Soccer

[steve_bank]

I have watched some games over here mostly Bundesliga and Primer leagues.

I do not see much difference in the level of play, but the I have not watched a lot.

Only a few times have I seen coordinated play leading to a goal.

Most of it seems hit or miss.

Is there a European hierarchy of leagues? Over her we have major leagues and minor leagues. We also have semi-pro football, baseball, and basketball leagues.

Where does FIFA fit in?

I do not doubt the physical condition neded for the sport. It sems nea impossible to directly move the ball end to end.

Are there strategies and specific player roles other than goalie? Seems like it comes down to 1 or 2 players on a team for goals. Blocking is not allowed and I do not see coordinated action by multiple players.

 

[TSwizzle]

I hardly watch soccer now but watched a Bundesliga game last night. Bayren Munich won 3-0 against some other team. I never watch the MLS for more than five minutes. The main European leagues (England, Spain, Italy, the ones with TV coverage) are pretty stagnant now, mostly dominated by the same three or four teams. Depending on the teams involved, goals are created by various means, the good skillful teams can create scoring chances by quick, slick passing. Less skillful teams hoof the ball into the danger area and see what happens. The strategies vary. Less skillful team sit back and defend and hope to break out quickly, other teams will pass the ball to death and hope their opponents are so bored they lose concentration. Others look like they don't have a strategy and are just aimlessly booting the ball in the direction the player is facing. Some teams can't string more than two passes together, even the good teams have an off day where this can happen. Soccer is not as easy to play as it looks. Most leagues have a top tier league and have lower leagues, at least two lower leagues. Teams are promoted to the top tier by winning the lower league. Bottom of the top tier will get relegated to the lower league, sometimes this involves a playoff.

 

[rousseau]

Soccer is not as easy to play as it looks.

So true. Having played soccer until I was 18 I still find it amazing to watch premier league players cross the ball across the field almost directly onto a players foot. The brunt of premier league players are so good that they make this look easy, but just that simple placement is incredibly hard at that distance. Actually doing pretty much anything with your feet with fine control takes a ton of practice.

You can really see the difference in skill-level here when you move from the premier league down to the championship, or even those near the relegation zone in the premier league.

Most leagues have a top tier league and have lower leagues, at least two lower leagues. Teams are promoted to the top tier by winning the lower league. Bottom of the top tier will get relegated to the lower league, sometimes this involves a playoff.

I believe in England the leagues form an entire pyramid with thousands of teams, all theoretically in the same system.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The EPL has the best parity, hands down. The problem with La Liga is you are just waiting for Barcelona or Real Madrid to win their game of the week. Bundesliga has little competition at all. The football leagues in Europe are not like the US, as each team is independent and teams move up, move down, or stay in their respective ladder based leagues based on their annual performance, top three/four. Imagine the Rochester Rhinos advancing to the MLS merely by winning their second division league, not because their own paid the annually required pyramid scheme franchise fee. Read up on AFC Wimbledon to get a feel for how deep the ladder of leagues is.


Strategies involve plugging gaps, pressing to regain possession, parking the bus, counter attacks. You never know what you'll get sometimes in an EPL match.

I hardly watch soccer now but watched a Bundesliga game last night. Bayren Munich won 3-0 against some other team. I never watch the MLS for more than five minutes.

I like watching soccer and almost never watch the MLS. I feel bad barely even knowing that the playoffs are going on.

 

[TSwizzle]

Soccer is not as easy to play as it looks.

So true. Having played soccer until I was 18 I still find it amazing to watch premier league players cross the ball across the field almost directly onto a players foot. The brunt of premier league players are so good that they make this look easy, but just that simple placement is incredibly hard at that distance. Actually doing pretty much anything with your feet with fine control takes a ton of practice.

You have to have a natural ability to start with. Most people, even if they practiced 18 hours a day would never come close to being as good as a top tier player and even if they practiced all day, every day they would never be as good as say, Messi or Ronaldo. And then there is the mystery of the donkey Lukaku, terrible first touch, couldn't trap a bag of cement and yet plays in the EPL.

You can really see the difference in skill-level here when you move from the premier league down to the championship, or even those near the relegation zone in the premier league.

You notice it more where they can't place a pass to a team mate that is only a few meters away from them.

I believe in England the leagues form an entire pyramid with thousands of teams, all theoretically in the same system.

They are part of the same body, the Football Association but I am not sure the structure once you get beyond the top three leagues. I think it is broken into regions.

 

[rousseau]

The EPL has the best parity, hands down. The problem with La Liga is you are just waiting for Barcelona or Real Madrid to win their game of the week. Bundesliga has little competition at all. The football leagues in Europe are not like the US, as each team is independent and teams move up, move down, or stay in their respective ladder based leagues based on their annual performance, top three/four. Imagine the Rochester Rhinos advancing to the MLS merely by winning their second division league, not because their own paid the annually required pyramid scheme franchise fee. Read up on AFC Wimbledon to get a feel for how deep the ladder of leagues is.


Strategies involve plugging gaps, pressing to regain possession, parking the bus, counter attacks. You never know what you'll get sometimes in an EPL match.

I hardly watch soccer now but watched a Bundesliga game last night. Bayren Munich won 3-0 against some other team. I never watch the MLS for more than five minutes.

I like watching soccer and almost never watch the MLS. I feel bad barely even knowing that the playoffs are going on.

Anymore the Champions League seems to be what people are really interested in. Winning domestic leagues no longer seems to carry the same prestige, probably owing to the lack of parity.

Really, these days I'm more interested in what Messi and Ronaldo are doing than anything else. The last decade or so are going to be defined by their accomplishments. I'll turn on Barca FC basically just to watch Messi.

 

[TSwizzle]

I like watching soccer and almost never watch the MLS. I feel bad barely even knowing that the playoffs are going on.

It doesn't seem to be a very good standard from what I have seen, on a par with the Mexican league which is pretty poor. Seems more physical and less flair.

 

[TSwizzle]

I'll turn on Barca FC basically just to watch Messi.

I used to count myself as a Barca fan back in the day but now it is fashionable I have stepped back. I'm going back to the days when Schuster, Victor, Archibald played. When Iniesta and Xavi were playing, they were worth watching. Great players.

 

[rousseau]

I like watching soccer and almost never watch the MLS. I feel bad barely even knowing that the playoffs are going on.

It doesn't seem to be a very good standard from what I have seen, on a par with the Mexican league which is pretty poor. Seems more physical and less flair.

Just doesn't have the popularity or money yet. I'd almost go as far as calling soccer a niche sport in North America. It's definitely growing, but nowhere near the same popularity as in Europe.

 

[TSwizzle]

Just doesn't have the popularity or money yet. I'd almost go as far as calling soccer a niche sport in North America. It's definitely growing, but nowhere near the same popularity as in Europe.

I would be willing to attend MLS games if it were cheap and close by. But for TV audience, MLS is going to struggle competing against the EPL, Bundisliga and Champions League (Mexican league too) which are all heavily televised in the USA. I mean, we get three EPL games on a Saturday plus two on a Sunday. How can MLS compete against that ?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Just doesn't have the popularity or money yet. I'd almost go as far as calling soccer a niche sport in North America. It's definitely growing, but nowhere near the same popularity as in Europe.

I would be willing to attend MLS games if it were cheap and close by. But for TV audience, MLS is going to struggle competing against the EPL, Bundisliga and Champions League (Mexican league too) which are all heavily televised in the USA. I mean, we get three EPL games on a Saturday plus two on a Sunday. How can MLS compete against that ?

Nationally it struggles, but in some markets like Seattle and Atlanta have crazy average attendance numbers well in excess of 40,000.

I suppose the weaker thing about MLS is that it has been around for decades now, and still haven't won a CONCACAF Champions League. Came close last year, but getting a team into a final is hard enough for the MLS.

 

[steve_bank]

Thanks for the responses. Spends like the soccer market in Europe is saturated.

From the games I watched Bundesliga seems more aggressive and energetic than Premier.

 

[Underseer]

I have watched some games over here mostly Bundesliga and Primer leagues.

I do not see much difference in the level of play, but the I have not watched a lot.

Only a few times have I seen coordinated play leading to a goal.

Most of it seems hit or miss.

Is there a European hierarchy of leagues? Over her we have major leagues and minor leagues. We also have semi-pro football, baseball, and basketball leagues.

Where does FIFA fit in?

I do not doubt the physical condition neded for the sport. It sems nea impossible to directly move the ball end to end.

Are there strategies and specific player roles other than goalie? Seems like it comes down to 1 or 2 players on a team for goals. Blocking is not allowed and I do not see coordinated action by multiple players.

In America, the weakest, losingest sports team gets first picks in the draft to give them an advantage, while the winners pick last. This helps to make games more competitive.

From what I understand, most European soccer leagues have no such mechanism and are much more harsh about things. If you screw up badly enough, your team might even be moved to the minor leagues. If you want to build a team back up, you have to do it without some of the little advantages losing teams in America get.

 

[rousseau]

I enjoyed Liverpool / Man U on the weekend. It'll be interesting to see what Man U does for the rest of the season as it looks like the pressure's on, and they're a bit disorganized these days.

 

[fromderinside]

Last team I coached was U15 team in AYSO District 8 Region 71 in West SF valley West of Topanga south of Victory and mostly north of Ventura blvds. Got my Section rating as referee that year, 1999, at age fifty eight after three vascular surgeries.

Nothing more fun than coaching and refereeing a sport where continuous play is a goal. Unlike baseball or football or basketball one is in bounds until one or the ball is entirely outside the line. "Play on" was my favorite sign and call. Offside trap was my favorite tactical coaching task.

One of my son's teams actually won a game after one of our players was ejected for committing a 'professional' foul by swatting a goal bound shot away with his hand in the defensive scrum around a free kick. He got free cokes every after game pizza party thereafter.

Hey, youth league is where kids become pros.

I've not seen any goal not performed by a kid under the age of 14 in any competition I've witnessed since that time in my life.

 

[rousseau]

Last I had anything to do with soccer other than as a spectator was in a 6 a side league at the University of East Anglia in 2005.

English kids are pretty good. I kept up but for the first time realized I wasn't as good as I thought I was. Good feet, bad coaching in Canada.

 

[rousseau]

I enjoyed Liverpool / Man U on the weekend. It'll be interesting to see what Man U does for the rest of the season as it looks like the pressure's on, and they're a bit disorganized these days.

Searched 'Manchester United Problems'

https://www.news18.com/news/sports/...lems-for-manchester-united-brand-1976209.html

Liverpool Loss Highlights Problems for Manchester United Brand

Yet United looked a mediocre, mid-table side as they were quite outclassed. Now, they are 19 points behind Premier League leaders Liverpool, the Merseysiders' biggest advantage over United after 17 games of a top-flight season.

But the numbers, while alarming enough for United supporters, do not paint the full picture of the vast gulf between the two teams.

Under Juergen Klopp, last season's Champions League finallists Liverpool are playing a thrilling brand of high-speed, entertaining, positive football, executed by some of the game's most exciting talents. Like the United of old, indeed.

Jose Mourinho's prosaic, sixth-placed United, in contrast, are 11 points adrift of fourth place so that even qualification for next season's Champions League looks an outside chance at best.

They have not even been close to winning the title since their last triumph in 2013 and few of the club's fans disagree with former captain Gary Neville's verdict that the club need a "reset".

So, when do the Glazer family, the club's American owners, press that reset button? And how exactly will they then attempt to turn around the fortunes of the record 20-times English champions.

Puts an interesting spin on it when your team is a brand, and you have to win to continue the success of the brand.

 

[TSwizzle]

Last I had anything to do with soccer other than as a spectator was in a 6 a side league at the University of East Anglia in 2005.

English kids are pretty good. I kept up but for the first time realized I wasn't as good as I thought I was. Good feet, bad coaching in Canada.

I know that feeling. I played regularly from a young age for various teams and thought I was good enough I could play pro or semi pro. But once you start playing with really talented players, the gulf is very apparent. But I did learn a lot about the game. One time I was playing in a six a side game and there was an ex pro on the other team, what a player he was. I was taken away at just how good he was. His first touch, turn and shooting made us all look like the donkeys we were. He was in his 40s too and wasn't playing regularly.


I watched the Liverpool game, Utd were poor. That Utd squad has serious shortcomings from what I saw. Juan Mata is decent player but I believe the Special One is not too keen on him. Lukaku is a donkey. Still streets ahead of me though !

 

[rousseau]

Last I had anything to do with soccer other than as a spectator was in a 6 a side league at the University of East Anglia in 2005.

English kids are pretty good. I kept up but for the first time realized I wasn't as good as I thought I was. Good feet, bad coaching in Canada.

I know that feeling. I played regularly from a young age for various teams and thought I was good enough I could play pro or semi pro. But once you start playing with really talented players, the gulf is very apparent.

Funny thing is I was actually a pretty talented player. When I was a young kid I was among the ranks of players making runs across the field. At age 9 I made it onto a county team. In high school I played for our senior team as a freshman, and was one of the better players on the team.

If I had grown up in Europe it's quite possible that I could have gone pro, but in Canada the sport isn't taken seriously and I gave up playing competitively when I started high school. There just isn't really the coaching or support there. It's one thing to have natural talent, it's another thing to know how to play the game, which is something I was never taught. (whereas a lot of the British kids knew how to play the game properly)

But at that, I was an even more talented student which is why I dropped sports and focused on school.. and I'm sure I'm making much more money now than I likely would have as an athlete.

 

[rousseau]

This is a pretty good summary here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/canada/comments/6m1mz6/why_is_the_canadian_mens_national_soccer_team_so/

There are a few key reasons. The first one is that there isn't proper coaching from a young age and there isn't a really good development system that is seen most countries with top soccer teams. In England for example kids start in a clubs academy team as young as six and play up until they are eighteen normally, they also play year round with top coaches, therefore getting the most opportunity to develop skills. Here in Canada however, soccer tends to be a "second sport" played during the summer or for high school teams without really coaches so the opportunity to grow just isn't there. It is also worth noting that in most places the infrastructure isn't really there either, in England there are good pitches to play on all over the place but a lot of the fields in Canada are pretty beat up and not really great for playing soccer on.

Another reason is that there is no professional league in Canada, apart from the three MLS teams, so i dont think there is a very high level of interest and there isn't a lot that draws people to get involved in the game.

To continue, the national mens team has not had a good manager that can get the most of the player pool available to him, Floro was a big name but not really a good manager. I think that out current manager is a good step in the right direction as he has taken a very youth centered team to the gold cup.

Another reason is that players born in Canada opt out and play with better nations because they just don't feel that the national mens team is very good so of course we miss out on a lot of talent.

Final point is that the team does not receive the support that it needs. TFC, Whitecaps, Impact and women's national teams all draw excellent attendance and support but the stands are empty when the mens team plays. I feel that if there was better support we would see more interest in players playing for Canada, more interest in the sport in general and i think we would see a huge improvement in the final product on the field.

All that said, things are improving and looking up. Soon enough we will start having a really competitive team that could possibly qualify for the world cup, the potential is certainly there.

In Canada, soccer is what hockey players play in the summer to stay fit. But if you're a good hockey player.. watch out, someone's watching.