Stunning donation to medical school in the Bronx

[Toni]

I wasn’t certain of the best place to put this but since Politics has often discussed issues surrounding higher education and specifically, medical schools, I thought I’d share this article which everyone should be able to view:

$1 Billion Donation Will Provide Free Tuition at a Bronx Medical School

Dr. Ruth Gottesman, a longtime professor at the Albert Einstein College of Medicine, is making free tuition available to all students going forward.

www.nytimes.com

I especially hope that this will encourage talented people who were hesitant to dream of medical school because of the high costs, particularly those who would like to pursue less remunerative medical specialities or to practice in underserved areas.

 

[Derec]

I do not think high costs of medical school are deterring anybody from pursuing medicine. A very competitive application and selection process, the amount of knowledge one has to learn, and the overall length of training, is what is deterring people.

Even the less remunerative specialties command >$200k in median salary.

 

[laughing dog]

As we know from the law of demand in economics is that price has absolutely no influence on people's decision-making.

 

[Derec]

As we know from the law of demand in economics is that price has absolutely no influence on people's decision-making.

Of course it does to some extent. Just like with NYU, more people will apply to Einstein. Which will make admissions to that school even more competitive than the present 515 median MCAT.

My point was that the cost of medical school is not what is deterring people from med school, because of easily accessible student loans and very high physician salaries. And that does not even start covering the "paying off your student loans is optional" philosophy of the Biden administration. I stand by that. The overall demand for med school spots is not that price sensitive. Even as is, ~8000 students applied to Einstein's ~200 MS1 spots. Overall, ~55,000 students apply to med schools, and the total number of positions available is less than half of that. Surely, high tuition costs are not deterrence to interest in pursuing medicine.

 

[laughing dog]

As we know from the law of demand in economics is that price has absolutely no influence on people's decision-making.

Of course it does to some extent. Just like with NYU, more people will apply to Einstein. Which will make admissions to that school even more competitive than the present 515 median MCAT.

My point was that the cost of medical school is not what is deterring people from med school, because of easily accessible student loans and very high physician salaries. And that does not even start covering the "paying off your student loans is optional" philosophy of the Biden administration. I stand by that. The overall demand for med school spots is not that price sensitive. Even as is, ~8000 students applied to Einstein's ~200 MS1 spots. Overall, ~55,000 students apply to med schools, and the total number of positions available is less than half of that. Surely, high tuition costs are not deterrence to interest in pursuing medicine.

If you agree that price does influence people's decision making, then you really cannot claim it does not deter some people from medical school.

The fact that there are more applicants now than spots means very little unless you are arguing that if tuition was free that there would be the same number of applicants. I doubt that is your position.

There are plenty of obstacles in obtaining a medical education in the US - the standards to get in, the demands of the educational process, the number of years in apprenticeship and tuition all potential deterrents.

I suspect that providing free tuition might induce more qualified but lower income applicants to try. Certainly couldn't hurt.

 

[ZiprHead]

Part of my job at the hospital was being the Contract Database Administrator. All our newly hired physicians had their student loans paid off by the hospital. I wonder how unfair Derec thinks that is.

 

[Toni]

I do not think high costs of medical school are deterring anybody from pursuing medicine. A very competitive application and selection process, the amount of knowledge one has to learn, and the overall length of training, is what is deterring people.

Even the less remunerative specialties command >$200k in median salary.

I know that you don't think that the actual cost of schooling keeps talented people from pursuing a career in medicine, but you are not correct. Certainly I know people who made other choices based on cost of education (and one must include the 4 year degree before med school) and others who were unsure they made a wise decision based upon the mountains of debt they accrued pursing their MDs.

Whenever there is any discussion about the high cost of medical care in the US, I think that it is essential to take into consideration that it is extremely expensive to become a physician. In addition to the actual cost of the education are the living expenses. When you also consider that medical students generally are in the prime age to want to start a family, and look at the financial pressures on just obtaining their MD, we have to face the fact that we MUST reduce the cost of obtaining a medical degree.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

As we know from the law of demand in economics is that price has absolutely no influence on people's decision-making.

Of course it does to some extent. Just like with NYU, more people will apply to Einstein. Which will make admissions to that school even more competitive than the present 515 median MCAT.

My point was that the cost of medical school is not what is deterring people from med school, because of easily accessible student loans and very high physician salaries. And that does not even start covering the "paying off your student loans is optional" philosophy of the Biden administration. I stand by that. The overall demand for med school spots is not that price sensitive. Even as is, ~8000 students applied to Einstein's ~200 MS1 spots. Overall, ~55,000 students apply to med schools, and the total number of positions available is less than half of that. Surely, high tuition costs are not deterrence to interest in pursuing medicine.

Seriously, you have no idea what you are talking about.

My FIL is well off these days, but it took a long time of scrimping to get there. Lots of school, residency, it takes a lot to get to be a doctor.

Personally, I didn't get my Masters in Engineering because of cost. I was smart enough to get into a Masters program, but not quite smart enough to get the school to pay for it.

 

[EricH]

As we know from the law of demand in economics is that price has absolutely no influence on people's decision-making.

Of course it does to some extent. Just like with NYU, more people will apply to Einstein. Which will make admissions to that school even more competitive than the present 515 median MCAT.

My point was that the cost of medical school is not what is deterring people from med school, because of easily accessible student loans and very high physician salaries. And that does not even start covering the "paying off your student loans is optional" philosophy of the Biden administration. I stand by that. The overall demand for med school spots is not that price sensitive. Even as is, ~8000 students applied to Einstein's ~200 MS1 spots. Overall, ~55,000 students apply to med schools, and the total number of positions available is less than half of that. Surely, high tuition costs are not deterrence to interest in pursuing medicine.

Cost can most certainly be a deterrence to those who would prefer not to take on half a million or more in debt to become a doctor. Factor in the costs associated with 4 years of undergraduate education, 4 years of medical school, 5 years of residency and 2 or 3 years of fellowship work where the candidate has either no income or very little income, and needs to pay out hundreds of thousands of dollars each year for their education, and costs start to become a huge issue. I personally know people who might have been otherwise qualified to become doctors choose not to pursue this path because of the cost issues.

 

[Elixir]

Seriously, you have no idea what you are talking about.

Seriously, you’re right about that.

My FIL is well off these days, but it took a long time of scrimping to get there. Lots of school, residency, it takes a lot to get to be a doctor.

From about 1974 until 1982(?) I (a HS dropout) was making more than my brother the Doctor (resident in ‘74) was. I don’t think he ever made it into the green until after his son graduated from college around 1995.
He probably made more selling his practice (and the land and building that housed it) to the hospital system ca 2005 than he ever made as a doctor. Yeah, he’s quite well off now, after some fifty years of working it all off.