Star Trek Discovery?

[Patooka]

Put me down as one against the change in Klingon appearance. Honestly, in a sci fi show that shows a variety of alien species, if they were unhappy with how the Klingons looked, they could have made another alien race for the show. Like they did with the Suliban in enterprise, the Jem Hadar in DS9, the Hirogen in Voyager and the Borg in TNG. I don't understand the need to constantly fiddle with the Klingons to make them look more alien, yet Vulcans and Romulans are fine.

 

[couch_sloth]

I can't figure out why people would want to go back to aliens who are just humans with clumsily attached forehead prosthetics. At least the new Klingons are showing a little bit more effort in the make-up department. And the new Klingons are much more believable culturally, than the sad caricature that the old Klingons had become by end of DS9.

What the Klingons look like is about as unimportant as the federation uniforms in Discovery looking nothing like TOS nor TNG.

I don't find that a very convincing analogy. Historically, it's not unusual for military uniforms to change every 20 years. But to significantly change the appearance of a species without a good reason/explanation seems a little careless.
But I don't see this as a deal breaker for the new series... it's just kind of an annoyance that should have been avoided.

I never veiwed the Klingons of DS9 as looking like humans with clumsily attachments, at least no more than with the new Klingons. e.g. The Klingon nose was always the part that stood out as looking like an attachment, they seem to have made this worse with the new Klingons... In the new ones you can easily see the outline of the human nostrils within the Klingon noses.

 

[Patooka]

What the Klingons look like is about as unimportant as the federation uniforms in Discovery looking nothing like TOS nor TNG.

looks very similar to:

And this:

is a very similar tone to this:

 

[Jayjay]

And this:

is a very similar tone to this:

That's because that picture of Jason Isaacs is a photoshop of captain Pike from TOS.

Interesting tha tyou noticed the nostrils, I thought they were a nice touch, and I don't see the "human nose", at least not any more than with old style klingons.

 

[Jayjay]

I can't figure out why people would want to go back to aliens who are just humans with clumsily attached forehead prosthetics. At least the new Klingons are showing a little bit more effort in the make-up department. And the new Klingons are much more believable culturally, than the sad caricature that the old Klingons had become by end of DS9.

What the Klingons look like is about as unimportant as the federation uniforms in Discovery looking nothing like TOS nor TNG.

I don't find that a very convincing analogy. Historically, it's not unusual for military uniforms to change every 20 years. But to significantly change the appearance of a species without a good reason/explanation seems a little careless.
But I don't see this as a deal breaker for the new series... it's just kind of an annoyance that should have been avoided.

I never veiwed the Klingons of DS9 as looking like humans with clumsily attachments, at least no more than with the new Klingons. e.g. The Klingon nose was always the part that stood out as looking like an attachment, they seem to have made this worse with the new Klingons... In the new ones you can easily see the outline of the human nostrils within the Klingon noses.

To be clear, I never had a huge problem with Klingon appearance in TNG and DS9, they were on par if not better than many other species. Certainly not as awful as the Ferengi, or whatever silly-putty species Odo was part of. Slapping a ridge on someone's forehead was the best they could afford at the time and that's understandable. The klingons were bad mostly because of the childish depiction of their culture and the honor nonsense that made them a caricature, a punching bag for the federation basically.

But I don't mind them changing their appearance either, the same way they did between TOS and the motion picture (and later TNG). Only problem I had with the look of the new Klingons was that T'Kuvma seemed to have been cosplaying as Spider-Man for some reason.

 

[crazyfingers]

Right now in "wait and see" mode for episode 3 which I'll probably watch with the family Monday evening. Haven't rewatched the first two episodes yet. I couldn't get my Windows 10 notebook to screen share with my Samsung TV. Why I don't know. They tried and failed several times. And alone I'd rather keep my tablet for other uses.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Right now in "wait and see" mode for episode 3 which I'll probably watch with the family Monday evening. Haven't rewatched the first two episodes yet. I couldn't get my Windows 10 notebook to screen share with my Samsung TV. Why I don't know. They tried and failed several times. And alone I'd rather keep my tablet for other uses.

Were you trying to do it through the air or through an HDMI cable? CBS Streaming not on Roku?

 

[crazyfingers]

Right now in "wait and see" mode for episode 3 which I'll probably watch with the family Monday evening. Haven't rewatched the first two episodes yet. I couldn't get my Windows 10 notebook to screen share with my Samsung TV. Why I don't know. They tried and failed several times. And alone I'd rather keep my tablet for other uses.

Were you trying to do it through the air or through an HDMI cable? CBS Streaming not on Roku?

It's the "Connect" tool in Widows 10 Action Center. Same pop up screen on the bottom right where Airplane mode, Wifi, Bluetooth and other communications are turned on and off. I was able to do it once before. The Notebook and TV were trying hard to connect. I got a screen on the TV "Connecting...." but it always eventually failed. I tried 4 times. I even moved the notebook much closer to the TV with no obstructions between. I was previously able to do it upstairs on the very same Samsung TV model I have in the basement. I watched a show I have in iTunes that time. The connection has always been difficult to make. Don't know why.

I would stream to the notebook and then mirror the screen wireless to the Samsung TV.

 

[jab]

I agree--I just hope it doesn't get into silly mystic stuff like Deep Space 9, by far the weakest of the 4 main series.

What was mystic about it? The gods were just quasi-indifferent aliens.

walked likespirits, talked like spirits, had annointed human(oid) messengers/ prophets--and then there was Louise Fletcher unsuitably reprising Nurse Ratched in a stereotypical, unnecessarily drawn-out, scenery-chewing, "misguided" role.

 

[jab]

Put me down as one against the change in Klingon appearance. Honestly, in a sci fi show that shows a variety of alien species, if they were unhappy with how the Klingons looked, they could have made another alien race for the show. Like they did with the Suliban in enterprise, the Jem Hadar in DS9, the Hirogen in Voyager and the Borg in TNG. I don't understand the need to constantly fiddle with the Klingons to make them look more alien, yet Vulcans and Romulans are fine.

Apparently the Klingons have a big fan base. As well, an already established humanoid species would look better taking an important part in a prequel (a prequel is a dumb idea for a exploration based sci fi series) than would a humanoid species that becomes very central in the prequel but is insignificant or non-existent in the older but newer series.

 

[Patooka]

Apparently the Klingons have a big fan base. As well, an already established humanoid species would look better taking an important part in a prequel (a prequel is a dumb idea for a exploration based sci fi series) than would a humanoid species that becomes very central in the prequel but is insignificant or non-existent in the older but newer series.

I agree. The Suliban in Enterprise was a terrible concept. I just don't understand the need for constant tweaking with Klingons. It strikes me as GeorgeLucas-itis. Film critic Bob Chipman has pointed out, for a franchise that started out with big ideas and poor production costs, Star Trek has almost completely inverted.

 

[couch_sloth]

Apparently the Klingons have a big fan base. As well, an already established humanoid species would look better taking an important part in a prequel (a prequel is a dumb idea for a exploration based sci fi series) than would a humanoid species that becomes very central in the prequel but is insignificant or non-existent in the older but newer series.

I agree. The Suliban in Enterprise was a terrible concept. I just don't understand the need for constant tweaking with Klingons. It strikes me as GeorgeLucas-itis. Film critic Bob Chipman has pointed out, for a franchise that started out with big ideas and poor production costs, Star Trek has almost completely inverted.

I think "big ideas and poor production costs" probably more aptly describes some of the British television sci-fi of the 1960s and 70's (e.g. Doctor Who, UFO, Blake's 7). For a 1960s TV show, the original Star Trek had wonderful special effects. In fact, the look of the show was better than much of the sci-fi movies that came out during that period.
But I catch the drift of what is being said. Still, the new show is just beginning. I think it's too early to make any judgment about the quality of its writing or the plot ideas in general

 

[Derec]

or whatever silly-putty species Odo was part of.

Odo is a changeling, i.e. can change appearance at will. But, being separated from others of his species, he never learned to replicate human(oid) look that well. The "silly putty" appearance was thus intentional.

 

[Jayjay]

or whatever silly-putty species Odo was part of.

Odo is a changeling, i.e. can change appearance at will. But, being separated from others of his species, he never learned to replicate human(oid) look that well. The "silly putty" appearance was thus intentional.

Actually, when they showed other members of Odos species, they had exactly the same silly-putty look.

 

[Philos]

Folks,

I like Discovery. It is different enough from previous series to be the same, if anyone gets that??

A.

 

[couch_sloth]

Episode 3 is pretty good.





Spoiler:

Show

The Discovery's captain has a tribble on his desk.

 

[Jayjay]

Spoiler:

Show

The Discovery's captain has a tribble on his desk.

Show

And a Gorn skeleton.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Odo is a changeling, i.e. can change appearance at will. But, being separated from others of his species, he never learned to replicate human(oid) look that well. The "silly putty" appearance was thus intentional.

Actually, when they showed other members of Odos species, they had exactly the same silly-putty look.

Yes, it was difficult to explain whether they were trying to be inclusive or something. When they take away his shape shifting abilities for "killing" another changling, they made him look like he normally did and he said that was in order to mock him.

What was a bit silly was that he could imitate animals perfectly, but he couldn't figure out the face of a humanoid, and it wasn't as if he was all too far off from achieving it.

 

[Sarpedon]

Possibly he looked as weird to other animals in their form, and we simply couldn't appreciate that.

 

[prideandfall]

Spoiler:

Show

The Discovery's captain has a tribble on his desk.

Show

And a Gorn skeleton.

this perfectly encapsulates my issue with STD - it's star trek in name only, in reference only, but holds nothing of the DNA of the show that became an enduring cultural icon.

this is a big long ass diatribe so i'm putting it in hide tags just so there's not a wall of text that is a self indulgent armchair criticism isn't randomly barfed into this thread.
there are no spoilers or details of the show whatever in this, i'm just hiding it to be polite.

Show

so let me preface all this by saying two things real quick:
1. i am not a nostalgia junkie and i don't cling to things and want them to be a certain way because "that's how they used to be" and,
2. i understand the marketing angle to brand recognition and why you'd want to slap a known property name onto something to get instant consumer appeal.

so here's the thing:
star trek was a show with a theme for a very long time, and that theme had to do with the utopian future of the human race, of mankind coming together and becoming better than our base and petty earth-bound animal history.
if you map it out broadly the 4 primary series (TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY) each had an arc which worked within the theme.

in TOS you had a sort of gritty frontier vibe and while the crew sometimes squabbled they were always trying to come together for the greater good, this is like the 'growing up' stage of the dawn of human utopian civilization, working out the kinks but it has a plan and it's working towards it.

in TNG you had the more mature version of this vision, the crew never quarreled with each other, everyone worked together towards one goal.
if you look back at how much of TNG was diplomatic missions and the central conflict being negotiation and conflict resolution it's kind of astonishing.

DS9 was where the ideals that were first striven for in TOS and attained in TNG were challenged - where a largely secular body had to deal with a deeply spiritual culture, of racial strife, of war... DS9 had a much grimmer tone but at the time it was the outlier of the franchise, it was meant to be darker and antagonistic because it was acting as a crucible for the ideals set up within the series.

VOY was similar, but instead of having those ideals directly confronted it examined if those ideals held up in a completely detached and alien environment, finding out if you can hang on to your principles devoid of the context in which those principles were formed, and how you have to compromise in order to survive.

the big problem with the ST franchise overall within the scope of its media presence and place within the popular culture is that the movies post Generations totally lost sight of any of star trek's themes or understanding of action being a contrast to idealism, and just made ST another sci-fi action popcorn flick, and as they went on they kept getting dumber and dumber.
first contact is a giant ball of utter horseshit, insurrection and nemesis were utter dumpster fires, the reboot was like 1 ounce of potentially decent idea mixed in with 97 gallons of hot badger piss, into darkness was possibly the worst movie i have ever seen in my life, and i never saw beyond because fool me twice go fuck yourself.

anyways, the point of all this long rambling crap is this:
ST: discovery isn't star trek in any sort of thematic way, nor in any recognizable story sense.
it's just "generic space war bullshit show #915" but with the name 'star trek' slapped on it to try and fool people into watching it, because god knows there isn't fuck-all in the show itself to merit enough interest to pay for yet another subscription service.