Horseshoe Theory is correct. Don’t know why anyone would deny it.
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"The Communists broke our bones, but the Americans broke our hearts
- Thread starter RVonse
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Horseshoe Theory is correct. Don’t know why anyone would deny it.
J842P
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The Hong Kong protestors are right wing authoritarians now? Well, I guess when all you have is a hammer...
Whatever you want to call people who think Trump is rich, a good businessman, tough, smart, and benevolent. The stupid of every country? I don't care.
With the impeding Biden presidency, expect many on here to be apologists for communist China.
GenesisNemesis
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zorq
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I watched the (pretty stupid) video in the first post. The talking heads (and the OP) totally fail to realize that the problem with China isn't "socialism." ** China's economy is doing pretty amazing. ## The problem with China is authoritarianism.
All of the complaints in that video: crackdowns, censorship, concentration camps, are all problems of unchecked government abuse, not problems of progressive taxation and social safety nets. Of course, I wouldn't expect RVonce to see that given his penchant for voting for the most authoritarian presidential candidate the US has ever seen. It's still sad though.
** Actually, I really suspect these talking heads know that they are peddling bullshit and counting on their clueless dupes to not realize they are being sold a false narrative.
##I personally think China is a quite capitalist country and wouldn't even call it "socialist" anymore. But if you believe that China is "socialist" you must admit that socialist economics work based on China's economic success. Or on the other hand if you don't think China is "socialist" then you can't blame the corruption in China on socialism. It must be due to some other factor... like Authoritarianism.
All of the complaints in that video: crackdowns, censorship, concentration camps, are all problems of unchecked government abuse, not problems of progressive taxation and social safety nets. Of course, I wouldn't expect RVonce to see that given his penchant for voting for the most authoritarian presidential candidate the US has ever seen. It's still sad though.
** Actually, I really suspect these talking heads know that they are peddling bullshit and counting on their clueless dupes to not realize they are being sold a false narrative.
##I personally think China is a quite capitalist country and wouldn't even call it "socialist" anymore. But if you believe that China is "socialist" you must admit that socialist economics work based on China's economic success. Or on the other hand if you don't think China is "socialist" then you can't blame the corruption in China on socialism. It must be due to some other factor... like Authoritarianism.
RVonse
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Good point zorq. So China is not socialist it is a government based on authoritarianism and the US is a government based on democracy. Good call with your correction of the terminology! But how does that really change the point of my OP in even the slightest way???!!!! Professor Poindexter has corrected everyone's terminology.... but how does that affect what the CCP does and how America's useful idiot liberals are playing right into their hands??? How does raising the Chinese flag of authoritarianism during a BLM rally convey anything but disrespect for American democracy and worship for Chinese authoritarianism!!!!
How are the US liberals still not being useful idiots that I think they are????!!!!
laughing dog
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You mean like calling President Xi a great leader?
GenesisNemesis
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Maybe if you didn't vote for people who continually oppress the poor they wouldn't become sympathetic to communism. Just a thought.
GenesisNemesis
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Or how about when Trump took such great pains to be friends with Bolsonaro or Kim Jong-Un?
funinspace
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There are always some idiots in any crowd and any grouping of people. More broadly, why do you think this is particularly a ''US liberals" issue/problem?
The China thaw came under Nixon. In 1986 China became an observer within GATT (aka Reagan's presidency). China joined the WTO in December 2001 with the Shrub's blessing. Lots of useful idiots I guess, but not so 'liberal'.
Additionally, the US has little issue with authoritarians, as long as they sleep in our bed. Hell we even played footsie with Saddam Hussein when it worked for us. Saudi Arabia treats half their population (aka women) as little better than cattle. Yet, we have defense arrangements with them, sell them very sophisticated weapons, and trade freely with them. Never mind so many other 'bad' countries...
Angra Mainyu
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Nah, they're just run-of-the-mill anti-(pro-Trump).
As for HK protesters, of course many of them like Trump. Maybe most, and that would not be surprising. They are being oppressed, much of their already limited freedom has been recently taken away by a government far more authoritarian than Trump's administration, and Trump is not only the enemy of their oppressor, but even made a point of supporting them.
RVonse
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Its way worse than what you think because our leaders have become successfully bribed. I'm betting both Biden and McConnel are compromised by the CCP as we speak. They definitely have made big money deals off China. Not to mention the corrupt media and entertainment industry of the US. So when liberal idiots start wearing the communist Chinese flag it needs to be taken as a grave matter since there is no other side of this that can be heard anymore. What has just occurred in Hong Kong and this last POTUS election is more proof that they are winning and liberty is losing.
There once was a time when Communism was taken so seriously that McCarthy went overboard with his hearings. They say most people thought he went way too far. But now that I have seen the CCP in action I can understand what caused that movement to purge politicians and entertainers of communism. Sadly, thanks to the useful liberal idiots, we may require McCarthy to come back again today IMO.
RVonse
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That is why some people who do not vote Republican did vote for Trump. Trump was advertised as the "blue collar" billionaire and in many ways came through with that angle.
But in any case, losing liberty for economic wealth is never worth it. Even if you are impoverished, it is not the end as long as you remain free. Liberals need to figure that out sooner rather than when its too late.
You can't be that fucking stupid. Trump has been (unfortunately) a very prominent public figure with a large media presence for decades. His numerous questionable business ventures and fragile narcissism makes him the perfect target for leverage. Chinese or otherwise.
ideologyhunter
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Ivanka had one sit-down with Chinese negotiators and was given trade concessions for her brand-name crap that most companies work for years to acquire, if they get them at all.
zorq
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Your statement in the OP was
Can you show us the "US liberal democrats[sic]" who are waving these Chinese and USSR flags? How do you know the people in the video clips are "US liberal democrats"? Can you be sure the people are liberals? Democrats? Are they even American? They weren't holding their drivers licenses up the camera.
Moving on, let's assume that the 20 or so people captured waving these flags really are the "US liberal democrats" you think they are. Do you really think they represent all of liberalism? Do you really think they represent all of the Democratic Party? If so, (because that is what your statement implies) Why then haven't they been endorsed by any Democratic politicians anywhere? Where are the liberal leaders waving these flags? There aren't any because the flag wavers are just some crazies. They don't get political lip service anywhere, unlike Right wing fringe groups like the Proud Boys who's leader gets invites to tour the Trump Whitehouse.
I mean, didn't you notice how in that video the talking heads were comparing clips of hundreds of thousands of HK protesters marching to zoomed in clips of handfuls of white protesters holding these (apparently) super offensive flags. Didn't that set off a red flag for you? (pun unintended
) What makes you think more than a handful of the HK protesters even know about the handful of American(?) protesters that wave Soviet and Chinese flags? Did that handful of American(?) protesters really break the hearts of the HK protesters? Or did you merely fall for some transparent anti-socialism propaganda riddled with logical fallacies?Edit: I went back and checked and in the OP video there is only ONE person waving what is discernably communist flag (Soviet) near some white people. What was the motivation of that person? When/where was it filmed? We don't know. We can't even see their face well. Maybe they were planning on burning that flag. We just don't know. Derec provided some better photos of this phenomenon, but it's still not very well documented.
funinspace
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Wow...a lot of noise to unpack here, as well as mixed up issues...
Secondarily, what in the world does Chinese Hong Kong or the Chinese Uighur people have to do with US freedoms, or threats to them?
Personally, I find your betting to be fairly poor. 4 years ago you thought US Steel was going to ride high due to Clownstick (among other failed notions)...that hasn't quite panned out. Show me real evidence that Biden has 'made big money deals off China'. Clownstick's flock had 18 trademarks fast tracked approved in China after he became President. The whole of Congress has received tons of campaign money off of big business, in the hopes that their international profit preferences are heard and acted upon. Do you really think that the Democrats are more owned by big business than the Repugs?
The POTUS election was fair, and US Attorney General (Barr) and the White House head of election security agreed. Georgia and Arizona are run by Republicans. How in the hell can you argue that there was some sort of fraud taking place, and yet the Democrats didn't bother to go for more seats in Congress while their were magically cooking the election? The con is in the Whitehouse, and if he did manage to get his way and steel the election, it would be the most dangerous thing for our democracy since at least the civil war. Talk about losing liberty...just fuck!
Secondarily, what in the world does Chinese Hong Kong or the Chinese Uighur people have to do with US freedoms, or threats to them?