Perception vs. Reality

[Trausti]

From Skeptic magazine.

How Informed are Americans about Race and Policing?

People with left-wing orientation grossly overestimated the number of unarmed black men killed by police in 2019. Why this large disconnect? Who is to blame? And what are the consequences of this spread of misinformation in society?

 

[GenesisNemesis]

I wouldn't mind if only a few Trump supporters were killed.

 

[Patooka]

Adjusted for the number of law enforcement agencies that
have yet to provide data, this number may be higher

My, what a compelling argument.

Critically, this data collection effort was established only recently in 2019, law enforcement participation is voluntary and, as of 2020, only 5,030 out of 18,514 federal, state and local law enforcement agencies have provided use-of-force data.

I wonder what the reason is for over two thirds of law enforcement to not disclose this data. Fatalities caused by law enforcement should be in the public domain. Also, this study would dismiss incidents like Philando Castile in its calculations.

Now having said all of that, I reckon this is a very well written report. It highlights the opportunities for further study and openly admits its own shortcomings. I also think it is pretty fucking despicable that a private company has to compile this data. It should be under the purview of a body like the FBI or DOJ. One interesting statistic is how the percentage of unarmed people who are killed by police that are black is twice the percentage of blacks in the United States.

That doesn't change the fact that cops killing any unarmed citizens is fucked up, and the fact that law enforcement is not obliged to disclose killing a citizen is equally fucked up.

 

[Derec]

From Skeptic magazine.

How Informed are Americans about Race and Policing?

People with left-wing orientation grossly overestimated the number of unarmed black men killed by police in 2019. Why this large disconnect? Who is to blame? And what are the consequences of this spread of misinformation in society?

There is especially a huge misconception about how vast majority of police shootings involve armed suspects and that there are many more white shootees than you'd expect from CNN et al reporting.

 

[Patooka]

Derec : Cops don't disproportionately kill blacks, that's a far left myth.

Also Derec: Today I'm going to start yet another thread expressing my outrage at a black family suing a city because their relative was shot by cops.

By the way, "Cops kill white people too" isn't the winning argument you believe it to be. Sane people think that's fucked as well.

 

[barbos]

To be fair, I do think that the recent rise of trumpism related crap was to a large degree caused by BLM related crap.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

To be fair, I do think that the recent rise of trumpism related crap was to a large degree caused by BLM related crap.

I think it was precisely the opposite, unless of course one wishes to blame slaves for the Civil War.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

To be fair, I do think that the recent rise of trumpism related crap was to a large degree caused by BLM related crap.

And you could think the sky was orange, but that doesn't have any weight. KKK violence also existed because blacks wanted to vote. I'm sick of this twisted tale that the bigotry against blacks was irrational, but now it is totally rational because... the blacks make whites hate them.

 

[barbos]

To be fair, I do think that the recent rise of trumpism related crap was to a large degree caused by BLM related crap.

I think it was precisely the opposite, unless of course one wishes to blame slaves for the Civil War.

I don't blame slaves, but do you not see how BLM clinging to every police shooting black guy regardless of the justification can backfire?

 

[Gospel]

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

To be fair, I do think that the recent rise of trumpism related crap was to a large degree caused by BLM related crap.

I think it was precisely the opposite, unless of course one wishes to blame slaves for the Civil War.

I don't blame slaves, but do you not see how BLM clinging to every police shooting black guy regardless of the justification can backfire?

How familiar are you with the plight of Blacks in this country? It doesn't seem like you appreciate how systematic it's actually been at a governmental level for as long as there have been blacks here. I've lived in different parts of the Deep South and the racism is real. It is not as permitted and as institutionalized as it once was but there is a definite desire on the part of many whites to re-institutionalize black oppression.

That wish to re-institutionalize black oppression probably emanates from insecurity about jobs and your basic xenophobic response. As such I can certainly understand the fear. That fear only goes away however when you start to see yourself in the same position, when you can identify with that person and see yourself in their skin, not as something or someone else but rather as yourself, literally. Their success is your success. But I'm not holding my breath waiting for that to happen.

I can certainly also see myself in the position of racist whites who are fearful for their futures who wish to preserve their birthright to status and privilege. These people are literally afraid and it is the fear that drives their behavior. Unfortunately their ignorance about immigration and their own journey down that path has left the without an intellectual response to their fear.

 

[Patooka]

To be fair, I do think that the recent rise of trumpism related crap was to a large degree caused by BLM related crap.

I think it was precisely the opposite, unless of course one wishes to blame slaves for the Civil War.

I don't blame slaves, but do you not see how BLM clinging to every police shooting black guy regardless of the justification can backfire?

Is BLM doing that because generally the narrative is

1) Person dies/is injured at the hands of the police
2) Police issue a public statement about the incident
3) Camera footage show the police are fucking lying

That's what happened with George Floyd, Ahmaud Arbery (granted he was killed by an ex cop, but the shooting was considered fine until the video came out) and Philando Castile, just off the top of my head. And in the name of racial equality, the Buffalo Police Department's official statement to this incident was that the guy tripped and fell and medical attention was immediately applied. That is of course, until the video came out.

And that's the whole fucking point. How can you honestly say BLM is clinging to every police shooting when US law enforcement has consistently and repeatedly proven that their statements towards incidents are demonstrably false? Steps 2 and 3 happen so fucking often that, yes - it is a fucking problem.

 

[barbos]

I don't blame slaves, but do you not see how BLM clinging to every police shooting black guy regardless of the justification can backfire?

How familiar are you with the plight of Blacks in this country? It doesn't seem like you appreciate how systematic it's actually been at a governmental level for as long as there have been blacks here. I've lived in different parts of the Deep South and the racism is real. It is not as permitted and as institutionalized as it once was but there is a definite desire on the part of many whites to re-institutionalize black oppression.

That wish to re-institutionalize black oppression probably emanates from insecurity about jobs and your basic xenophobic response. As such I can certainly understand the fear. That fear only goes away however when you start to see yourself in the same position, when you can identify with that person and see yourself in their skin, not as something or someone else but rather as yourself, literally. Their success is your success. But I'm not holding my breath waiting for that to happen.

I can certainly also see myself in the position of racist whites who are fearful for their futures who wish to preserve their birthright to status and privilege. These people are literally afraid and it is the fear that drives their behavior. Unfortunately their ignorance about immigration and their own journey down that path has left the without an intellectual response to their fear.

I don't think many of the 75 million people who voted Trump afraid of any of the things you mentioned. Lots of ordinary racists for sure, but a lot of them are simply pissed off at BLM crap. Not afraid, just pissed off. Trump would not have gotten 75 million votes without BLM.

 

[barbos]

I don't blame slaves, but do you not see how BLM clinging to every police shooting black guy regardless of the justification can backfire?

Is BLM doing that because generally the narrative is

1) Person dies/is injured at the hands of the police
2) Police issue a public statement about the incident
3) Camera footage show the police are fucking lying

That's what happened with George Floyd, Ahmaud Arbery (granted he was killed by an ex cop, but the shooting was considered fine until the video came out) and Philando Castile, just off the top of my head. And in the name of racial equality, the Buffalo Police Department's official statement to this incident was that the guy tripped and fell and medical attention was immediately applied. That is of course, until the video came out.

And that's the whole fucking point. How can you honestly say BLM is clinging to every police shooting when US law enforcement has consistently and repeatedly proven that their statements towards incidents are demonstrably false? Steps 2 and 3 happen so fucking often that, yes - it is a fucking problem.

Police lie about shooting white people too, and does that consistently too. But that's not even a point here.

The point is: You can have 100 cases which clearly prove your point of police being bad and then just one other case which is crap. This crappy case completely destroys your whole argument. That's what BLM does, they destroy their own argument by including cases where shooting was clearly justifiable. That does nothing but pisses off people who then go and vote trump.

 

[Patooka]

Police lie about shooting white people too, and does that consistently too. But that's not even a point here.

No, that is exactly the point You brought up BLM. Why do you think they are associated with defund the police? One sprouted from the other and the point both make is precisely the one you are trying to dismiss.

The point is: You can have 100 cases which clearly prove your point of police being bad and then just one other case which is crap. This crappy case completely destroys your whole argument.

If only that standard applied to everyone...

That's what BLM does, they destroy their own argument by including cases where shooting was clearly justifiable. That does nothing but pisses off people who then go and vote trump.

I'm certain not a single Trump supporter (the ones left) would support BLM even if it were a flawless movement. Seeing as that is an unrealistic expectation, it's pretty obvious the people using such an argument are doing it in bad faith. Also, when did BLM protest against a justified police shooting? I do read quite a few right wing sites like The Daily Wire, Gateway Pundit and Frontpagemag and none of them have made mention of such an incident. And trust me, they fling a lot of shit towards BLM.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

The point is: You can have 100 cases which clearly prove your point of police being bad and then just one other case which is crap. This crappy case completely destroys your whole argument. That's what BLM does, they destroy their own argument by including cases where shooting was clearly justifiable. That does nothing but pisses off people who then go and vote trump.

So your proposed solution to racism in this country is to let it happen because if it is called out and actively opposed it pisses white people off? That's quite generous of you.

 

[Worldtraveller]

The point is: You can have 100 cases which clearly prove your point of police being bad and then just one other case which is crap. This crappy case completely destroys your whole argument. That's what BLM does, they destroy their own argument by including cases where shooting was clearly justifiable. That does nothing but pisses off people who then go and vote trump.

So your proposed solution to racism in this country is to let it happen because if it is called out and actively opposed it pisses white people off? That's qWhite generous of you.

FIXT.

 

[barbos]

The point is: You can have 100 cases which clearly prove your point of police being bad and then just one other case which is crap. This crappy case completely destroys your whole argument. That's what BLM does, they destroy their own argument by including cases where shooting was clearly justifiable. That does nothing but pisses off people who then go and vote trump.

So your proposed solution to racism in this country is to let it happen because if it is called out and actively opposed it pisses white people off? That's quite generous of you.

Bullshitting (even small amount) pisses most people off.

 

[Gospel]

From Skeptic magazine.

How Informed are Americans about Race and Policing?

People with left-wing orientation grossly overestimated the number of unarmed black men killed by police in 2019. Why this large disconnect? Who is to blame? And what are the consequences of this spread of misinformation in society?

This is an interesting report. Too bad it doesn't take into account years leading up to 2019 as that would have explained some of the disconnect. But if you're here to cram all existence into 2019 to blame the media & democrats I won't get in your way. They are partially responsible after all.

 

[GenesisNemesis]

To be fair, I do think that the recent rise of trumpism related crap was to a large degree caused by BLM related crap.

Lol, Trumpism is one of the consequences of the Civil War. The South is still pissed that they lost.