Religious arguments and analogies that really bother you

[bigfield]

Here's one I overheard that left me slack-jawed:

Some guy: (in a very loud voice) "Have you noticed that the whole world uses the same calendar to mark the year? Everyone refers to the current year as so-and-so AD, which stands for anno Domini, "the year of our lord, Jesus Christ". Why don't the Chinese and the Muslims have their own calendars?"

Listener, an Anglican priest: "That's because Christendom has dominated the world politically and economically for centuries."

Some guy: "Makes you think, though, doesn't it?" (leaves the building with a smug look on his face).

Priest: (what the fuck?)

 

[DrZoidberg]

Here's one I overheard that left me slack-jawed:

Some guy: (in a very loud voice) "Have you noticed that the whole world uses the same calendar to mark the year? Everyone refers to the current year as so-and-so AD, which stands for anno Domini, "the year of our lord, Jesus Christ". Why don't the Chinese and the Muslims have their own calendars?"

Listener, an Anglican priest: "That's because Christendom has dominated the world politically and economically for centuries."

Some guy: "Makes you think, though, doesn't it?" (leaves the building with a smug look on his face).

Priest: (what the fuck?)

But hasn't dominated the world enough to replace it with a Christian calendar using Christian words. Makes you think.

Soon I'll be celebrating New Years, when we meet to celebrate Janus, the god of new beginnings. But apparently Janus is a Christian god. Who knew? I'll tell that to all the other months named after Roman gods and pagan concepts, which is all of them. Something to ponder on Wednesday, perhaps? Wotan's day.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

The worst argument I ever heard actually made me sick to hear it.

The guy trying to convert me told me a horrible story from the news about a man who had sexually abused his daughter for years, ultimately giving her HIV. Then she found Jesus and forgave him. And the guy talking to me told me how glorious that God could use such a horrible tragedy to glorify God through her forgiving her father.

What the Fuck?

I mean, no. No, not just no, but fuck no. There's no glory in that.

 

[bigfield]

Here's one I overheard that left me slack-jawed:

Some guy: (in a very loud voice) "Have you noticed that the whole world uses the same calendar to mark the year? Everyone refers to the current year as so-and-so AD, which stands for anno Domini, "the year of our lord, Jesus Christ". Why don't the Chinese and the Muslims have their own calendars?"

Listener, an Anglican priest: "That's because Christendom has dominated the world politically and economically for centuries."

Some guy: "Makes you think, though, doesn't it?" (leaves the building with a smug look on his face).

Priest: (what the fuck?)

But hasn't dominated the world enough to replace it with a Christian calendar using Christian words. Makes you think.

Soon I'll be celebrating New Years, when we meet to celebrate Janus, the god of new beginnings. But apparently Janus is a Christian god. Who knew? I'll tell that to all the other months named after Roman gods and pagan concepts, which is all of them. Something to ponder on Wednesday, perhaps? Wotan's day.

Had the loudmouth stuck around, I'm sure the priest (or one of the many other people who heard) would have politely pointed out some of the many holes in his bizarre reasoning.

 

[credoconsolans]

Many of the examples people posted annoy me. I've had them all said to me.

Another one I dislike is "You must be very angry at god."

Uh,no, I'm not. Why would I be mad at something I don't believe in? I'm mad at YOU, not your imaginary friend.

The worst argument I ever heard actually made me sick to hear it.

The guy trying to convert me told me a horrible story from the news about a man who had sexually abused his daughter for years, ultimately giving her HIV. Then she found Jesus and forgave him. And the guy talking to me told me how glorious that God could use such a horrible tragedy to glorify God through her forgiving her father.

What the Fuck?

I mean, no. No, not just no, but fuck no. There's no glory in that.

Was the guy Catholic? They like lurid and gory tales to spice up their faith. I just ended an argument with a bunch of Christian folk who thought the story of a man murdering his wife in front of their child and the child later telling the story that Jesus came to her and comforted her during the violent murder and afterwards was "touching" and "wonderful".

My original response was that that was one of the worst stories I'd ever read.

My argument back to them was "What about the wife who was being beaten to death?" If Jesus can come to the child, why didn't he come and protect the wife? Stop the husband? Make himself to known to them as he did to a child and stop all the evil from being done in the first place?

They tried to argue 'free will' but then had no answer when I replied that Jesus interfered with the free will of the murdering father to traumatize his child, so why not continue to interfere?

- - - Updated - - -

Here's one I overheard that left me slack-jawed:

Some guy: (in a very loud voice) "Have you noticed that the whole world uses the same calendar to mark the year? Everyone refers to the current year as so-and-so AD, which stands for anno Domini, "the year of our lord, Jesus Christ". Why don't the Chinese and the Muslims have their own calendars?"

Listener, an Anglican priest: "That's because Christendom has dominated the world politically and economically for centuries."

Some guy: "Makes you think, though, doesn't it?" (leaves the building with a smug look on his face).

Priest: (what the fuck?)

LOL. Someone tried that with me.

I had the time to educate him. It was fun to inform him on how we came about the dating system and didn't having a calendar of the months of Roman gods and the Divine Augustus, and a week full of the holy days of Norse gods make HIM think?

He said nothing after that.

 

[ideologyhunter]

The canard that excuses every Bible atrocity and draconian law as necessary for the brutal times in which the Bible emerged.
"Um, can you really support a book which calls for the death penalty for sassy teenage boys -- or brides who can't prove they are virgins -- or people who pick up firewood on the Sabbath -- or folks who can't resist peeking into a magic box -- or travelers who complain that you served them the same magic food for day after day? Why should all these people be executed?"
"Well, you have to understand that God had to see His People survive to bring the new dispensation into being. They had to face incredible hardships and dangers, so strict morality and obedience were necessary for their very survival."
"And you can say God loves all his children and wants to enter into a loving relationship with them, when he marks out tribe after tribe for annihilation, and orders that their infants, elderly, even their livestock be put to death?"
"Again, he had to preserve the people who knew his true nature and worshiped the true god, so that Jesus could come forth from them and save the world."
(I had a religious door-knocker tell me that all the children who were slaughtered in these Old Testament genocides would be taken immediately by God into heaven. No matter that this is unsupported by the text and goes completely against the flared nostril bloodlust of books like Joshua. No matter that the morality of Joshua would be instantly recognizable to Reinhard Heydrich. Destroy the vermin!)

 

[James Brown]

(I had a religious door-knocker tell me that all the children who were slaughtered in these Old Testament genocides would be taken immediately by God into heaven. No matter that this is unsupported by the text and goes completely against the flared nostril bloodlust of books like Joshua. No matter that the morality of Joshua would be instantly recognizable to Reinhard Heydrich. Destroy the vermin!)

That, of course, would also excuse abortion, something that most evangelicals would never agree to.

As the man says, When people kill babies, that's bad. When God kills babies, that's different.

 

[Malintent]

I was reading from some Christians writing a while back who were ranting against atheists, how we are politically engaged, how irrational and immoral they perceive us to be, and those usual kinds of matters. The common analogy was raised of how a pot never questions the potter which made it, and therefore how humans should also not question that we have a creator too, and we should never question any command it gives us to obey either. There are all sorts of faults and fallacies with those arguments, and it is also just a really flawed analogy to describe the role that humans serve to the deity, even if the deity existed in the first place. It is an extremely frequent analogy to be used though. In reading it again just now, I realized just how much I am annoyed by this argument in particular, and how tired I am of seeing it too. If there was 1 apologetic argument that I wish I could wipe out from all of human history and modern theistic apologetics, it would be the pot/potter analogy. When someone raises it, it serves more to show me how little (quality) thought that person has given to their religious views, even when those views are serve as a heavy background that is very influential on that person and the rest of their worldview and beliefs as well.

Is there any particular argument that you see being raised at times by theists and evangelists, that you find particularly disturbing and annoying? Either a particularly common one or a particularly rare one, it just bugs you.




…yeah, it has been one of those kinds of days for me here…grrrrr…


Brian

I am totally fine with the pot/potter analogy. I actually like it a lot.... This is my response to "the nosey pot"

Does the pot complain that there are other pots in the room that have different shapes and colors? No.
Does the pot gather together to manipulate the potter into changing the rules of the workshop? No.
Does the pot accuse other pots of not being a good pot? No.
Does the pot want to make other pots do things they are not happy to do? No.
Does the pot want to prevent other pots from doing things they are happy to do? No.

The pot just sits there quietly and does nothing.
So be a good pot, sit down, and shut the fuck up

 

[ronburgundy]

If they want to be as dumb as pot, let 'em.

 

[Underseer]

(I had a religious door-knocker tell me that all the children who were slaughtered in these Old Testament genocides would be taken immediately by God into heaven. No matter that this is unsupported by the text and goes completely against the flared nostril bloodlust of books like Joshua. No matter that the morality of Joshua would be instantly recognizable to Reinhard Heydrich. Destroy the vermin!)

That, of course, would also excuse abortion, something that most evangelicals would never agree to.

As the man says, When people kill babies, that's bad. When God kills babies, that's different.

Authority-based moral systems inevitably lead to the most extreme form of moral relativism imaginable, which makes it ironic that they spend so much time complaining about moral relativism.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

The salvation myth was always a non-starter with me, that I should be interested in my soul and make sure I don't end up in hell. To this I learned to respond that no one has souls and it's just a bunch of ignorant, selfish, juvenile, fear-mongering, time-wasting bullshit. Used that on the Mormons years ago.

I remember a back porch conversation with my parents a couple decades ago. They were interested in my soul and the souls of my kids because we were no longer doing all the superstitious nonsense that came with our religious upbringing. I remember saying how hell was an immoral teaching because it divided families and communities, some ending up in hell, some in heaven. Their response was that it doesn't work like that, that we'd all be in heaven together. I think they were trying to make themselves feel better and not really trying to convince me that I should get back to church.

 

[ideologyhunter]

Jesus. Christmas dinner isn't enough? Relatives want you to be with them for eternity? Not that holidays don't seem like eternity. So, endless eons with your "loved ones", with no chance to go out to a movie or just a park to watch the ducks swim back & forth -- ANYTHING to get away from the circular conversations? "Remember I told you two eons ago that you need to match your coat to your shirt and slacks before you go out?"

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Ya, my wife and my step-mom just do not get along at all. I can't imagine them being forced to have to put up with each other for eternity. It wouldn't take more than a few billion years before one of them up and knifed a seraphim just so they'd be moved to the basement and not have to deal with the other anymore.

 

[Sarpedon]

Ah, but in heaven everyone gets along. They have to. THERE WILL BE NO TEARS.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Ah, but in heaven everyone gets along. They have to. THERE WILL BE NO TEARS.

Well, that's because disembodied spirits don't have tear ducts.

 

[bilby]

Ah, but in heaven everyone gets along. They have to. THERE WILL BE NO TEARS.

Well, that's because disembodied spirits don't have tear ducts.

Nah, it's because God is really good at sewing seams, and the robes worn in heaven are incredibly tough. There will be no tears, even if you snag a sleeve on a rose-bush.

 

[fromderinside]

.... which brings me to why are there rose-bushes in heaven?

 

[bilby]

.... which brings me to why are there rose-bushes in heaven?

Have you ever heard of one committing a sin??

 

[Underseer]

.... which brings me to why are there rose-bushes in heaven?

Have you ever heard of one committing a sin??

Flowering plants have both male and female parts, therefore all flowering plants are sinners.

When Adam ate the apple, that introduced sin into the world, and that's why so many animals choose to be homosexuals. We should not be surprised that many plants also choose sin in this fallen world!

 

[DrZoidberg]

Have you ever heard of one committing a sin??

Flowering plants have both male and female parts, therefore all flowering plants are sinners.

When Adam ate the apple, that introduced sin into the world, and that's why so many animals choose to be homosexuals. We should not be surprised that many plants also choose sin in this fallen world!

Ha ha... it's all so obvious now. Flowers are gay. Is that why ladies love the flowers? They're all secretly fag hags.