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missouri passes state law forcing cities to lower their minimum wage

Jimmy Higgins said:
dismal said:
So a high minimum wage is like a 1000 degree flame?

Why is that? What's so bad about it?
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Because it increases the entire cost of the product or service well out of hand that the economy will require massive changes to reach an equilibrium. As opposed to increasing the price of a big mac meal by 80 bloody cents, something the economy can absorb with relative ease.

Dude, officer, if going 66 mph is against the law, I don't see why you are making so much more of a big deal over me going 180 mph.
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So it's okay as long as the price of a Big Mac doesn't get to a $1 increase?

It's interesting because corporations can probably absorb minimum wage a little bit better than small private businesses. Wal-Mart supported a higher wage to drive out it's competition. But people actually say they want small businesses over corporations.

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DBT said:
Loren Pechtel said:
You need entry level jobs so people can enter the labor force.
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'Entry level' jobs may be the only career option that some workers have (not everyone can be doctors and lawyers). If the work is productive, the pay offered should be more than the pittance that is MW.

We should have been working toward fairer and more reasonable societies long ago. Instead we have economic systems designed by the wealthy to benefit the wealthy and provide cheap labour in order to maximize profits for the rich at the expense of those on the bottom.....even if to achieve that purpose means that production has to be shifted to third world countries to exploit their workforce.

It's obscene.
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Yeah because the poor people 100 years ago we're living in Mansions and sailing yachts, capitalism came around and that stopped. The biggest issue with capitalism is that it has become too successful.
 
Jimmy Higgins said:
dismal said:
It sounds like you believe people respond to the price of things. And artificially raising the price of something causes people to demand less of it.

But in this forum we can be pretty sure this isn't true.
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Strawman unite! We only have to fear being burned to death.

Do you have any arguments that don't involve this crude and obviously incorrect economics at their root?
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Goodness you are such a waste of time.
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Yeah, you don't like to have your religious beliefs challenged.
 
coloradoatheist said:
Jimmy Higgins said:
Because it increases the entire cost of the product or service well out of hand that the economy will require massive changes to reach an equilibrium. As opposed to increasing the price of a big mac meal by 80 bloody cents, something the economy can absorb with relative ease.

Dude, officer, if going 66 mph is against the law, I don't see why you are making so much more of a big deal over me going 180 mph.
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So it's okay as long as the price of a Big Mac doesn't get to a $1 increase?
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Here is that right-wingers can't understand premises very well thing.

Person A: We need to raise minimum wages so that they create a more sustainable standard of living.
Person B: So why not $1000 an hour?
Person A: *sigh*, people don't need $1000 an hour
Person B: I want $1000 an hour.
Person A: But we are talking about shifting a minimum wage so that it becomes sustainable, not something wildly absurd, that is clearly not sustainable.
Person B: Small businesses will die. Why do you love Walmart so much?
Person A: Doesn't Walmart work on a super thin margin and require bulk sales in order to make profit?
Person B: Hitler wanted a livable wage.
Person A: *ignore*
Person B: I don't like your argument. Use a different one.
 
Jimmy Higgins said:
coloradoatheist said:
So it's okay as long as the price of a Big Mac doesn't get to a $1 increase?
Click to expand...
Here is that right-wingers can't understand premises very well thing.

Person A: We need to raise minimum wages so that they create a more sustainable standard of living.
Person B: So why not $1000 an hour?
Person A: *sigh*, people don't need $1000 an hour
Person B: I want $1000 an hour.
Person A: But we are talking about shifting a minimum wage so that it becomes sustainable, not something wildly absurd, that is clearly not sustainable.
Person B: Small businesses will die. Why do you love Walmart so much?
Person A: Doesn't Walmart work on a super thin margin and require bulk sales in order to make profit?
Person B: Hitler wanted a livable wage.
Person A: *ignore*
Person B: I don't like your argument. Use a different one.
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Jimmy, this is not a political issue. It's a Economics 101 text book issue.

You will not find it ever said in an economics text book that "changes that can be absorbed by the economy have no effect". This is a religious belief of yours.

Economics text books show continuous demand curves. All changes have some effect.
 
Jimmy Higgins said:
coloradoatheist said:
So it's okay as long as the price of a Big Mac doesn't get to a $1 increase?
Click to expand...
Here is that right-wingers can't understand premises very well thing.

Person A: We need to raise minimum wages so that they create a more sustainable standard of living.
Person B: So why not $1000 an hour?
Person A: *sigh*, people don't need $1000 an hour
Person B: I want $1000 an hour.
Person A: But we are talking about shifting a minimum wage so that it becomes sustainable, not something wildly absurd, that is clearly not sustainable.
Person B: Small businesses will die. Why do you love Walmart so much?
Person A: Doesn't Walmart work on a super thin margin and require bulk sales in order to make profit?
Person B: Hitler wanted a livable wage.
Person A: *ignore*
Person B: I don't like your argument. Use a different one.
Click to expand...


No. The issue is that with a minimal wage increase economists realize some groups benefit some groups get hurt by increases. It's funny with the latest study people were happy that people at this level were making less money than they were before but since they worked less hours it was good.

One side says there are tradeoffs, they other side says there are no trade offs, only benefits.
 
Horatio Parker said:
Loren Pechtel said:
You need entry level jobs so people can enter the labor force.
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No shit. But an economy like Seattle's can do with 9% or so fewer.

You speak as if all entry level jobs were somehow eliminated.
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Reality: The low level people lost money from the measure meant to help them.

Minimum wage was conceived as a means of keeping the lowest workers out of the labor force and it continues to have that effect.
 
Loren Pechtel said:
Horatio Parker said:
No shit. But an economy like Seattle's can do with 9% or so fewer.

You speak as if all entry level jobs were somehow eliminated.
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Reality: The low level people lost money from the measure meant to help them.

Minimum wage was conceived as a means of keeping the lowest workers out of the labor force and it continues to have that effect.
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They lost those minimum wage jobs to get higher paying jobs.
 
marc said:
What I'm hearing:


P1 - "Gee, it is a little chilly in here. Why don't we turn up the thermostat a couple degrees to make everyone more comfortable"

P2 - "oh sure, why don't you turn it up a thousand degrees then!"

P1 - ????? "Have you tried decaf?"
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What you are missing is that we are asking for evidence of what the right amount is, the left keeps saying "more!" Thus we suggest 1000 degrees as evidence there is such a thing as too much.
 
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