The mansplaining thread

[Toni]

floof

I hope there's no girls or young women in your life. If there are, see my previous post. I hope those girls have others in their lives to teach them to value themselves and to question the status quo.

And I DO question the status quo here and everywhere, but I honestly wouldn't expect you to recognize what that looks like, or to help in any way.

My point, I love to watch selective moral outrage, posturing, and preaching.

The cover as things go is innocuous.Do you like to watch the Fast and Furious movies? Get you excited maybe even a hardon? The series is simple. Big strong beefy dominant men, generally submissive women with tits hanging out, and of course fast cars and violence.

What say you about those Hollywood images and portrayals of women? How about the geral TV image of young women acting mostly like goofy teens?

Male and female role images are pervasive and crafted by a minority. The crafted images are mimicked. The issue is not with a magazine cover, it is with culture as it has evolved from the 60s counter culture and rejection of norms of the day.

I do not watch porn anymore, do you watch porn with young looking girls being gagged by an older man? Do you like images of younger girls on their knees taking it in the mouth? Male dominance.

Evaluate your own norms and cultural programming first. You may be surprised.

I suppose it's entertaining to watch moral outrage when you and no one you care about is in the demographic that is being hurt. It's not my idea of fun but I grew up with sisters so I understand the concept of bitch pretty well. And by bitch, I don't mean bitch in any gender specific way.

 

[bigfield]

Male and female role images are pervasive and crafted by a minority. The crafted images are mimicked. The issue is not with a magazine cover, it is with culture as it has evolved from the 60s counter culture and rejection of norms of the day.


...

Evaluate your own norms and cultural programming first. You may be surprised.

It doesn't make any sense to attribute the beginning of modern culture to "60s counter culture and rejection of norms". There was nothing special about the culture and norms of the 1950's that inured people against consumerism. In fact the 50's were a boom period for the advertising industry.

I do not watch porn anymore...

...because you're old and your dick doesn't work, not because you're a better person.

 

[rousseau]

The real cover will sell more because it's talking about what girls want to know about.

Well, it markets itself as 'You should feel insecure, but we can help you.'

Eh. I get the point of this thread, and why someone might react to the magazine this way, but I honestly believe this is a stretch.

That our publications and media are out there dictating what people should read, buy, and like is a fallacy to me, and this isn't just limited to teen mags, but everything. For a consumer product to be successful there needs to be a buyer and a producer, a buyer and producer that reinforce each other.

All of that is to say that the appalling mag sells because young women enjoy reading it, not because they're being tricked into buying it. That's the central point here - the magazine is light entertainment, and young women like it.

Maybe that sounds counter-intuitive to people who want to promote women's rights, but it is possible to care about social justice but be absolutely incorrect about your preconceptions. Just because you're on the right side of history, doesn't mean you're making the right argument.

 

[Angry Floof]

It's just how it is. Don't question it. Don't speak about it. Don't point out anything that could possibly make men feel slightly uncomfortable about what we perpetuate in the world simply because it's rote and easy to do so. The world is fine for women and girls. Your perceptions are distorted and limited. You can't trust your own viewpoints about something you think about a lot and I think about never at all unless I witness a female speaking about it and then I just authoritatively pull my programmed assumptions out of my ass and assert them as if they are objective reality while directing my responses to other men. This makes me feel safe and comfortable. Don't make me uncomfortable or I will diminish you in whatever way I can, and I have been trained since birth on how to do that with socially acceptable subtlety. Do not expect me to risk even a mild conflict with another male when it is so easy and reflexive to just wave off female voices with my authoritative male one. Anyway, there's nothing you can do about it. It's just how the world is. I, after all, am a completely rational and independent thinker, not at all influenced by the myriad social forces that are deeply ingrained in my species, and therefore this subject needs no more glucose wasted on it. No need to look further. Your perceptions are wrong and you should just be quiet because I myself am not at all disturbed by a status quo that only affects people who are not like me.

 

[ruby sparks]

I would hesitate before jumping to the conclusion that the issue of teenage magazine covers reflects only what will sell and has nothing to do with gender bias. Because the two things are not mutually exclusive and the processes involved can be two-way. For example, while it may be true to say that a magazine cover will feature 'stuff that girls will buy' it could also be true that some of girls' reasons for wanting to buy certain products comes from expectations about norms and stereoptypes that they are to some extent pressured to conform to.