Philippines ends Military Cooperation Deal with USA

[Jolly_Penguin]

It isn't like Filipinos like the Chinese anymore than they like Americans (not at all).

Does not seem to be true:

The United States was consistently ranked as one of the Philippines' favorite nations in the world, with 90% of Filipinos viewing the U.S. and 91% viewing Americans favorably in 2002, 90% of Filipinos viewing U.S. influence positively in 2011, 85% of Filipinos viewing the U.S. and Americans favorably in 2013, and 92% of Filipinos viewing the U.S. favorably in 2015, and 94% having confidence in former United States president Barack Obama, making the Philippines the most pro-American country in the world.

You need to understand that Filipino culture will prompt everyone to answer positively towards anyone. It is a nation of people who like to please others. Its also a nation of people who export their labour and want to be thought well of. But talk to these same people without outsiders around and ask what they really think. You would be surprised.

"Hey Joe" (they call all Americans "Joe") they will say to the American as he walks by, and as soon as he is gone its the rolling of eyes and shaking of heads.

 

[angelo]

Human rights? Drug pushers shouldn't have human rights, for they care little about the human rights of the drug lords victims.

Me thinks you do protest too much, you're trying to conceal your true identity. You're a drug pusher. Since you have no rights you have no right to defend yourself from this charge, an accusation is enough. <Bang!>

If proven guilty beyond any doubt................bang! That also goes for child rapists, serial killers and terrorists.

 

[Tammuz]

Does not seem to be true:

You need to understand that Filipino culture will prompt everyone to answer positively towards anyone. It is a nation of people who like to please others. Its also a nation of people who export their labour and want to be thought well of. But talk to these same people without outsiders around and ask what they really think. You would be surprised.

"Hey Joe" (they call all Americans "Joe") they will say to the American as he walks by, and as soon as he is gone its the rolling of eyes and shaking of heads.

I'm not sure if I consider this a reasonable explanation. It is one thing to be polite and friendly by culture, quite another thing to pretending to like a foreign (powerful) country.

They do seem to be less positive about China (not a perfect comparison measure, I agree), for example:

However, the average trust view of Filipinos towards China is negative 33, dipping much lower in certain provinces such as Zambales and Palawan where it is at least negative 45. In contrast, the average trust view towards the United States is positive 66.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Human rights? Drug pushers shouldn't have human rights, for they care little about the human rights of the drug lords victims.

Me thinks you do protest too much, you're trying to conceal your true identity. You're a drug pusher. Since you have no rights you have no right to defend yourself from this charge, an accusation is enough. <Bang!>

If proven guilty beyond any doubt................bang! That also goes for child rapists, serial killers and terrorists.

Except what they are doing is not the death penalty for being a drug pusher, but vigilante actions, probably often by the state.

 

[angelo]

Dutarte has an enviable 80% approval rating in the Philippines. Is expected to win the next election by a landslide.

 

[steve_bank]

From reporting people like the r4eduction in drugs and crime regardless of his methods.

 

[angelo]

In the short term it may seem a little like brutality. But in the long term, it will save perhaps thousands from overdoses and the misery of the drugs scourge in the Philippines.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

In the short term it may seem a little like brutality. But in the long term, it will save perhaps thousands from overdoses and the misery of the drugs scourge in the Philippines.

Other countries have the death penalty for drug trafficking. What's totally unacceptable about what he's doing is the lack of trials.

And note that the route that's worked the best is the exact opposite--legalization.

 

[steve_bank]

There has been some reporting that some people are happy with a reduction in drugs and violence regardless of how it is done.

There was a third shooting in about 4 weeks in downtown Seattle. This time at a courthouse entrance.

 

[angelo]

In the short term it may seem a little like brutality. But in the long term, it will save perhaps thousands from overdoses and the misery of the drugs scourge in the Philippines.

Other countries have the death penalty for drug trafficking. What's totally unacceptable about what he's doing is the lack of trials.

And note that the route that's worked the best is the exact opposite--legalization.

Legalising drugs like heroin, ice? I don't think so!

 

[Loren Pechtel]

In the short term it may seem a little like brutality. But in the long term, it will save perhaps thousands from overdoses and the misery of the drugs scourge in the Philippines.

Other countries have the death penalty for drug trafficking. What's totally unacceptable about what he's doing is the lack of trials.

And note that the route that's worked the best is the exact opposite--legalization.

Legalising drugs like heroin, ice? I don't think so!

Why not?

Because they're addictive? Nicotine is more addictive.

Because they kill their users? The most dangerous recreational drug is clearly tobacco. The data is less clear about second place (the drug death data is badly contaminated with deaths due to impurities and deaths due to unexpected potency) but it looks like alcohol is in second place.

Because they wreck families? Alcohol does also.

Because of the crime? Remember when we had lots of alcohol crime? Prohibition!

Perhaps some are too dangerous for full legalization but if that's the case then they should be available to addicts by prescription, the law explicitly stating that addiction is a valid reason for a prescription and that providing an addict his fix is not malpractice.

 

[steve_bank]

The difference between tobacco and heroin is the time it takes to kill you.

I can say from observation over the last 5 years that tobacco along with alcohol are major drivers in the overall cost of health care.

Someone who dealt with addicts told me nicotine addiction is harder to deal with than opioids.

 

[J842P]

Legalising drugs like heroin, ice? I don't think so!

Why not?

Because they're addictive? Nicotine is more addictive.

Because they kill their users? The most dangerous recreational drug is clearly tobacco. The data is less clear about second place (the drug death data is badly contaminated with deaths due to impurities and deaths due to unexpected potency) but it looks like alcohol is in second place.

Because they wreck families? Alcohol does also.

Because of the crime? Remember when we had lots of alcohol crime? Prohibition!

Perhaps some are too dangerous for full legalization but if that's the case then they should be available to addicts by prescription, the law explicitly stating that addiction is a valid reason for a prescription and that providing an addict his fix is not malpractice.

The fundamental issue is that regardless of how bad drugs of abuse can be, prohibition generally makes things worse.

No one is saying you should be able to advertise oxycontin to kids. But a doctor should be able to prescribe you opiate if you are an addict. And there's no reason anyone should be going broke paying for opiates, because without the black market, they are super cheap to create. And while being an addict is never great, being an addict without access to your addiction is worse for society.

 

[J842P]

The difference between tobacco and heroin is the time it takes to kill you.

I can say from observation over the last 5 years that tobacco along with alcohol are major drivers in the overall cost of health care.

Someone who dealt with addicts told me nicotine addiction is harder to deal with than opioids.

Eh. Opioids, with controlled dosages, can be relatively safe. In the long term, the risk may be lower than tobacco products.

And alcohol is probably the worst drug in terms of societal effects. Something like 50% of murders happen when people are drunk (not an exact figure, but something shocking like that).

Sure, there are probably substances that might induce more anti-social behavior, but they are rarely used, they have a certain self-limiting nature (they generally are not euphoric).


Marijuana is probably the most benign of all the common drugs of abuse. It is definitely orders of magnitude less bad for the user and society than pretty much anything, certainly alcohol. Maybe with the exception of caffeine (and other minor stimulants).


On the other hand, you have drugs like hallucinogens (psilocybin mushrooms, LSD) and entactogens (MDMA). In my opinion, these should be encouraged rather than prohibited, with social controls of course (as have existed across human history).

 

[angelo]

Legalize illegal drugs now. What next, legalize pedophilia, sharia law and slavery? How about we do away with the judiciary altogether?

 

[steve_bank]

The difference between tobacco and heroin is the time it takes to kill you.

I can say from observation over the last 5 years that tobacco along with alcohol are major drivers in the overall cost of health care.

Someone who dealt with addicts told me nicotine addiction is harder to deal with than opioids.

Eh. Opioids, with controlled dosages, can be relatively safe. In the long term, the risk may be lower than tobacco products.

And alcohol is probably the worst drug in terms of societal effects. Something like 50% of murders happen when people are drunk (not an exact figure, but something shocking like that).

Sure, there are probably substances that might induce more anti-social behavior, but they are rarely used, they have a certain self-limiting nature (they generally are not euphoric).


Marijuana is probably the most benign of all the common drugs of abuse. It is definitely orders of magnitude less bad for the user and society than pretty much anything, certainly alcohol. Maybe with the exception of caffeine (and other minor stimulants).


On the other hand, you have drugs like hallucinogens (psilocybin mushrooms, LSD) and entactogens (MDMA). In my opinion, these should be encouraged rather than prohibited, with social controls of course (as have existed across human history).

Of curse. Administered does. So the state administers daily does of heroin to anyone who wants it? You appear to have no clue as to reality from your warm fuzzy environment.

 

[J842P]

The difference between tobacco and heroin is the time it takes to kill you.

I can say from observation over the last 5 years that tobacco along with alcohol are major drivers in the overall cost of health care.

Someone who dealt with addicts told me nicotine addiction is harder to deal with than opioids.

Eh. Opioids, with controlled dosages, can be relatively safe. In the long term, the risk may be lower than tobacco products.

And alcohol is probably the worst drug in terms of societal effects. Something like 50% of murders happen when people are drunk (not an exact figure, but something shocking like that).

Sure, there are probably substances that might induce more anti-social behavior, but they are rarely used, they have a certain self-limiting nature (they generally are not euphoric).


Marijuana is probably the most benign of all the common drugs of abuse. It is definitely orders of magnitude less bad for the user and society than pretty much anything, certainly alcohol. Maybe with the exception of caffeine (and other minor stimulants).


On the other hand, you have drugs like hallucinogens (psilocybin mushrooms, LSD) and entactogens (MDMA). In my opinion, these should be encouraged rather than prohibited, with social controls of course (as have existed across human history).

Of curse. Administered does. So the state administers daily does of heroin to anyone who wants it? You appear to have no clue as to reality from your warm fuzzy environment.

No, I speak from vast amounts of experience doing drugs, knowing people who do drugs, and living in one of the hotspots of opioid abuse, the Tenderloin in San Francisco. I'm currently sitting in a coffeeshop and I can see a street dealer selling as I type this. Also, I speak from the perspective of someone who has relevant academic background.

Of course, I'm basing my opinions on the best empirical evidence available, in particular, various experiments in harm-reduction strategies in places like Portugal.


It is you who has a world-view not shaped by reality, but rather, by a stubborn commitment to doing the wrong approach after it has been repeatedly proven wrong and harmful.

 

[J842P]

Legalize illegal drugs now. What next, legalize pedophilia, sharia law and slavery? How about we do away with the judiciary altogether?

Hey Angelo, the adults are trying to have a conversation here. Why don't you go watch a youtube video of a Koran burning or something?

 

[angelo]

Legalize illegal drugs now. What next, legalize pedophilia, sharia law and slavery? How about we do away with the judiciary altogether?

Hey Angelo, the adults are trying to have a conversation here. Why don't you go watch a youtube video of a Koran burning or something?

The Koran and the Bible both make excellent stepladders where one just needs that extra couple of inches to reach an object just a little too high on a cupboard , or to use as a weapon to squash cockroaches etc. The pages of both can also be used as emergency dunny paper.

By the way, are you sure you're an adult!

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

I have a very favorable view of Iceland, but I wouldn't want them occupying my country militarily. It would be very awkward.