Sarcasm kills, pizzagate

[funinspace]

What make you think it started as a joke? It looks like just another incident of the current, rampant conspiracy theorizing.

Come on! It's preposterous. It's all based around a guy looking a bit too happy in a picture.

Every time I think something is toooooo preposterous, I just have to look at some of my in-laws facebook pages, and then I realize that it is often hard to tell...

We had the sitting governor of Texas, a US Senator, and a Representative fanning the flames of insanity over a joint exercise in realistic military training (RMT) known as Jade Helm 15 last year. Yeah those politicians could have been cynically doing it to leverage their political position career, but lots of people certainly didn't so. Ted Cruz, I'm sure is just a cynical asshat. But Representative Louie Gohmert seems to be a real deal whack-job. The governor I don't know enough about...maybe a few Texans here could share their thoughts on Gov. Abbott...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jade_Helm_15_conspiracy_theories#Politicians

On April 28, Texas Governor Greg Abbott ordered the Texas State Guard to monitor the operation, declaring, "During the training operation, it is important that Texans know their safety, constitutional rights, private property rights and civil liberties will not be infringed."[23][29]

On May 2, 2015, Republican Presidential candidate and Texas senator Ted Cruz said he had "reached out to the Pentagon to inquire about this exercise." In comments to Bloomberg News at the South Carolina Republican Party's annual convention, he said:

We are assured it is a military training exercise. I have no reason to doubt those assurances, but I understand the reason for concern and uncertainty, because when the federal government has not demonstrated itself to be trustworthy in this administration, the natural consequence is that many citizens don't trust what it is saying.[30][31]

On May 5, 2015, U.S. Representative Louie Gohmert, Republican from the 1st District of Texas, and Vice Chair of the Judiciary Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism and Homeland Security, voiced his concern in a statement, saying his "office has been inundated with calls referring to the Jade Helm 15 military exercise" with concerns that the U.S. Army is preparing for "modern-day martial law". He noted a political consideration, saying, "I was rather appalled that the hostile areas amazingly have a Republican majority, 'cling to their guns and religion,' and believe in the sanctity of the United States Constitution", and asserted that "the map of the exercise needs to change, the names on the map need to change, and the tone of the exercise needs to be completely revamped so the federal government is not intentionally practicing war against its own states."[31][32][33]

On May 7, 2015, Terry McAuliffe, the Democratic Governor of Virginia, called Abbott's mobilizing of the Texas State Guard in response to the training exercise "one of the dumbest things I have ever heard".[34]

Michele Hickford, the editor-in-chief of Allen West's website, discussed the timing of the Obama administration's order to ban some military-grade equipment from local law enforcement agencies in the context of the Jade Helm 15 exercise, as a plan to "disarm" the police and implement a "Federalization" of the police

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Those people on reddit don't look like they're joking.

That's the nature of sarcasm. It could always be sincere.

Sarcasm usually has a sense of humor somewhere.

 

[blastula]

There are occasions where a joke has started a fake conspiracy like this. I am curious if DrZ had information on that here.

 

[RavenSky]

It's not based on one thing, it's based on lots of tidbits of information and innuendo that are connected in a way meaningful to conspiracy theorists. Absurdness is of little hindrance to widespread belief (see religion). This story is still ridiculous now and is still widely believed.

Pizzagate: From rumor, to hashtag, to gunfire in D.C. - The Washington Post

“I was one of the first [to spread this bullshit],”Pettibone said in a brief conversation Tuesday. She said she would not take part in an interview: “I’m uninclined to speak to mainstream media because during the election cycle, they made the right look like nut jobs...

Maybe because she IS a fucking nut job?

Segol called the woman and spelled out his baroque story. He quoted from an H.G. Wells story called “In the Days of the Comet,” and he wondered whether the symbols on the sign — crescents and stars — might reveal a message about sexual misdeeds or satanic rituals.

The woman listened to some of this, then told Segol, “You’re an idiot.” She hung up on him.

The woman is correct! These people are insane. All of them... not just the shooter. And they vote. No wonder we ended up with Trump.

 

[repoman]

Most here would think this is a useless mental exercise, but is there some place that does a full impartial analysis of the full range of accusations about Pizzagate?

Especially a source that admit that some the things around Pizzagate appear slightly creepy - such as some of the artwork. But appearing creepy compared to a full on pedophile ring is massive, stunning leap.

What I mean is that only a fully exhaustive analysis will put this to rest. There must be some sticklers who have the free time to look into this.

Pizzagate is the new 9/11 conspiracy fad - and concerning 9/11 the farthest I could ever go is that it might have been that the powers that be knew it was coming and decided to let it. But holy shit, planned implosion of the two towers is madness.

---------------------------

Playing devil's advocate, assume that there is a pedophile ring that the Pizzagate netizen investigators are close to uncovering, but it would take the FBI taking control of it and using their powers to fully open it up. The FBI clearly has the ability to look into it and whatever the creepiest things are related to it.

So basically it boils down to thinking that the people who are running this satanic pedophile ring are so powerful that the FBI is being pushed around by them. The same FBI that torched Clinton who was being paid by quite a few rich businesses.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Most here would think this is a useless mental exercise, but is there some place that does a full impartial analysis of the full range of accusations about Pizzagate?

Yes.

Right here.

It's stupid.

Done.

 

[repoman]

<snip>

 

[Trausti]

<snip>

 

[repoman]

lol

 

[repoman]

ahh, sorry that painting is by Djurdjevic, Tony (brother of John) Podesta has another painting by him in his home.

Wouldn't let the painter around kids unless I understood and trusted some other reason than a creepy one as to why he painted it.

 

[fast]

It's going to take more than a judicial outcome to alleviate suspicion. Geez

But it shouldn't. A witch hunt society makes nobody happy.

I'm not saying that mere suspicion warrants a witch hunt, but it demands caution. We are fallible humans and often prone to err, and no judgement (whether one of our own or a dozen by our peers) guarantee the truth of our beliefs. If you are found not guilty of theft by the legal system or found not guilty of child molestation by the same, then yes, you may have earned a stay by those that might otherwise congregate for a good Salem burning, but because of the overhanging doubt that has been cast, and unfortunate as it might be, you just might not be first in running for hire to safe guard the goods of others, and for certain I will refrain from chastising those that choose to not leave their child with you alone. After all, as there is no guarantee that the judgement of those in the legal system are on point, there is no certainty that suspicions held by the parent that holds their child is misplaced. So, with you I agree, no witch hunt should be in the making, but suspicion is not something than can be so easily laid to rest.

 

[DrZoidberg]

It's not based on one thing, it's based on lots of tidbits of information and innuendo that are connected in a way meaningful to conspiracy theorists. Absurdness is of little hindrance to widespread belief (see religion). This story is still ridiculous now and is still widely believed.

Pizzagate: From rumor, to hashtag, to gunfire in D.C. - The Washington Post

I think 99.9% of those posters were trolls having a laugh. I think the only people who took it seriously had serious mental problems, including the guy from North Carolina.

 

[DrZoidberg]

There are occasions where a joke has started a fake conspiracy like this. I am curious if DrZ had information on that here.

I'm convinced that's how all religions start. All it takes is just one guy who doesn't get it, and POW, a new world religion.

 

[funinspace]

Especially a source that admit that some the things around Pizzagate appear slightly creepy - such as some of the artwork. But appearing creepy compared to a full on pedophile ring is massive, stunning leap.

And just WTF is 'creepy art'? Just go to any big city art museum and I'll bet you find 10 times more 'creepy art' there than whatever is at this pizza joint.

I recently went to my local art museum, and they had a big Andy Warhol exhibit. And there was even a 'sexually explicit' warning at the passage way to the small room where there was some rather peculiar art drawings...almost creepy. Should I be worried that the museum staff is running a pedophile ring out of their basement? I'll bet some of these same people go to big downtown banks to make 'transactions', so they must be laundering money as well....

 

[DrZoidberg]

Especially a source that admit that some the things around Pizzagate appear slightly creepy - such as some of the artwork. But appearing creepy compared to a full on pedophile ring is massive, stunning leap.

And just WTF is 'creepy art'? Just go to any big city art museum and I'll bet you find 10 times more 'creepy art' there than whatever is at this pizza joint.

I recently went to my local art museum, and they had a big Andy Warhol exhibit. And there was even a 'sexually explicit' warning at the passage way to the small room where there was some rather peculiar art drawings...almost creepy. Should I be worried that the museum staff is running a pedophile ring out of their basement? I'll bet some of these same people go to big downtown banks to make 'transactions', so they must be laundering money as well....

There's loads of art where the whole point is creepiness. I mean... horror. All creepiness. I love it.

The saddest part of the today's world are all the people afraid of being offended. It's like we need to be protected against bad feelings all the time. It's so incredibly sad. Whatever happened to free speech?

 

[KeepTalking]

ahh, sorry that painting is by Djurdjevic, Tony (brother of John) Podesta has another painting by him in his home.

Wouldn't let the painter around kids unless I understood and trusted some other reason than a creepy one as to why he painted it.

Biljana Djurdjevic is a contemporary female artist from Serbia, and describes her artwork as depicting victims of contemporary culture. After perusing some of her art, however, I don't think she confines herself to that theme. A couple of her paintings are just woodland scenes with no people depicted in them. I noticed one that fits her general theme that is of an apparently dead Santa Claus splayed out across a dining table. Children are often victims of the culture in which they find themselves being brought up, so it is not unexpected that much of her artwork would depict vulnerable children. Tony Podesta is a collector of contemporary art, so why wouldn't he have a painting of hers in his collection of more than a thousand works of art?

The only reason I know all of this is because, previous to reading the posts naming Djurdjevic in this thread, the only artist I knew of by that name was Marko Djurdjevic, who is an illustrator for Marvel Comics, and has produced some amazing comic book cover art. His art can be a bit edgy for a comic book artist, but I didn't think any of it was creepy enough to fit the bill for the Pizzagate bullshit, nor did I think any serious art collector, like Podesta, would be at all interested in his art, so I went looking for more information.

Anyway, I thought some of the alt-right leaning participants in this thread could use a bit of context to mediate their Pizzagate delusions. Not that it will help much if they are really that far gone into conspiracy land.

 

[another1]

Djurdjevic is awesome. Rich people like sick art. Rich people deserve to show it off.

Alefantis' snapchat was tame. Nothing there. Just a creep who probably does like his slices fresh. But who cares

I used "pizza" and variations of pie topping as drug code back in the day. Who doesn't use pizza code for one thing or another? Why even TRY to piece that together from the leaked emails?

So this could go nowhere, but these conspiracy theory assholes put everything into it. There are way more plausible conspiracies to enjoy researching, and the time and energy wasted with this mess IS the conspiracy in this case. "Nobody believes nothin no more" is obviously one desired result.

 

[repoman]

This is a bit of a tangent, but were there any rumors about Jimmy Saville that were close to what he and others were engaged in?

 

[DrZoidberg]

This is a bit of a tangent, but were there any rumors about Jimmy Saville that were close to what he and others were engaged in?

That's actually pretty horrible. It seems like everybody around him knew something. Just that they kept quiet about it hoping it was a limited thing. And because of that nobody pieced together the full picture. It wasn't after he was dead that people started speaking up. And in hind-sight in interviews it was pretty obvious that something was off.

I blame victim-shaming. It's got to be ok to be the victim of stuff like this. As long as we treat victims as "damaged goods" they have an incentive to shut up about it. And these guys can keep going.

And he did get a knighthood from the Catholic church. A clue if there ever was one.

 

[repoman]

Is the US MSM pushing this story aside for now?