RussiaGate

[whichphilosophy]

Watergate was about illegally breaking into a psychiatrists office to try to get incriminating evidence. Nixon went down for a coverup, not ordering the break in.

This is about using the Russians to hack into private accounts to try to get incriminating evidence. With the promise of reducing sanctions once in office.

The only question, and there are no tapes, is what and when did Trump know?

Somebody has already fallen on their sword over this.

If all else are faithful that may be as far as it goes.

There are no tapes, that we know of.

The last election was a competition to see which was the least un-electable. Trump lost because he won the electoral college vote. Both sides are into sleaze. This is politics not different in most cases to the UK.

I'm sure there are notes or even fake notes. CNN is part of a global media cartel but perhaps contains a few champagne socialists.

 

[whichphilosophy]

I think the woman is just trying to plug herself to as many important people as possible using any means.
She was acting on her own here. Sometimes cigar is just a cigar.

But why were Kushner and Manafort at the meeting? And this former KGB guy? And why was her case settled for pennies after Trump fired the prosecuting attorneys?

You would have to see the court records to know the reasoning or if it was not in court, the agreement.

 

[Deepak]

But why were Kushner and Manafort at the meeting? And this former KGB guy? And why was her case settled for pennies after Trump fired the prosecuting attorneys?

You would have to see the court records to know the reasoning or if it was not in court, the agreement.

When photons from a light source bounce off of court records the light and dark parts of the paper absorb differing amounts of that light, and then as the reflected light is absorbed by rods and cones in someone's eyes the brain is able to determine from the electrochemical connections from the rods and cones what shapes are on the paper. Once that has happened the brain attempts to determine from those shapes what characters are represented in the type, and from there constructs a linguistic interpretation of the combinations of characters into ideas that are being communicated by the use of letters.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

Both sides are into sleaze.

I see we are back to the "both sides do it fallacy". Your masters need a new playbook.

Oh and we find out that the ex-KGB agent at the meeting has a history of organizing cyber-attacks and hacks.

 

[SimpleDon]

... </snip> ...[/center]
What actually happened is that Trump Jr was told that there is some (unspecific) damaging information on Clinton. It would seem no transaction relating to this took place further than that point. Thus there was no agreement between the parties, hence no collusion unless facts can be produced to show otherwise.

During an election all the parties look in the sewers and troughs to see what their opponents have been getting up to.

... </snip> ...​

What is different about Trump junior's search for dirt is that he was willing to go to not only a foreign government to get his dirt, but this country's biggest enemy to get his dirt. In wartime this is called treason. I don't know why it should be called anything less now.

Russia is attacking our democracy to advance their own interests. They wish to prove to their own citizens and to the broader audience around the world that our democracy is just as corrupt as the Russian government is and that our oligarchs are just as willing and able to corrupt our government to enrich themselves as the Russian oligarchs are.

Trump must seem to be heaven sent to the Russians for their purposes, (heaven sent in an atheistic, metaphorical way, of course). Here is an American oligarch, who achieved this position through the heritable system that passed his grandfather's fortune, reportedly earned illegally from prostitution completely legally to Trump through his father. The same system of inter-generational money laundering that the Russian oligarchs want to use to pass their illegally gotten wealth to their own prodigy.

The icing on the cake for the Russians is that Trump is running under the banner of the party that has itself been undermining our democracy for a generation now to gain and to keep the political power required seemingly solely for the purpose of increasing the income and the wealth of the American oligarchy.

Given this level of shared goals and shared methods it wouldn't take long for the Russians and the Trumps to recognize it and to conspire together to achieve their mutual interests. Interests that are so closely aligned that there won't even have to be overt promises made to each other of what the pay off would be from the Trumps to the Russians for their help. Even an outfit as dense and incompetent as the Trumps are would realize this. It is virtually their entire business model. Which leads us once again to the now even more obvious question, is there anyone left here who still believes that we should run the government like a business?

 

[laughing dog]

I'm sure there are notes or even fake notes. CNN is part of a global media cartel but perhaps contains a few champagne socialists.

It takes a special type of intelligence that can manufacture conspiracy theories about Marxists and Marxism in the Women's March and socialists in CNN but cannot see/admit there was collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia.

 

[whichphilosophy]

Both sides are into sleaze.

I see we are back to the "both sides do it fallacy". Your masters need a new playbook.

Oh and we find out that the ex-KGB agent at the meeting has a history of organizing cyber-attacks and hacks.

Both sides is not a fallacy but a fact. Politics is all about sticking ones snout in the sewer and the trough to find dirt or something naughty about the opposition.

This certainly happened during the election re Pussycatgate and Pizzagate etc.

I'm sure Kushner may be a son like father as this comes often through mentoring but the investigation largely fell down on Russia actually influencing the election.

The politicians share the same sewer and look for dirt of any kind.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

I see we are back to the "both sides do it fallacy". Your masters need a new playbook.

Oh and we find out that the ex-KGB agent at the meeting has a history of organizing cyber-attacks and hacks.

Both sides is not a fallacy but a fact. Politics is all about sticking ones snout in the sewer and the trough to find dirt or something naughty about the opposition.

But you don't collude with a hostile foreign state to influence the election.

This certainly happened during the election re Pussycatgate and Pizzagate etc.

Neither of these things are colluding with a hostile foreign state looking to undermine our democracy.

The politicians share the same sewer and look for dirt of any kind.

No they don't. Only one side colluded with a hostile foreign state looking to undermine our democracy.

Both sides did not do it.

- - - Updated - - -

Current timeline: Updates on Mondays
http://billmoyers.com/story/the-trump-resistance-plan-a-timeline-russia-and-president-trump/

 

[whichphilosophy]

I'm sure there are notes or even fake notes. CNN is part of a global media cartel but perhaps contains a few champagne socialists.

It takes a special type of intelligence that can manufacture conspiracy theories about Marxists and Marxism in the Women's March and socialists in CNN but cannot see/admit there was collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia.

Do I have to quote their own websites again and the media they wrote for. This was based on fact not theory.

The unclassified report from the intelligence services does not conclude conclusion or that the Russians interfered with the election.
You can check the definitions in the report.

In the report highest certainty is not defined as certainty.

In fact it mentions RTV doing broadcasts. I would call that freedom of the press rather than interfering.

 

[whichphilosophy]

Both sides is not a fallacy but a fact. Politics is all about sticking ones snout in the sewer and the trough to find dirt or something naughty about the opposition.

But you don't collude with a hostile foreign state to influence the election.

This certainly happened during the election re Pussycatgate and Pizzagate etc.

Neither of these things are colluding with a hostile foreign state looking to undermine our democracy.

The politicians share the same sewer and look for dirt of any kind.

No they don't. Only one side colluded with a hostile foreign state looking to undermine our democracy.

Both sides did not do it.

- - - Updated - - -

Current timeline: Updates on Mondays
http://billmoyers.com/story/the-trump-resistance-plan-a-timeline-russia-and-president-trump/

We haven't concluded anything about Russia as given in the Intelligence own (unclassified) report.

 

[Opoponax]

I see we are back to the "both sides do it fallacy". Your masters need a new playbook.

Oh and we find out that the ex-KGB agent at the meeting has a history of organizing cyber-attacks and hacks.

Both sides is not a fallacy but a fact. Politics is all about sticking ones snout in the sewer and the trough to find dirt or something naughty about the opposition.

This certainly happened during the election re Pussycatgate and Pizzagate etc.

I'm sure Kushner may be a son like father as this comes often through mentoring but the investigation largely fell down on Russia actually influencing the election.

The politicians share the same sewer and look for dirt of any kind.

God. I can't believe I have to do this. It's been awhile since I had to have this conversation with one of my children, but here goes.

Two wrongs don't make a right. Understand that?

If Hillary has done something illegal, then fine, prosecute her for it as is appropriate. Now, if Hillary did do something illegal, it does not mitigate the illegalities Trump and his people have engaged in.

An attorney doesn't walk into a courtroom with his client, whom the lawyer is representing for aggravated assault and battery and say, "Well your honor, I read yesterday in the newspaper that another defendant who was up on somewhat similar charges had his case dismissed. Therefore, I move to dismiss the charges against my client."

That attorney would get laughed out of the courtroom and the judge might send a letter to the state bar reporting the questionableness of that attorney's character and fitness to practice law.

The same applies here. You don't seem to understand the most basic concepts in play. I'll make no assumptions as to why. I'm pretty sure personal insults are verboten here and I'll honor that.

This^ was 6 minutes of my life I'll never get back.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

We haven't concluded anything about Russia as given in the Intelligence own (unclassified) report.

The evidence is becoming clearer and only those who wish to obfuscate the evidence are arguing that nothing was going on.

 

[barbos]

I think the simplest explanation is the best: Veselnitskaya's job was to find out if the Trump campaign would nibble.

And they did.

That's a plausible theory, but I still like mine better.

 

[ZiprHead]

 

[HelixSpiral]

View attachment 11837

Lol. I'm so tired of the term "nothing burger" though.

 

[laughing dog]

It takes a special type of intelligence that can manufacture conspiracy theories about Marxists and Marxism in the Women's March and socialists in CNN but cannot see/admit there was collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia.

Do I have to quote.....

You should get the tinfoil fixed on your hat. And, perhaps, at least try to actually address the content of a post instead of babbling smoke screens.

 

[Keith&Co.]

Lol. I'm so tired of the term "nothing burger" though.

As someone who directly remembers the original Watergate scandal, i suspect you're going to have to learn to live with it...

 

[Deepak]

Do I have to quote.....

You should get the tinfoil fixed on your hat. And, perhaps, at least try to actually address the content of a post instead of babbling smoke screens.

Might I suggest:

 

[barbos]

By the way, It seems that they are saying the reason why Jr. twitted emails is becasue NY times got a hold of them and was going to release them anyway. So the interesting question is, how did they get these emails? hacking? Gallstone sold them NY Times?

 

[Tom Sawyer]

By the way, It seems that they are saying the reason why Jr. twitted emails is becasue NY times got a hold of them and was going to release them anyway. So the interesting question is, how did they get these emails? hacking? Gallstone sold them NY Times?

Look! Over there!

Quick, everybody get distracted!