is some cross over, that is true with all political labels...no label has purity.

 

[dismal]

Might be time for libertarianism to get a recalibration. Of course, I think the whole libertarianism thing is ridiculous as it is like herding cats.. ie, the Ron Paul Exclusion principal: It is only possible to know whether two people claim to be libertarians or if their political ideals are congruent, but never both at the same time.

Which raises the question: if it's not possible for anyone to actually be a libertarian, why do we have so many threads about them here?

 

[Underseer]

A growing number of Bunkerville residents want to see the armed militiamen guarding rancher Cliven Bundy leave Nevada, according to a letter from Rep. Steven Horsford, D-Nev., to Clark County Sheriff Doug Gillespie.

Horsford, whose congressional district includes Bunkerville, wrote that his constituents are concerned about Bundy supporters carrying weapons near local churches, schools and elsewhere...

Really? They are afraid of patriots using guns to Defend Our Freedom? When did Nevada become communist? Why do they hate our freedoms? And more importantly, why do they want to take all of our guns away? [/conservolibertarian]

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Might be time for libertarianism to get a recalibration. Of course, I think the whole libertarianism thing is ridiculous as it is like herding cats.. ie, the Ron Paul Exclusion principal: It is only possible to know whether two people claim to be libertarians or if their political ideals are congruent, but never both at the same time.

Which raises the question: if it's not possible for anyone to actually be a libertarian, why do we have so many threads about them here?

You answered your own question. It is possible to be a libertarian, but it seems much harder for two libertarians to share the same views.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Hey, new fun on the cuckoo ranch, it seems that the various wacko groups can’t play nice together. One comes with a club name of Oath Keepers...
http://gawker.com/nevada-ranch-militias-turn-against-each-other-over-dron-1570140614


Who are some of these people…
http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2012/...pers-is-last-line-of-defense-against-tyranny/

The Tea Party Nation, one of the more extreme factions of the Tea Party movement, has dipped deeper into the conspiratorial waters of antigovernment lore, most recently promoting the Oath Keepers and other antigovernment “Patriots” as the last line of defense for Americans increasingly confronted with “a government verging on evil.”

One of the more extreme factions of the Tea Party? That isn't a good sign!

Alright, we'll call them anti-government loonies. The confusion occurs when the entire right-wing blogosphere, radio, and media empires ramp up the support for the loon bags. Sure, none of them really are umm... true libertarians, but then again it may be easy to confuse them for libertarians when so many make the claim that is what they are.

Might be time for libertarianism to get a recalibration. Of course, I think the whole libertarianism thing is ridiculous as it is like herding cats.. ie, the Ron Paul Exclusion principal: It is only possible to know whether two people claim to be libertarians or if their political ideals are congruent, but never both at the same time.

When the ELF blew up a lab, or was spiking tree’s, would you expect the headline: "Progressives committed another environmental terrorist attack"?

Depends on who is starting the thread.

Are teabaggers trying to get candidates elected from within the GOP or the LP?

Not applicable. The LP is a dead end. Just like getting liberals elected in Congress through the Democrat party is a dead end.

Why did you mention the " right-wing blogosphere, radio, and media empires"? Oh, cuz maybe the term right winger fits pretty well?

Like I already said, sure there is some cross over, that is true with all political labels...no label has purity.

Libertarian, however, has an extremely loose label. It is like the term soda.

 

[funinspace]

Might be time for libertarianism to get a recalibration. Of course, I think the whole libertarianism thing is ridiculous as it is like herding cats.. ie, the Ron Paul Exclusion principal: It is only possible to know whether two people claim to be libertarians or if their political ideals are congruent, but never both at the same time.

Which raises the question: if it's not possible for anyone to actually be a libertarian, why do we have so many threads about them here?

You answered your own question. It is possible to be a libertarian, but it seems much harder for two libertarians to share the same views.

LOL... Funny thing, I agree with you many times, and I also agree with dismal often. So who do you agree with all the time?

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Libertarian, however, has an extremely loose label. It is like the term soda.

Or liberal, or conservative, or progressive, or green....

 

[dismal]

Libertarian, however, has an extremely loose label. It is like the term soda.

I think most people have little trouble deciding whether something is or isn't "soda"...

Anyway, as we have discussed many many times before I think most libertarians would agree on what constitute libertarian principles.

People exist on a continuum of how much they embrace and apply these principles. People who apply them most of the time to most things might call themselves a libertarian.

However on particular Issue A they might not act much like a libertarian at all. They also may disagree on what policy results from applying libertarian principles to Issue A.

Now, with all that said (again), I don't see how Bundy and his boys are acting in any fashion particularly consistent with libertarian principles.

He's really more like an OWS leftist I think.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

Might be time for libertarianism to get a recalibration. Of course, I think the whole libertarianism thing is ridiculous as it is like herding cats.. ie, the Ron Paul Exclusion principal: It is only possible to know whether two people claim to be libertarians or if their political ideals are congruent, but never both at the same time.

I'll give you a much simpler libertarian exclusion principle.

Find whatever idea the conservative Poe Underseer claims is libertarian, and it probably has nothing to do with libertarianism.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

Might be time for libertarianism to get a recalibration. Of course, I think the whole libertarianism thing is ridiculous as it is like herding cats.. ie, the Ron Paul Exclusion principal: It is only possible to know whether two people claim to be libertarians or if their political ideals are congruent, but never both at the same time.

Which raises the question: if it's not possible for anyone to actually be a libertarian, why do we have so many threads about them here?

Why are there so many threads about Game of Thrones?

 

[Nice Squirrel]

Once again, I recommend everybody familiarized themselves with the Sovereign Citizen movement. The could be called libertarian only in the fact they strive to not recognize government control, but their actual philosophy is one of warlord/feudalism in practice.

 

[Underseer]

Libertarian, however, has an extremely loose label. It is like the term soda.

I think most people have little trouble deciding whether something is or isn't "soda"...

Anyway, as we have discussed many many times before I think most libertarians would agree on what constitute libertarian principles.

People exist on a continuum of how much they embrace and apply these principles. People who apply them most of the time to most things might call themselves a libertarian.

However on particular Issue A they might not act much like a libertarian at all. They also may disagree on what policy results from applying libertarian principles to Issue A.

Now, with all that said (again), I don't see how Bundy and his boys are acting in any fashion particularly consistent with libertarian principles.

He's really more like an OWS leftist I think.

Ayn Rand would identify most post-Reagan Republicans as "statists" based largely on their abortion positions, yet most libertarian vote Republican. I think it's safe to say that whatever ideology there is to libertarianism, it doesn't have much meaning to most libertarians. It's the rightist equivalent of "progressive." It's just a self-label for people who are embarrassed to identify as conservatives.

This is fine because actual libertarianism is impractical for the same reason actual communism is impractical: they're too close to anarchy and depend too much on an overly optimistic view of human nature. The difference between actual libertarianism and actual communism is a matter of degree: libertarians believe in weak national government, communists want to abolish national governments. Well, that and libertarians want to return to a stratified society.

- - - Updated - - -

Once again, I recommend everybody familiarized themselves with the Sovereign Citizen movement. The could be called libertarian only in the fact they strive to not recognize government control, but their actual philosophy is one of warlord/feudalism in practice.

How is that any different from normal libertarianism?

If you've ever read an Ayn Rand novel, the rich are the only ones that matter, while workers are nameless, faceless, and powerless beings who never complain no matter how they are treated. All libertarianism is a neofeudalist fantasy in which a new aristocracy arises to rule over the undeserving masses.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Libertarian, however, has an extremely loose label. It is like the term soda.

I think most people have little trouble deciding whether something is or isn't "soda"...

Yeah, but what type?

Now, with all that said (again), I don't see how Bundy and his boys are acting in any fashion particularly consistent with libertarian principles.

Well certainly. But here is the rub... they think they are. In fact, many in the right-wing have been doing or calling for a whole bunch of crazy that they think is something else. Heck, they have deluded themselves into thinking Obama thinks he is some sort of King.

 

[ksen]

Heck, they have deluded themselves into thinking Obama thinks he is some sort of King.

or a liberal

 

[dismal]

. But here is the rub... they think they are.

Do you have some evidence of this?

Ksen calling them libertarians in yet another ksen trolling post doesn't count.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

How is that any different from normal libertarianism?

The killing of people with whom you disagree.

 

[ksen]

Ksen calling them libertarians in yet another ksen trolling post doesn't count.

You mean another successful ksen trolling thread because here you all are.

 

[Underseer]

Heck, they have deluded themselves into thinking Obama thinks he is some sort of King.

or a liberal

He actually implemented the medical reforms Republicans proposed. If he were truly moderate in a Fair And Balanced(tm) way, then he would have simply used the proposals to attack liberals instead of actually implementing them, thus we know that he is not only liberal, but a liberal extremist. America is now living under a fascist-socialist Islamo-atheist dictatorship! Wake up, sheeple! [/conservolibertarian]

 

[ksen]

jesus christ, that smug smiley is lame

 

[Nice Squirrel]

Shoot it.