"Sanders supporters have weaponized Facebook"

[Jolly_Penguin]

The point only comes up against Bernie supporters. I wonder why that is.

Because they openly admit to it. And, even if HRC supporters did it to Obama, Obama won.

That's your queue Koy "so did Hillary" lmao

 

[ZiprHead]

I think the idea of the Bernie supporter who would refuse to vote for any other candidate is pretty much BS. Yea, there is a small percentage that might be stupid and either not vote or vote for someone other than the Democratic party's nominee, but I think you would find that with just about any primary candidate, and it certainly is unlikely to be a majority.

View attachment 25851

Exactly. And amazingly this complaint only rises against Sanders.... When a bunch of Hillary supporters did it regarding Obama (and she herself was hesitant to say she would vote Bernie over Trump), and there is no reason whatsoever to expect the same would not happen with some Biden supporters regarding Bernie.

The point only comes up against Bernie supporters. I wonder why that is.

As has already been posted before:

That was then, this is now: https://www.newsweek.com/bernie-sanders-poll-warren-biden-2020-nominee-emerson-college-1483831:

Only a small majority of Bernie Sanders voters say they will definitely support the eventual Democratic nominee at the 2020 election if the independent Vermont senator does not win the race, according to a poll.

The National Emerson College Poll of 1,128 registered voters between January 21 and January 23 found that 53 percent of Sanders supporters said "yes" when asked if they would support the Democratic nominee even if it is not their candidate.

 

[marc]

Exactly. And amazingly this complaint only rises against Sanders.... When a bunch of Hillary supporters did it regarding Obama (and she herself was hesitant to say she would vote Bernie over Trump), and there is no reason whatsoever to expect the same would not happen with some Biden supporters regarding Bernie.

The point only comes up against Bernie supporters. I wonder why that is.

Yea, looking for that data found a number of old articles on Hillary supporters bashing Obama supporters, and that there were some Hillary or no one voters back then. In all honestly I don't think anyone can get together a few million supporters and have none of them be shitty to the supporters of other candidates. (what the candidates themselves do/encourage is a different story)

For myself I voted Bernie in the primary and Hillary in the general. While I might disagree with a bunch of her stances, she was a far better candidate then Trump. And this year will be the same, Sanders in the primary, whoever in the general. I'm not liking Biden's politics, but he is better than the alternative.

 

[Jolly_Penguin]

If a candidate like Bernie or Yang can get both your vote and the vote of a former Trump supporter isn't that a good thing? Not everyone in your country sees Trump as you do. Some people actually see Democrats generally as bad and make an exception for this one candidate. That means you can win their vote with this candidate and have a better shot at winning the election. That's a good thing if they also happen to be pushing progressive policy.

Party unity is fine and all, for your fellow tribal Dems. But that's not the whole of these candidates' support and that's a good thing.

 

[PyramidHead]

For decades, the left has been told to fall in line, to wait for an election that isn't so damn important to push their agenda, or to compromise with people who don't care about what we care about. The ones telling us this shriek and wail when confronted with a fraction of the intransigence they have been dishing out for the entire modern political era. For once, you need to fall in line, and back the movement that represents the next generation of voters and the only response to the problems we face that isn't afraid to fight hard enough to solve them, or step aside and take the snarky Twitter posts from Amazon warehouse workers on the chin.

 

[Toni]

Did you read what I said? I don't vote for colors or parties, I vote for policy agendas. If you do the same, and you happen to prefer a candidate with a policy agenda different than mine, then you should vote for that candidate. But I have no obligation to vote for him or her, because I don't signal how enlightened and above-the-fray I am by constantly calling for Dem unity.

If you're so worried about Bernie's supporters staying home if he isn't nominated, and those votes were enough to cost Clinton the election in 2016, hand-wringing and name-calling are far less effective coping strategies than the obvious one: put all your weight behind supporting Bernie and get those votes. Yes, it feels better to call them babies, yes, you will have to spend time with people you don't like, but surely you're mature enough to put such things aside when the alternative is a Trump victory, right? If you're so concerned about that outcome, and have no ability to change the minds of the Bernie voters who won't show up if he doesn't get nominated, then why don't you do what's best for the country instead of gnashing your teeth about things you can't change? Surely you agree that now is not the time for a purity test, when Trump is running for POTUS!

I asked a simple question that required a simple answer, and I get more Bernie Bro babble.

I will rephrase my question. In the unlikely event that the Democrats do something incredibly stupid and nominate someone for President other than Savior Sanders, are you willing to educate the rightly disappointed Sanders supporters into voting blue?

No, because I don't vote blue no matter who. I'm one of those narcissistic babies you have no choice but to accommodate, lest you reveal yourself as caring more about purity than beating Trump. Was that somehow not obvious from what I said?

So Bernie is so good that you can’t think of a single reason that someone who wasn’t convinced that he’s their guy would want to vote for him?

That’s what I thought.

Unfortunately for you, I’ve raised children to adulthood and temper tantrums and holding your breath and stamping your feet do not impress me at all. It is clear that you care only about having your own way and not about governing or the future of the nation or the world. You are as nihilistic as all of those trumpsters so eager for The Rapture that you’re all happy to bring it on if you don’t get your way.

Also: I’ve never been fond of Kool Aide.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Russian "bots" can weaponize Facebook because apparently Americans can't think for themselves, or so some would have to believe. It's really not that. It's really a convenient excuse for the Dems to point fingers at without actually considering what they can change about themselves to attract more support.

Europe as well. Seriously, you clearly aren't paying attention to much of anything.

Are your minds really so weak that you let Facebook tell you who to vote for?

The Electoral College was created because of exactly that!

Sure, there are Russian efforts to influence your elections.

Ours, Canada's, Britain, France, Germany, EU...

The reverse is also true.

Thanks for the Trumpesque reflection.

But oh no the Russians have Facebook accounts. The horror! Meanwhile you still have the electoral college and corruption running wild in Washington.

Did you have a point?

 

[PyramidHead]

No, because I don't vote blue no matter who. I'm one of those narcissistic babies you have no choice but to accommodate, lest you reveal yourself as caring more about purity than beating Trump. Was that somehow not obvious from what I said?

So Bernie is so good that you can’t think of a single reason that someone who wasn’t convinced that he’s their guy would want to vote for him?

That’s what I thought.

Unfortunately for you, I’ve raised children to adulthood and temper tantrums and holding your breath and stamping your feet do not impress me at all. It is clear that you care only about having your own way and not about governing or the future of the nation or the world. You are as nihilistic as all of those trumpsters so eager for The Rapture that you’re all happy to bring it on if you don’t get your way.

Also: I’ve never been fond of Kool Aide.

You have two options: vote for Bernie Sanders in the primary or risk alienating half his base and losing the general election to Trump. That's the natural implication of the premises that his base is (a) large, (b) diverse, and (c) unwilling to vote for someone else. If that's what you believe, own it and act accordingly.

You chose a third option, which is to scold them for being unreasonable, and I hope it makes you feel better to do so, but it doesn't solve the original problem. When Trump replaces RBG with a Christian fundamentalist lunatic and abortion is outlawed, will you be able to sleep at night knowing you could have stopped it if only you rallied behind the candidate whose base was necessary to defeat Trump?

 

[Jolly_Penguin]

Did you have a point?

Yes. That posts on Facebook are posts on Facebook. Why SHOULDN'T people form other countries have the same free speech and have opinions they want to express? And if a nation wants to push an agenda within the US (hello Israel) that's hardly a big deal if it doesn't involve US style regime change with guns and drones.

If your minds are so fragile that you can't handle some mild propaganda for interests that don't line up with your own, you have much bigger problems. Its Facebook for crying out loud.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Did you have a point?

Yes. That posts on Facebook are posts on Facebook. Why SHOULDN'T people form other countries have the same free speech and have opinions they want to express?

BOTs aren't people. Just an FYI there. Because you might not have known that. I mean, you should have, but it clearly isn't apparent that you do when you state the above.

If your minds are so fragile that you can't handle some mild propaganda for interests that don't line up with your own, you have much bigger problems. Its Facebook for crying out loud.

So your point is, "what is a little harmless propaganda". Got it.

 

[PyramidHead]

Reminder that Russia is simply returning the favor for what the US did in 1996 for Boris Yeltsin with much more insidious and invasive manipulation than popups on your friend feed

These three Americans arrived in Russia in late February 1996 and worked for four months, from March 1 to the presidential election held on July 3. They were paid $250,000 plus all expenses and had an unlimited budget for polling, focus groups and other research.

To hide their identities, they described themselves as representing Americans eager to sell thin-screen televisions in Russia. They were housed in a government-secured hotel guarded by policemen armed with machine guns.

Based upon their initial polling, they determined that Yeltsin was favored by only 6 percent of the electorate and was “trusted” as a competent leader by an even smaller proportion. “Stalin had higher positives and lower negatives than Yeltsin,” said Dresner.

“We actually tested the two in polls and focus groups. More than 60 percent of the electorate believed Yeltsin was corrupt; more than 65 percent believed he had wrecked the economy. We were in a deep, deep hole.”