Louis C.K. Stirs Outrage

[Jimmy Higgins]

What’s that Stephen Fry quote about people being offended? Consider that my perspective here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Is this a Stephan Fry quote or a Meme with txt and Fry’s face on it?

Also, in before the ‘It doesn’t matter if he said it, it is still true’ response.

I also think that mocking teens who were in a severely traumatic situation, many of whom lost dear friends in it... if fucking lazy ass comedy and even poorer communication skills.

 

[Emily Lake]

What’s that Stephen Fry quote about people being offended? Consider that my perspective here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Is this a Stephan Fry quote or a Meme with txt and Fry’s face on it?

Also, in before the ‘It doesn’t matter if he said it, it is still true’ response.

I also think that mocking teens who were in a severely traumatic situation, many of whom lost dear friends in it... if fucking lazy ass comedy and even poorer communication skills.

Not sure, I have always seen it attributed to him, not just meme style... but I’ve never looked it up to make sure. But as you say, it doesn’t matter, it still captures my sentiment.

And yeah, it could be argued that it’s lazy comedy and poor communication. That makes him a bad comedian. Doesn’t make it a case for outrage, at least not in my opinion. And if some people get offended by a comedian going what comedians do... oh well. Welcome to comedy. Not everyone is going to like it, and sometimes some people feel offended by it.

Seriously, if we need comedians to always be tasteful and avoid offending anyone... we’re going to be in for a mirthless ride.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[prideandfall]

I also think that mocking teens who were in a severely traumatic situation, many of whom lost dear friends in it... if fucking lazy ass comedy and even poorer communication skills.

and of course the problem here is that in the context of this conversation, there's something of a pot-and-kettle situation here with regards to 'lazy ass' and 'poor communication' because that's not what CK did, so this assertion is completely moot.

if you do a 5 minute bit about how american culture makes a celebrity out of anyone for no reason, and while listing off youtube stars and kardashians, you then pivot into "or kids who were just present when someone else got shot" then the pivot into that hyperbolic extremism IS the joke.
that is a huge foundation of CK's entire schtick as a performer, and if you're not on board with that then that is fine, but it's disingenuous to take one thing that you don't understand out of context and then start harping on about it.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I also think that mocking teens who were in a severely traumatic situation, many of whom lost dear friends in it... if fucking lazy ass comedy and even poorer communication skills.

and of course the problem here is that in the context of this conversation, there's something of a pot-and-kettle situation here with regards to 'lazy ass' and 'poor communication' because that's not what CK did, so this assertion is completely moot.

if you do a 5 minute bit about how american culture makes a celebrity out of anyone for no reason, and while listing off youtube stars and kardashians, you then pivot into "or kids who were just present when someone else got shot" then the pivot into that hyperbolic extremism IS the joke.
that is a huge foundation of CK's entire schtick as a performer, and if you're not on board with that then that is fine, but it's disingenuous to take one thing that you don't understand out of context and then start harping on about it.

Well, it is technically impossible to get the murdered teens to testify in DC. So those that survived are all we have left.

And last I checked, I don’t think there are any celebrities that were birthed at that school. We’ve got political whores by the gross on cable news, awaiting to talk during a panel to express buzzwords, but heaven forbid we give teens from a school that was evacuated because of dead bodies, the good guy with a gun couldn’t perform magic, Trump wasn’t there to storm in, and yet another person just had to kill more people, a venue to discuss about individuals mass murdering people in schools.

Yes, what a brilliant point by CK.

For fuck sakes, wasn’t Parkland one of the first school shootings where the students finally had a chance to speak?!

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

What’s that Stephen Fry quote about people being offended? Consider that my perspective here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Is this a Stephan Fry quote or a Meme with txt and Fry’s face on it?

Also, in before the ‘It doesn’t matter if he said it, it is still true’ response.

I also think that mocking teens who were in a severely traumatic situation, many of whom lost dear friends in it... if fucking lazy ass comedy and even poorer communication skills.

Not sure, I have always seen it attributed to him, not just meme style... but I’ve never looked it up to make sure. But as you say, it doesn’t matter, it still captures my sentiment.

And yeah, it could be argued that it’s lazy comedy and poor communication. That makes him a bad comedian. Doesn’t make it a case for outrage, at least not in my opinion. And if some people get offended by a comedian going what comedians do... oh well. Welcome to comedy. Not everyone is going to like it, and sometimes some people feel offended by it.

Seriously, if we need comedians to always be tasteful and avoid offending anyone... we’re going to be in for a mirthless ride.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Who is say offensiveness is wrong? It is possible to be offensive and be funny, however, being offensive doesn’t make something comedy. It can just be offensive, stupid, and flat out wrong.

Wanda Sykes, Michelle Wolf, among others can make it work. CK should learn from them.

 

[J842P]

Not sure, I have always seen it attributed to him, not just meme style... but I’ve never looked it up to make sure. But as you say, it doesn’t matter, it still captures my sentiment.

And yeah, it could be argued that it’s lazy comedy and poor communication. That makes him a bad comedian. Doesn’t make it a case for outrage, at least not in my opinion. And if some people get offended by a comedian going what comedians do... oh well. Welcome to comedy. Not everyone is going to like it, and sometimes some people feel offended by it.

Seriously, if we need comedians to always be tasteful and avoid offending anyone... we’re going to be in for a mirthless ride.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Who is say offensiveness is wrong? It is possible to be offensive and be funny, however, being offensive doesn’t make something comedy. It can just be offensive, stupid, and flat out wrong.

Wanda Sykes, Michelle Wolf, among others can make it work. CK should learn from them.

Uh, Louis CK makes it work all the time. He is by all measures a successful comedian. He might not be to your taste, but he obviously is funny to many people.

 

[prideandfall]

Well, it is technically impossible to get the murdered teens to testify in DC. So those that survived are all we have left.

And last I checked, I don’t think there are any celebrities that were birthed at that school. We’ve got political whores by the gross on cable news, awaiting to talk during a panel to express buzzwords, but heaven forbid we give teens from a school that was evacuated because of dead bodies, the good guy with a gun couldn’t perform magic, Trump wasn’t there to storm in, and yet another person just had to kill more people, a venue to discuss about individuals mass murdering people in schools.

Yes, what a brilliant point by CK.

For fuck sakes, wasn’t Parkland one of the first school shootings where the students finally had a chance to speak?!

since comedy is subjective i won't even pretend that i'm going to try to argue with you whether or not the joke was funny, my only point was that the comment about the parkland survivors was an aside within a broader bit, and thus the characterization both the article and you were discussing is incorrect.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Well, it is technically impossible to get the murdered teens to testify in DC. So those that survived are all we have left.

And last I checked, I don’t think there are any celebrities that were birthed at that school. We’ve got political whores by the gross on cable news, awaiting to talk during a panel to express buzzwords, but heaven forbid we give teens from a school that was evacuated because of dead bodies, the good guy with a gun couldn’t perform magic, Trump wasn’t there to storm in, and yet another person just had to kill more people, a venue to discuss about individuals mass murdering people in schools.

Yes, what a brilliant point by CK.

For fuck sakes, wasn’t Parkland one of the first school shootings where the students finally had a chance to speak?!

since comedy is subjective i won't even pretend that i'm going to try to argue with you whether or not the joke was funny,

I'm saying that it wasn't a joke.

 

[Goodchild]

I like Ricky Gervais' take on this situation:

Please stop saying "You can't joke about anything anymore". You can. You can joke about whatever the fuck you like. And some people won't like it and they will tell you they don't like it. And then it's up to you whether you give a fuck or not. And so on. It's a good system.

I don't think that excuses poor or tasteless "jokes" as it straight up says people are free to state their dislike of such "jokes", it's really up to Louis whether he gives a crap or not that many people now think of him as a mean-spirited jackass rather than a funny (though sexually abusive) comedian. But attacking the helpless is sure to earn him the favor of conservative circles so he'll have some audience at least.

 

[PyramidHead]

What’s that Stephen Fry quote about people being offended? Consider that my perspective here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Is this a Stephan Fry quote or a Meme with txt and Fry’s face on it?

Also, in before the ‘It doesn’t matter if he said it, it is still true’ response.

I also think that mocking teens who were in a severely traumatic situation, many of whom lost dear friends in it... if fucking lazy ass comedy and even poorer communication skills.

Not sure, I have always seen it attributed to him, not just meme style... but I’ve never looked it up to make sure. But as you say, it doesn’t matter, it still captures my sentiment.

And yeah, it could be argued that it’s lazy comedy and poor communication. That makes him a bad comedian. Doesn’t make it a case for outrage, at least not in my opinion. And if some people get offended by a comedian going what comedians do... oh well. Welcome to comedy. Not everyone is going to like it, and sometimes some people feel offended by it.

Seriously, if we need comedians to always be tasteful and avoid offending anyone... we’re going to be in for a mirthless ride.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think the nuance being missed is that the role of comedy is usually to take the upper classes down a peg, not to kick people when they're down and already being kicked from all sides. The offensiveness is a red herring, as plenty of offensive comedians can make funny jokes without targeting vulnerable people, or at least do it in a way that isn't tone-deaf and lacking context. Especially after being outed as a sex pervert

 

[Emily Lake]

I think the nuance being missed is that the role of comedy is usually to take the upper classes down a peg, not to kick people when they're down and already being kicked from all sides. The offensiveness is a red herring, as plenty of offensive comedians can make funny jokes without targeting vulnerable people, or at least do it in a way that isn't tone-deaf and lacking context. Especially after being outed as a sex pervert

Hmm. I would say that the role you describe is the role you favor for comedy, and is the style of comedy that you most like. But presenting it as if it were the only acceptable role of comedy is just plain wrong.

It seems to me just another case if someone taking the stance of “I don’t like this, therefore it is morally wrong and unacceptable“. It conflates ones own preferences with right, and the preferences of others as wrong. It’s a profoundly intolerant and arrogant presumption, albeit not particularly uncommon.

But perhaps I have misread you. If your post was intended to be more nuanced and if I have misinterpreted it to be moralizing when that was t what you meant, I gladly invite you to correct my error with a clearer explanation.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[PyramidHead]

I think the nuance being missed is that the role of comedy is usually to take the upper classes down a peg, not to kick people when they're down and already being kicked from all sides. The offensiveness is a red herring, as plenty of offensive comedians can make funny jokes without targeting vulnerable people, or at least do it in a way that isn't tone-deaf and lacking context. Especially after being outed as a sex pervert

Hmm. I would say that the role you describe is the role you favor for comedy, and is the style of comedy that you most like. But presenting it as if it were the only acceptable role of comedy is just plain wrong.

It seems to me just another case if someone taking the stance of “I don’t like this, therefore it is morally wrong and unacceptable“. It conflates ones own preferences with right, and the preferences of others as wrong. It’s a profoundly intolerant and arrogant presumption, albeit not particularly uncommon.

But perhaps I have misread you. If your post was intended to be more nuanced and if I have misinterpreted it to be moralizing when that was t what you meant, I gladly invite you to correct my error with a clearer explanation.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Emily Lake]

View attachment 19567

I don’t know what that image is supposed to mean. It conveys zero information.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Bronzeage]

Abraham Lincoln was murdered while sitting in a theater box on April 15, 1865. This was 153 years ago.

At what point in history did the joke, "Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the play?" become funny?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Abraham Lincoln was murdered while sitting in a theater box on April 15, 1865. This was 153 years ago.

At what point in history did the joke, "Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the play?" become funny?

Probably a few decades after Mary Todd Lincoln's death. Oddly enough, I think more people today approve of what John Wilkes Booth did than when he actually was alive... or for the remainder of the short span of time that asshole was alive.

But let us go back to the joke you present... you'll notice how it was actually a joke. It bases its humor from absurdity. Obviously the shooting of her husband was the only thing that mattered that night. So positing 'how was the play' is going for laughs via absurdity, by changing the subject of attention.

Complaining about people giving victims of a school massacre a voice isn't actually a joke. It is a complaint.

 

[Bronzeage]

Abraham Lincoln was murdered while sitting in a theater box on April 15, 1865. This was 153 years ago.

At what point in history did the joke, "Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the play?" become funny?

Probably a few decades after Mary Todd Lincoln's death. Oddly enough, I think more people today approve of what John Wilkes Booth did than when he actually was alive... or for the remainder of the short span of time that asshole was alive.

But let us go back to the joke you present... you'll notice how it was actually a joke. It bases its humor from absurdity. Obviously the shooting of her husband was the only thing that mattered that night. So positing 'how was the play' is going for laughs via absurdity, by changing the subject of attention.

Complaining about people giving victims of a school massacre a voice isn't actually a joke. It is a complaint.

Suppose a Parkland student who witnessed the murders signed up on this forum and wanted to argue for their opinions on President Trump, and how Jesus had made a difference in their life.

Does the fact they survived a mass shooting mean we must give extra credence to their opinion, over an above what we would grant to some other teen age high school student who wants to discuss politics and religion?

 

[Emily Lake]

I'm saying that it wasn't a joke.

Are you saying that it is representative of how CK really feels, and was not actually done for exaggerated or comedic effect?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Emily Lake]

Oddly enough, I think more people today approve of what John Wilkes Booth did than when he actually was alive... or for the remainder of the short span of time that asshole was alive.

That’s a ridiculous assertion.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[prideandfall]

Complaining about people giving victims of a school massacre a voice isn't actually a joke. It is a complaint.

well i do hate to keep harping on this, but you keep doing it so i have to keep correcting you until you get it through your head that you're factually wrong.

in the context of the bit, he wasn't complaining about that - trying to assert that's what happened is simply inaccurate.
i don't know how many times that needs to be repeated before some kind of understanding comes across, because it seems really easy to grasp to me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WS13C0VUiQY
the bit starts at 20:05, the bit ends at 26:00

context abridged (not a ver batim transcript but the gist):
the relevant bit starts with:
my kids are teenagers now and they i'm an asshole, and it really makes me feel like all the time and effort i put into loving them and raising them was wasted, because none of it matters to them or how they feel about me now.
my daughter said to me the other day: "no offence daddy but i just don't think it's very cool to go in a room and tell people jokes" and i was like "... well what the fuck have YOU done that makes you so interesting? you're 13, you've done nothing, the most interesting thing about is the fact your father is a stand-up comedian."
... then he talks about his other daughter and how smart she is, and how even if she was doing drugs he wouldn't know because she has her shit together so much more than he did at that age and he no idea how to compare his experience to hers. this leads into a monologue about what an idiot he was as a teenager and all the stupid shit he and his friends would do to kill time.
then he goes off about how now that he's 51 he was looking forward to seeing what young people these days are up to and what kind of crazy shit they'd be doing with new technology and drugs, but to his chagrin kids these days are boring and tame - this goes into a bit of a side-bar about "PC" topics but it's clearly in a mocking "old man yells at cloud" manner.
this bridges into an offhand comment about how kids should be wild and unhinged, not wearing a suit on CNN... and how people die every day so shootings aren't that interesting and doesn't make you notable or someone to be listened to.
(side note: in the context of his career CK has had a running theme of celebrity worship and how he doesn't believe in granting respect to people who haven't done anything notable to earn it, especially denigrating those who gain fame by circumstance)

the entire 'bit' about teens and such is around 6 minutes long. the references to parkland take up exactly 35 seconds.

so, again, comedy is subjective and i won't argue about whether or not the bit is *funny* to you, it's clearly not and that's fine.
but it's just as clearly a joke as part of a bit and pretty much every article about it and your every comment on it is objectively factually inaccurate.

 

[Bronzeage]

Oddly enough, I think more people today approve of what John Wilkes Booth did than when he actually was alive... or for the remainder of the short span of time that asshole was alive.

That’s a ridiculous assertion.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not really all that ridiculous. The total white population of the Confederacy was 5.5 million. Today, the US is 323 million. The arithmetic makes it well within possibility that more than 5.5 million would approve of John Wilkes Booth, provided they knew who he was and what he did.

Totally irrelevant to the discussion, but not ridiculous.