Police shooting in Atlanta aka "Sir, this is a Wendy's drive-through"

[Jimmy Higgins]

I don't know how good the officer's training was

Their training or their field competency. It could be noted that their training was great, but their field competency was awful. After all, an officer had his weapon seized from him. The officers couldn't subdue a single person. Officers felt like they needed to kill a guy who didn't have a gun.

Really, it simply looks like these people weren't up for the job. Yeah, sounds like it was a tough job, that one apprehension. Being a cop isn't supposed to be easy.

 

[Trausti]

I don't know how good the officer's training was

Their training or their field competency. It could be noted that their training was great, but their field competency was awful. After all, an officer had his weapon seized from him. The officers couldn't subdue a single person. Officers felt like they needed to kill a guy who didn't have a gun.

Really, it simply looks like these people weren't up for the job. Yeah, sounds like it was a tough job, that one apprehension. Being a cop isn't supposed to be easy.

I dunno. With the present hypercriticism of police these days, police naturally will be reluctant to use the initial necessary force resulting in overcompensation when things predictably go bad.

 

[repoman]

I don't know how good the officer's training was

Their training or their field competency. It could be noted that their training was great, but their field competency was awful. After all, an officer had his weapon seized from him. The officers couldn't subdue a single person. Officers felt like they needed to kill a guy who didn't have a gun.

Really, it simply looks like these people weren't up for the job. Yeah, sounds like it was a tough job, that one apprehension. Being a cop isn't supposed to be easy.

I dunno. With the present hypercriticism of police these days, police naturally will be reluctant to use the initial necessary force resulting in overcompensation when things predictably go bad.

Are suspects in general feeling more moral justification to resist arrest than before as well?

Both together spell bad outcomes.

 

[Jayjay]

It's not the police. It's the training of police. If there is no immediate safety issue support for citizen should be foremost concern. Weapons should not be considered at all. Tasers, guns, clubs, any action that might lead to force force should be off the table, probably stored in vehicle. If physical issue is involved in mind set of officers communicate from distance.

Asleep in car?

No problem.

Offer him/her ride home or to follow person home, treat to cup of coffee at coffee shop or diner, call relatives or support personnel to help person found. No need for bringing civil nor legal options options into play. If cop suspect he/she is impaired offer to bring support to recover person and property.

Yeah, it's all so ....logical.

Cops are public servants not advance military patrols.

Sleeping in a car is one thing. Passing out while DUI is something that maybe cops should not go so easy on. I suppose as a compromise they could help the guy home and let him get a court date by mail instead of arresting him at the spot, but I imagine most people don't think going easy on DUIs is a good idea.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

It's not the police. It's the training of police. If there is no immediate safety issue support for citizen should be foremost concern. Weapons should not be considered at all. Tasers, guns, clubs, any action that might lead to force force should be off the table, probably stored in vehicle. If physical issue is involved in mind set of officers communicate from distance.

Asleep in car?

No problem.

Offer him/her ride home or to follow person home, treat to cup of coffee at coffee shop or diner, call relatives or support personnel to help person found. No need for bringing civil nor legal options options into play. If cop suspect he/she is impaired offer to bring support to recover person and property.

Yeah, it's all so ....logical.

Cops are public servants not advance military patrols.

Sleeping in a car is one thing. Passing out while DUI is something that maybe cops should not go so easy on. I suppose as a compromise they could help the guy home and let him get a court date by mail instead of arresting him at the spot, but I imagine most people don't think going easy on DUIs is a good idea.

Since when was a court date going easy? What is accomplished by getting them in jail, or letting the guy sober up on site (the amount of time to do that would have been a bit less than the paper work involved with killing someone)?

They shouldn't get off, but is arrest and incarceration necessary? What is the public safety issue and how can it be worked out best?

 

[ZiprHead]

Here is the complete bodycam video of the incident.

[YOUTUBE]https://youtu.be/DhdpG2XzRXQ[/YOUTUBE]

 

[repoman]

It's not the police. It's the training of police. If there is no immediate safety issue support for citizen should be foremost concern. Weapons should not be considered at all. Tasers, guns, clubs, any action that might lead to force force should be off the table, probably stored in vehicle. If physical issue is involved in mind set of officers communicate from distance.

Asleep in car?

No problem.

Offer him/her ride home or to follow person home, treat to cup of coffee at coffee shop or diner, call relatives or support personnel to help person found. No need for bringing civil nor legal options options into play. If cop suspect he/she is impaired offer to bring support to recover person and property.

Yeah, it's all so ....logical.

Cops are public servants not advance military patrols.

Sleeping in a car is one thing. Passing out while DUI is something that maybe cops should not go so easy on. I suppose as a compromise they could help the guy home and let him get a court date by mail instead of arresting him at the spot, but I imagine most people don't think going easy on DUIs is a good idea.

Since when was a court date going easy? What is accomplished by getting them in jail, or letting the guy sober up on site (the amount of time to do that would have been a bit less than the paper work involved with killing someone)?

They shouldn't get off, but is arrest and incarceration necessary? What is the public safety issue and how can it be worked out best?

Hmm impound the car which is massive money, police escort with home and drop him off. But that act has liability. Taking to jail has none.

 

[Trausti]

It's not the police. It's the training of police. If there is no immediate safety issue support for citizen should be foremost concern. Weapons should not be considered at all. Tasers, guns, clubs, any action that might lead to force force should be off the table, probably stored in vehicle. If physical issue is involved in mind set of officers communicate from distance.

Asleep in car?

No problem.

Offer him/her ride home or to follow person home, treat to cup of coffee at coffee shop or diner, call relatives or support personnel to help person found. No need for bringing civil nor legal options options into play. If cop suspect he/she is impaired offer to bring support to recover person and property.

Yeah, it's all so ....logical.

Cops are public servants not advance military patrols.

Sleeping in a car is one thing. Passing out while DUI is something that maybe cops should not go so easy on. I suppose as a compromise they could help the guy home and let him get a court date by mail instead of arresting him at the spot, but I imagine most people don't think going easy on DUIs is a good idea.

Since when was a court date going easy? What is accomplished by getting them in jail, or letting the guy sober up on site (the amount of time to do that would have been a bit less than the paper work involved with killing someone)?

They shouldn't get off, but is arrest and incarceration necessary? What is the public safety issue and how can it be worked out best?

DUI is a crime, not an infraction. The driver is always arrested. Have to take him to police station for booking.

 

[Derec]

Are suspects in general feeling more moral justification to resist arrest than before as well?

Probably, given the amount of anti-police propaganda coming even from our elected offiicals.

Mayors like Keisha Bottoms, Bill deBlasio and Cori Lightfoot have made it more than clear that they will not have their officers' backs in case of a violent confrontation with a perp

 

[Loren Pechtel]

It would help if your side didn't continually misframe the situations. He was not killed for falling asleep. He was killed for shooting at a cop.

Cops were there because he was sleeping in the drive thru. Their handling of the situation led to a shooting. He was killed while running away. I'm willing to bet the department conditions of deadly force were not met.

Point what looks like a gun at a cop, deadly force conditions are met.

 

[Derec]

Here is the complete bodycam video of the incident.

[YOUTUBE]https://youtu.be/DhdpG2XzRXQ[/YOUTUBE]

Dude fell asleep/passed out again less than 30 seconds after initially talking to the cop. If it wasn't tragic, it would be laughable.
Other observations:
- he is talking about his girlfriend, but now we know he was married for 8 years. So he has a wife and a girlfriend? How do trifling guys like that get all that pussy?
- he insisted that his girlfriend dropped him off and that his rental Camry was already there. A likely story!
- he had no idea where he was. He thought he was in Forest Park on Old Dixie Hwy, which is quite a distance away in a whole different county. Ironically, it was a site of another (non-fatal though) police shooting just days earlier.
- "I'm 10. I'm very impaired" - "You feel very impaired?" - "Absolutely! I'm ok. [...]" - "I don't think that means what you think it means". Unexpected Inigo Montoya!

 

[Loren Pechtel]

There is only one model of tazer that has three shots. It's unknown if those police were using that model.

Also, tazers maximum range is ren feet. The guy running away was a lot further away than ten feet when he was shot. The cops were in absolutely no danger at that point.

From a discussion elsewhere they carry the two-shot version.

And police tasers can have ranges up to 35 feet. Civilian units are limited to 15 feet.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Are suspects in general feeling more moral justification to resist arrest than before as well?

Probably, given the amount of anti-police propaganda coming even from our elected offiicals.

Mayors like Keisha Bottoms, Bill deBlasio and Cori Lightfoot have made it more than clear that they will not have their officers' backs in case of a violent confrontation with a perp

Good. An incompetent officer shouldn't be on the force.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The autopsy was done and the shooting was ruled a homicide. Good. The word is that the cop will soon be charged with either manslaughter or murder.

There were so many better ways this could have been handled without killing the man.

Try again. Of course it's a homicide. Homicide does not mean murder.

 

[prideandfall]

Are suspects in general feeling more moral justification to resist arrest than before as well?

than before? before what?
the police have been a band of violent thugs used by those in power to oppress anyone who questions them for at least 2 centuries.
the only difference is that over time the bottom tier of society that is the subject of the most amount of that oppression has changed.
or has everyone just forgotten about police water-hosing people in the street, violently attacking unions and strikers, and overtly murdering black people left and right for most of this country's history?

it's becoming a big deal now because enough of the population of the US has been shoved into a lower economic class due to the machinations of republicans, and so a larger percentage of the people are both subjected to this treatment and aware of it whenever it happens due to social media. nothing about police behavior has changed, only the common awareness of it.

 

[laughing dog]

It would help if your side didn't continually misframe the situations. He was not killed for falling asleep. He was killed for shooting at a cop.

Cops were there because he was sleeping in the drive thru. Their handling of the situation led to a shooting. He was killed while running away. I'm willing to bet the department conditions of deadly force were not met.

Point what looks like a gun at a cop, deadly force conditions are met.

They had frisked him and tried to get him handcuffed. They had their firearms, which means they knew (or should have known) he did not have a firearm.

 

[ZiprHead]

There is only one model of tazer that has three shots. It's unknown if those police were using that model.

Also, tazers maximum range is ren feet. The guy running away was a lot further away than ten feet when he was shot. The cops were in absolutely no danger at that point.

From a discussion elsewhere they carry the two-shot version.

And police tasers can have ranges up to 35 feet. Civilian units are limited to 15 feet.

A TASER device fires two small dart-like electrodes, which stay connected to the main unit by conductive wire as they are propelled by small compressed nitrogen charges.[20][21] The cartridge contains a pair of electrodes and propellant for a single shot (or three shots in the X3 model) and is replaced after each use. There are a number of cartridges designated by range, with the maximum at 10 feet (3.048 m).[21] Cartridges available to non-law enforcement consumers are limited to 5 feet (1.524 m).[22]

 Taser

 

[Derec]

What a surprise. Dude has a lengthy record.

Apparently he was released on parole due to Corona. That explains why he became violent so suddenly - he knew he was in more trouble than just a DUI.

Why does the mainstream media not report any of this? Instead, all they want to report is that he had a bunch of kids.
Take this article for example of a particularly sorry excuse for journalism. All they purport to "know" about St. Rayshard is that he had children, that his daughter had a birthday, some family photos and this blatant lie by his cousin.

"That boy wasn't out there breakin' any crimes, he just went to get a bite to eat and fell asleep," his cousin said.

DUI is a crime, as is assault and battery.
Then the article abruptly stops. No background information whatsoever, we are not even told where he worked, much less his criminal record. That he was sentenced to 12 months for cruelty to children and 7 years for false imprisonment and theft is deemed as not important.

 

[Derec]

Are suspects in general feeling more moral justification to resist arrest than before as well?

than before? before what?

Before this wave of anti-police riots and pile-ons by weak elected officials like Bill deBlasio and Keisha Bottoms.

the police have been a band of violent thugs used by those in power to oppress anyone who questions them for at least 2 centuries.

Arresting a drunk driver for DUI is NOT oppression, which invalidates the rest of your post.

 

[Toni]

What a surprise. Dude has a lengthy record.

Apparently he was released on parole due to Corona. That explains why he became violent so suddenly - he knew he was in more trouble than just a DUI.

Why does the mainstream media not report any of this? Instead, all they want to report is that he had a bunch of kids.
Take this article for example of a particularly sorry excuse for journalism. All they purport to "know" about St. Rayshard is that he had children, that his daughter had a birthday, some family photos and this blatant lie by his cousin.

"That boy wasn't out there breakin' any crimes, he just went to get a bite to eat and fell asleep," his cousin said.

DUI is a crime, as is assault and battery.
Then the article abruptly stops. No background information whatsoever, we are not even told where he worked, much less his criminal record. That he was sentenced to 12 months for cruelty to children and 7 years for false imprisonment and theft is deemed as not important.

Because it isn’t important to this situation.

He got drunk, passed out having driven himself to a Wendy’s. So definitely a DUI. He resisted arrest—something that is not at all uncommon for a drunk person. The police shot him in the back as he ran away. They had other options: he could have been picked up at his home. They had his address and name.

There is zero doubt that he committed multiple crimes but he didn’t deserve to be shot in the back. Twice.