There are many, but let's take the Paris Match photo for example:
Paris Match (who has no reason to lie about it) says it was taken around 11am on July 17th, and the analysis of shadows shows that the time is beween 10am - 10:15am. It's further verified by other sightings in social media. But actually, asking for
single image is misleading. The most convincing evidence is that all the photos and videos corraborate each other. You are trying to point out some pedantic doubts about single dating of individual images, and indeed
some images or videos may be fake, but the scope of the conspiracy required to forge
all of them is so astounding that it's ridiculous.
We have photos and videos of the convoy which supposedly had the buk in it that can be dated, but this "mystery buk" isn't in any of them.
Actually, there is a
high probability that it was:
bellingcat said:
The Buk seen in Russia was dubbed “3×2” due to an obscured number on the side of the vehicle (as is the case with the ID numbers of many of the vehicles transported from Russia to Ukraine). The remaining parts of the numbers of the Buk photographed by Paris Match as well as the loading markings and white paint on the rubber side skirt below those numbers were in exactly the same position.
A burn mark above the exhaust visible in one of the Paris Match photographs was also in exactly the same position as the one seen on Buk 3×2 in Russia. While all of these pieces of evidence seemed to indicate that the Buk in Ukraine and Buk 3×2 were one and the same, an additional piece of evidence made the case particularly compelling. During Bellingcat’s research[40] into the many Buk sightings, it became clear that the rubber side skirt above the tracks of Buk missile launchers can become damaged over time and that this damage creates a unique “fingerprint” allowing different Buk photographs to be matched. In the case of Buk 3×2 and the Buk photograph by Paris Match in Donetsk, the side skirts were nearly identical.
It's not completely conclusive, but similarities are close enough to call it.
FAIL Jayjay.
I asked for a dated verified photo or video, and you give me this crap. I did not ask for you long winded justification for why you think this is real.
Now I will ask again. Do you have one verified and dated photo. This photo is neither dated nor verified.
This photo is "verified" by other photos on social media ...bwa ha hahahahahah
You are failing to understand the nature of how evidence is corraborated. The fact that the same truck with the same BUK was seen on the same day in multiple places along the route from Donetsk to Snizhne
is verification.
None of those photos can be verified. So you can't use unverified photos to verify another photo. What court would accept that? Not to mention you have just thrown out this vague allegation that somewhere are some photos. Once you start mentioning specific ones you will look pretty silly.
Any court in the world would accept this as evidence, and weigh is against other evidence. You specificly wanted to talk about a single image, and I specified why we know it's from the date that it is, from multiple sources (Paris Match, social media spottings, analysis of the shadows in the photo). What you dont' seem to get is that thsi isn't a 0% or 100% certainty. We might know one photo is depecting a certain event at a, say, 50% certainty. When you have two such photos confirming the same event, that's 75% certainty. Three photos, 88% certainty. And so on. The evidence
adds up.
What you are doings is basically irrelevant whining about pedantic details instead of looking at the big picture.
Do you even know who took them? Most of the photos and videos come from Ukrainain secret service. Why on earth would you take that at face value?
Where is
your proof that this photo comes from Ukrainian secret service? Actually, I bet you can't show me a single photo that you can prove to be from Ukrainian secret service by your own standards of verification. Why don't you apply your own ridiculous standards of verification on any of the claims you make?
I gave you a photo that is both dated and independently verified..
No you have not. At best you have Paris Match saying that the mysterious anonymous photographer (if they even exist) told them he/she took it on such and such a day.
Seeing as most pf the "evidence" comes from Ukrainian secret service there is a good chance this one did too.
Then it should be easy for you to give some evidence about the alleged link between Paris Match and Ukrainian secret service.
Fact remains, I gave pretty good reasons to think the Paris Match photo is genuine and that it was taken on moring of July 17th 2014. You have provided
zero evidence that it's not. You may do so in subsequent posts, but so far you haven't done so.
Paris Match have published photo-shopped photos before, and it is up to you to explain why you explain why anyone should accept it is real
Because Paris Match is a reputable newspaper (I asked you to prove otherwise, you have not even tried) and the photo is independently verified. If this was the only photo, and nobody else saw the truck, then you might have a point. But again you keep ignoring all the other evidence from the same day from multiple independent sources.
There seems to be a pretty good case it is photo-shopped too, but that is another hurdle you need to overcome. But first things first.
We have truckloads of fake evidence in this whole saga, so you need to somehow verify this one. It is very very easily done if it is real.
We also have truckloads of evidence that is
not fake. And if it is so easy to do, then why don't you take up my challenge and do it for some photo that you think is genuine, such as photos of Ukrainian BUKs.
You keep ignoring the elephant in the room which is that there are multiple lines of evidence that all point to the same conclusion. If all the evidence was made up or misinterpreted, they would likely point to random directions instead of forming any kind of a coherent narrative.
You keep ignoring that most or all of the "evidence" comes from Ukrainian secret service of from Ukrainians who had social media accounts associated with Ukrainain Nazi/ultra nationalist groups.
Or were you unaware of that? Or from social media accounts that appeared for minutes then were closed down
Yet you are trying to peddle this bullshit as reliable.
In your world, every Ukrainian is a nazi and every Russian is a saint. That's not valid argumentation, it's jsut demonizing your opponents.
The social media accounts where it was reported are people who collect these sightings. People who actually do, wouldn't set up twitter account becuase that would put their lives in danger. And of course, they probably have pro-Ukrainian leanings and some of them might even be described as nationalists. But the issue here isn't that the reporters would be inbiased, it's that it would be practically impossible to coordinate the kind of vast conspiracy where they all agree to post to twitter at specific times and fake photos from Donetsk to Zures to Snizhne and even Russia and French Newspapers according to some insanely elaborate plan.
But even then, it's of course possible that some reports you see in social media are made up, and that's why it should never be the only source. But even if unreliable, it serves as verification of other data. You would like to pretend that every piece of evidence exists in a vacuum, but it doesn't. It adds up: multiple lines of evidence, pointing to the same conclusion means that something was going on. Random forgeries are often suspicious precisely because they are outliers and oddities and don't match with other evidence.