The real cost of DOGE

[Elixir]

The actual COST of the claimed (but not verified) “savings” by DOGE is close to $6.5 TRILLION -over A HUNDRED TIMES WHAT THEY CLAIM TO “SAVE” in just over the last month, itemized below:

• Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA): Dropped from a peak of 45,073.63 to 42,486.39, losing approximately 5.7%, equivalent to about $1.5 trillion in market value.
• S&P 500: Declined from a high of 6,147.43 to 5,733.93, a drop of 6.7%, representing roughly $2 trillion in losses.
• Nasdaq Composite: Fell from 20,204.58 to 18,112.08, losing about 10.4%, or around $3 trillion in market capitalization

That’s an epic, spectacular failure that speaks to the epic, spectacular success of Trump’s effort to destroy the American economy. Another 12 months of this, and this Country will literally be a third world shithole.

 

[Shadowy Man]

"Owning the libs.... PRICELESS"

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

That is probably a very poor way of measuring the price of DOGE. The drop in the market is in direct response to the tariffs. The true cost in DOGE is hard to puzzle together as you have the drop in spending, jobs, as well as the ancillary parts of it, such as research that generally has a high multiplier on economic development from it. Ultimately, the immediate short-term gain is the budget being a little bit smaller. However, the short-term gain might not even be above water.

 

[Axulus]

MAGA believes that America is already a third world shit hole. Too poor to afford basic government services (that's why it needs to be gutted, to prevent bankruptcy), too weak to defend ukraine (why we need to allow russia and china to do what they want, because we are too poor and weak to fight back). The collapse is necessary to rebuild, while for Trump it is all about fleecing the American people. And MAGA fell for it. Trump is the best conman in history.

 

[Politesse]

That is probably a very poor way of measuring the price of DOGE. The drop in the market is in direct response to the tariffs. The true cost in DOGE is hard to puzzle together as you have the drop in spending, jobs, as well as the ancillary parts of it, such as research that generally has a high multiplier on economic development from it. Ultimately, the immediate short-term gain is the budget being a little bit smaller. However, the short-term gain might not even be above water.

If more than one hundred thousand jobs were lost in a matter of weeks in any other sector than government, there would be a common panic. But people are already used to thinking of government employees as less-than-human characters in a political drama and personally unimportant, so hearing that they have been fired en masse is an eagerly ignorable fact, despite the obvious implications of sudden mass unemployment in any sector. Hence why the public in general is largely ignoring this news, but economists are panicking. As all those people suck up unemployment instead of spending their former middle class incomes, or take new jobs that make less money and put them below the poverty line, the long term consequences will escalate, especially since most of them were working jobs that themselves directly benefited the economy somehow.

 

[ideologyhunter]

Trump is the best conman in history.

I guess. But his flock deserves a shout-out for being the most ignorant rubes in history.

 

[Elixir]

The true cost in DOGE is hard to puzzle together as you have the drop in spending, jobs, as well as the ancillary parts of it, such as research that generally has a high multiplier on economic development from it.

So right. I think the market only reflects sentiment rather than material change. But most material measures do correlate with sentiment eventually. It has only been some six weeks and getting worse by the day.

 

[Ford]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see how "DOGE" is actually saving money right now. Yes, they're firing lots of people and shuttering entire departments, but IIRC that money has already been allocated. Government contracts aren't structured so that if the project runs under budget the taxpayers get a rebate check for the difference. The money is going to be spent one way or another. They're not "saving" anything.

 

[southernhybrid]

Trump is the best conman in history.

I guess. But his flock deserves a shout-out for being the most ignorant rubes in history.

You're not kidding me. I spoke to one again on Monday. She's a nice woman in her 80s, probably totally dependent on SS, who lives in a tiny house in her son's backyard. Maybe she's getting a bit senile as she told me that she had complete trust in Trump and Musk because they are such excellent business men. OMG! I told her that Trump has failed at every or just about every business he's started and Musk is the biggest receiver of federal handouts, while explaining the billions he's received for his business ventures. I told her to look it up, but I'm not sure she would even know how. She is an example of the type of person who was sucked into he Trump cult and still has no idea oh how much damage is being done by the two mad men.

In contrast, my highly educated bro in law continues to defend Trump. In fact, Mr. Sohy has decided he wants nothing to do with him any longer because he can't stand listening to his claims that Trump is doing a great job as president. One can have an advanced college degree and still be an idiot.

 

[Shadowy Man]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see how "DOGE" is actually saving money right now. Yes, they're firing lots of people and shuttering entire departments, but IIRC that money has already been allocated. Government contracts aren't structured so that if the project runs under budget the taxpayers get a rebate check for the difference. The money is going to be spent one way or another. They're not "saving" anything.

You’re thinking like someone who is bound by laws. Not like someone who has taken over the treasury department.

 

[TV and credit cards]

That is probably a very poor way of measuring the price of DOGE. The drop in the market is in direct response to the tariffs. The true cost in DOGE is hard to puzzle together as you have the drop in spending, jobs, as well as the ancillary parts of it, such as research that generally has a high multiplier on economic development from it. Ultimately, the immediate short-term gain is the budget being a little bit smaller. However, the short-term gain might not even be above water.

I think it's morphing into investors be skittish about Trump changing his mind from one day to the next. Markets can adjust to just about anything, anything they can quantify. Political indecision they can't.

“If war is what the U.S. wants, be it a tariff war, a trade war or any other type of war, we’re ready to fight till the end”

 

[Ford]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see how "DOGE" is actually saving money right now. Yes, they're firing lots of people and shuttering entire departments, but IIRC that money has already been allocated. Government contracts aren't structured so that if the project runs under budget the taxpayers get a rebate check for the difference. The money is going to be spent one way or another. They're not "saving" anything.

You’re thinking like someone who is bound by laws. Not like someone who has taken over the treasury department.

Oh, I don't think like that at all. What I'm thinking is that all the money that "DOGE" saves will do directly into the pockets of Leon, Donnie, and the other members of the kakistocracy. They're not just cutting staff...they're removing the guard rails that keep tax dollars from being handed out to cronies. The 2025 budget isn't going to be "reduced" one tiny bit. All that money will go somewhere.

 

[Politesse]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see how "DOGE" is actually saving money right now. Yes, they're firing lots of people and shuttering entire departments, but IIRC that money has already been allocated. Government contracts aren't structured so that if the project runs under budget the taxpayers get a rebate check for the difference. The money is going to be spent one way or another. They're not "saving" anything.

You’re thinking like someone who is bound by laws. Not like someone who has taken over the treasury department.

Oh, I don't think like that at all. What I'm thinking is that all the money that "DOGE" saves will do directly into the pockets of Leon, Donnie, and the other members of the kakistocracy. They're not just cutting staff...they're removing the guard rails that keep tax dollars from being handed out to cronies. The 2025 budget isn't going to be "reduced" one tiny bit. All that money will go somewhere.

The question everyone should be asking is what it will be spent on, and by whom. It was never their end goal to give money back. Or use it to "pay the national debt".

Or is anyone here actually stupid enough to believe that all this DOGE money will be used to write giant checks to Chinese banks, and that this would be a good thing?

 

[Spacetime Inhabitant]

With DOGE there is not just the direct costs of what they are doing and the indirect resulting costs, but there will eventually be the costs associated with reversing the damage. This includes forensic accounting to try to reconstruct financial records, other additional admin costs, the restoration of payments, and paying legal fees and damages, totaling hundreds of billions or even trillions of dollars. All these costs will of course flow-on to things like the deficit, loss of confidence, and so on.

 

[Shadowy Man]

With DOGE there is not just the direct costs of what they are doing and the indirect resulting costs, but there will eventually be the costs associated with reversing the damage. This includes forensic accounting to try to reconstruct financial records, other additional admin costs, the restoration of payments, and paying legal fees and damages, totaling hundreds of billions or even trillions of dollars. All these costs will of course flow-on to things like the deficit, loss of confidence, and so on.

All the money spent on lawyers in court fighting all of it. All the court cases that get delayed. There’s a waterfall of consequences.

 

[Elixir]

Waterfall is a good word for it. I really think our economy is anchored in very large part by confidence, and I could see a total collapse of GDP, widespread food insecurity and rampant disease within a few years if this can’t be brought to a halt very soon.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see how "DOGE" is actually saving money right now. Yes, they're firing lots of people and shuttering entire departments, but IIRC that money has already been allocated. Government contracts aren't structured so that if the project runs under budget the taxpayers get a rebate check for the difference. The money is going to be spent one way or another. They're not "saving" anything.

Think he's going to honor the contracts?? We've already seen what happens with USAID--simply dumped Americans overseas without providing repatriation.

That being said, basically everything they are "saving" is either being walked back or is based on not understanding.