Mierda is about to hit the ventilador

[Derec]

Venezuelan opposition tells military that it's time to choose
Venezuela Opposition Rejects Maduro's State of Emergency
Maduro: opposition legislature set to ‘disappear’
Venezuela security forces block anti-Maduro protesters
How authoritarian socialism caused Venezuela's collapse'

We are approaching an undignified end to an experiment that was misconceived from the beginning and was only kept going by unprecedented high oil prices of naughts and early 10s.

 

[Trausti]

The problem is you're reading news from right-wing, Nazi, Trump-loving, kitten-eating, capitalists outfits. Of course they'll poop-poop the great socialist revolution.

Perhaps you should read reliable news sources, like Salon.com.

Hugo Chavez’s economic miracle

http://www.salon.com/2013/03/06/hugo_chavezs_economic_miracle/

 

[Tom Sawyer]

If it failed, it just means that it wasn't a real repressive dictatorship in the first place.

 

[Draconis]

Nothing to do with socialism. More to do with relying too much on one thing to keep the country going.

 

[dismal]

Nothing to do with socialism. More to do with relying too much on one thing to keep the country going.

Doesn't teh socialism have something to do with relying too much on the one thing?

I mean, if you have driven all the toilet paper producers out of business and nationalized their factories because socialism, your policies have resulted in your country becoming more focused on doing something other than producing toilet paper.

 

[KeepTalking]

Nothing to do with socialism. More to do with relying too much on one thing to keep the country going.

Doesn't teh socialism have something to do with relying too much on the one thing?

No.

Words have meaning, and since you apparently have no idea what the word 'socialism' means, perhaps you should consult a dictionary.

 

[Derec]

Nothing to do with socialism. More to do with relying too much on one thing to keep the country going.

It has a lot to do with socialism.
Yes, overreliance on oil is a long-standing problem for Venezuela and Chavez/Maduro did nothing to diversify the economy. On the contrary, they attacked private sector industries at every turn, making the problem with reliance on oil even worse. Hostility to private sector has to do with socialism.
When oil prices were high, the Bolivarian government used oil to buy influence in South America and further afield. That evangelical socialism cost the economy billions.
Chavez regime also replaced many PDVSA people with less capable party loyalists and used the PDVSA profits to fund social programs and neglected necessary investment which resulted in oil production actually going down.

PDVSA also engaged in very questionable sponsorship of the pay driver Pastor Maldonado in Formula 1

Then there are the currency controls and price controls, which are all about Chavez' "21st century socialism".

It's not that the fall of oil prices caused the Venezuelan collapse, it's that the high oil prices managed to mask the mismanagement of economy for a long time.

 

[Axulus]

Nothing to do with socialism. More to do with relying too much on one thing to keep the country going.

And why did they have to rely on the one thing so much? Might it have to do with the gutting of the private sector?

 

[Derec]

And why did they have to rely on the one thing so much? Might it have to do with the gutting of the private sector?

Yes. Venezuela was dependent on oil for a long time. The difference is, Bolivarian Revolution only made it much worse. The tragedy of this is, a better leader could have used the huge windfall of the 2000s to reduce dependence on the oil sector and to modernize PDVSA itself. Alas, ideology came before good governance.

 

[untermensche]

Nothing to do with socialism. More to do with relying too much on one thing to keep the country going.

And why did they have to rely on the one thing so much? Might it have to do with the gutting of the private sector?

It has to do with decades and decades of foreign influence and exploitation and a lack of internal indigenous growth as a result.

 

[Derec]

It has to do with decades and decades of foreign influence and exploitation and a lack of internal indigenous growth as a result.

Chavez not only failed to make things better, he made things much worse. You can't blame that on "foreign influence".

 

[Axulus]

And why did they have to rely on the one thing so much? Might it have to do with the gutting of the private sector?

It has to do with decades and decades of foreign influence and exploitation and a lack of internal indigenous growth as a result.

Quit making dumb excuses for the horrendous policies of the Venezuelan government:

-Failure to modernize it's oil sector
-Confiscation/nationalization of private businesses and arrests of the executives for political reasons (the owners didn't kowtow to the Chavistas sufficiently)
-Allocation of money for imports based on political connections which led to horrendous corruption
-Price controls

Even now, they refuse to put out the fire to limit the damage. Eliminating currency and price controls, eliminating the threat of political takeovers of businesses and seeking aid from international institutions like the UN and the IMF will actually prevent tens of thousands of people from dying and hundreds of thousands more from going hungry. Yet the Chavistas would rather use their own people as a political sacrifice.

 

[untermensche]

It has to do with decades and decades of foreign influence and exploitation and a lack of internal indigenous growth as a result.

Quit making dumb excuses for the horrendous policies of the Venezuelan government:

-Failure to modernize it's oil sector
-Confiscation/nationalization of private businesses and arrests of the executives for political reasons (the owners didn't kowtow to the Chavistas sufficiently)
-Allocation of money for imports based on political connections which led to horrendous corruption
-Price controls

Even now, they refuse to put out the fire to limit the damage. Eliminating currency and price controls, eliminating the threat of political takeovers of businesses and seeking aid from international institutions like the UN and the IMF will actually prevent tens of thousands of people from dying and hundreds of thousands more from going hungry. Yet the Chavistas would rather use their own people as a political sacrifice.

It is fact.

When you have been a third world nation under the dominion of foreign powers for decades there are many underlying problems that occur as a result.

To blame it all on the long dead Chavez is insanity.

 

[dismal]

To blame it all on the long dead Chavez is insanity.

Right, Maduro is even worse for continuing the disastrous policies now that the disaster is apparent and the policies are clearly opposed by the people.

 

[untermensche]

To blame it all on the long dead Chavez is insanity.

Right, Maduro is even worse for continuing the disastrous policies now that the disaster is apparent and the policies are clearly opposed by the people.

What does the US do when it's system collapses every so often?

Does it abandon it's system for another?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

And why did they have to rely on the one thing so much? Might it have to do with the gutting of the private sector?

It has to do with decades and decades of foreign influence and exploitation and a lack of internal indigenous growth as a result.

Yeah, foreign influence: Marx and Lenin caused Chavez to wreck the Venezuelan economy.

 

[untermensche]

It has to do with decades and decades of foreign influence and exploitation and a lack of internal indigenous growth as a result.

Yeah, foreign influence: Marx and Lenin caused Chavez to wreck the Venezuelan economy.

Chavez was elected.

Lenin never was.

And Marx was a critic of capitalism.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Yeah, foreign influence: Marx and Lenin caused Chavez to wreck the Venezuelan economy.

Chavez was elected.

Lenin never was.

And Marx was a critic of capitalism.

You utterly missed the point.

I was talking about their influence on his ideas.

 

[untermensche]

Chavez was elected.

Lenin never was.

And Marx was a critic of capitalism.

You utterly missed the point.

I was talking about their influence on his ideas.

No you miss the point.

Your dinosaur ideas are out of date by about 60 years.

 

[Derec]

Your dinosaur ideas are out of date by about 60 years.

You mean Maduro's ideas are "out of date by about 60 years"?
And of course, the effect of his ideas has an even older antecedent; Venezuela is now in full "let them eat cake" mode.

A well stocked bakery, but no bread, because bread is price-controlled and can't be made at the price is has to be sold for. But people have a nice selection of pastries. If they can afford the hyperinflated prices, that is.