Trever Noah on the Daily Show

[Blahface]

So...two episodes in so far. What do you think of him? I think he seems to be doing an OK job, but nothing special yet. Sometimes it feels like he is doing a Jon Stewart impersonation. His show is at least better than the Nightly Show.

 

[Bacillus anthracis]

I've been pleasantly surprised so far. When he was announced as the new guy, I went and looked at his standup and since then have been convinced he'd be awful. But he hasn't been. So I'll keep watching. There are also some new cast members who seem pretty decent and some old ones like Jordan Klepper who just need to go.

The Nightly Show is getting better, but it started out trying to appeal to a tiny demographic. It may not be able to survive that early strategy.

 

[Underseer]

I've been pleasantly surprised so far. When he was announced as the new guy, I went and looked at his standup and since then have been convinced he'd be awful. But he hasn't been. So I'll keep watching. There are also some new cast members who seem pretty decent and some old ones like Jordan Klepper who just need to go.

The Nightly Show is getting better, but it started out trying to appeal to a tiny demographic. It may not be able to survive that early strategy.

Oh no. They tried to address African-American issues, therefore the show will die?

If what you say is true, then that is all the more reason to have a show that discusses these issues, because evidently we need this discussion as a nation.

 

[Samhain]

I thought about making a new thread for what I'm about to say, but since this had already been started I figured I'd post it here instead.

So, it's been about a month and a half since Trevor Noah took over and I've watched all of the episodes thus far, but I've come to the conclusion that he doesn't work for The Daily Show. First, let me just say that total viewership in the first month is down 37%. Now, that could mean any number of things, but if viewers anything like me, then while we were sad to see Jon leave the show, we were also ready to embrace new blood.

However, for me, the new blood hasn't worked out well. I understand the push Jon wanted and perhaps CC wanted to give the show a more international voice, but I think that is precisely where they erred. Noah is a foreigner, but not in the same sense that John Oliver is a foreigner (and no, it's not because he's black). The reason why The Daily Show with Jon Stewart worked is because Jon was an American, not in spite of it. When you watched Jon the reason why you listened is because you knew, to some extent, he was just like you when it came to politics. While his view of news was mostly satirical, you also could sense that underlying that was a deep sense of disgust with certain parts of the way the US Government functions, and the reason why that was there to begin with was because he was American. Ultimately, for Jon, this is his country, he wants it to do well, he has an inherent interest in changing the way politics works for the better, because he is American. With Noah, you get a different sense. So far he views American politics as an outsider, which is precisely why the show doesn't work nearly as well. There have been genuine moments with Noah, but even they feel slightly off. For example, when he addressed the Oregon mass shooting, he did a great job, but it still felt like, to me at least, that he was addressing these things as someone outside the system. Now, with time, Noah may end up working out, but how many years might it take for that to happen? It has worked out well for John Oliver, for example, but remember that he was a correspondent on The Daily Show for 7 years prior to landing his own show on HBO. Noah hasn't even lived in the US that long. Ultimately, The Daily Show is about America and American politics, while it is interesting to view our current state of affairs through a foreign lens from time to time, to rely solely upon it doesn't work. Now, to some extent The Daily Show isn't even about Trevor Noah, it's about the writers. But while many of the jokes are still Jon Stewart jokes, where Jon's presence is going to be missed most is going to be his interview skills (which is ironic, because Jon was never a great interviewer). But it makes me think of one of the episodes from the last couple of months with Jon on the air, when he interviewed Judith Miller of the NY Times. His contempt and disgust with the media is clear, he doesn't hold back any punches and he berates Miller for her role in the lead-up to the Iraq war to an extent that one might actually begin to feel sorry for her. But he's right to be disgusted with all of it, and he lays out his case in such a way that you find it hard to disagree with his feelings on the subject...but it's because he cared. He cared enough about what a massive debacle the war was and how poorly the media vetted the stories at the beginning to actually say something about it. He takes it personally in a way that Trevor Noah simply can't at this point, and that's really what makes it hard for me to watch Noah coming off of watching Jon for years and years.

 

[Underseer]

Really? Nationality has that much influence on your enjoyment of the show?

You can't enjoy political satire unless the person presenting it is more like you? Weird.

I only watched Jon Stewart occasionally, and I only watch Trevor occasionally. So far, I'm not into it, but I'm still waiting to form any strong opinions. I imagine it'll take a while for the writers to figure out how to work with a new personality, and it'll take Trevor a while to really settle in. Jon's early shows were much weaker until he hit is stride, so I'm going to give the show the benefit of doubt for a while.

 

[Samhain]

It's not just nationality. Like I said, John Oliver has done well. But the problem is covering political issues which you're not familiar with because you're not from here. Now, granted, it may be that there are people that are from here that would do even worse because they don't follow politics, but that's what sums it up for it for me. If you don't know and understand American politics how do you expect to cover them? In essence it's not because he's South African, that's incidental. But him only living here for like 4 years and only being a correspondent on the Daily Show for one of those years makes it stand out.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

 

[Underseer]

It's not just nationality. Like I said, John Oliver has done well. But the problem is covering political issues which you're not familiar with because you're not from here. Now, granted, it may be that there are people that are from here that would do even worse because they don't follow politics, but that's what sums it up for it for me. If you don't know and understand American politics how do you expect to cover them? In essence it's not because he's South African, that's incidental. But him only living here for like 4 years and only being a correspondent on the Daily Show for one of those years makes it stand out.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

Why does that even matter?

He is almost certainly working with the same writers, most of whom are almost certainly American. They're the ones that need to understand the issues, and it's pretty clear from the dialog that the writers understand the issues just as well as they did when Stewart was in front of the camera. I think your perceptions and preconceptions are interfering with what you are seeing.

Are you a conservative or libertarian? Do you generally have negative feelings about "them durn farenurs"?

Or perhaps you like me haven't started enjoying it yet, and are just randomly fishing around for a reason and the nationality thing just popped into your head for whatever reason?

Like I said, it hasn't grown on me either yet, but I'm still waiting for form an opinion. TV shows of any kind can take a while to settle in to a major change like this. Most new Star Trek series are pretty damn bland for the first year or more.

 

[Samhain]

It's not just nationality. Like I said, John Oliver has done well. But the problem is covering political issues which you're not familiar with because you're not from here. Now, granted, it may be that there are people that are from here that would do even worse because they don't follow politics, but that's what sums it up for it for me. If you don't know and understand American politics how do you expect to cover them? In essence it's not because he's South African, that's incidental. But him only living here for like 4 years and only being a correspondent on the Daily Show for one of those years makes it stand out.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

Why does that even matter?

He is almost certainly working with the same writers, most of whom are almost certainly American. They're the ones that need to understand the issues, and it's pretty clear from the dialog that the writers understand the issues just as well as they did when Stewart was in front of the camera. I think your perceptions and preconceptions are interfering with what you are seeing.

Are you a conservative or libertarian? Do you generally have negative feelings about "them durn farenurs"?

Or perhaps you like me haven't started enjoying it yet, and are just randomly fishing around for a reason and the nationality thing just popped into your head for whatever reason?

Like I said, it hasn't grown on me either yet, but I'm still waiting for form an opinion. TV shows of any kind can take a while to settle in to a major change like this. Most new Star Trek series are pretty damn bland for the first year or more.

I know I haven't been active that much lately but I certainly wouldn't describe myself as conservative or libertarian. Like I said before, the writers do carry the show to some extent but the biggest reason I watched Jon was because of the unscripted moments and the interviews.

It's not that I'm grasping for things. I've watched Jon religiously for years and years and ocasionally he disappointed me but most of the time I felt he had a firm understanding of the issues that plague this country, including, but not limited to "Bullshit Mountain." So what I really miss is his insight on those issues, as someone looking at these issues from the inside, rather than someone looking at them from the outside.

I really don't know how to explain it better than that. I wanted to like Trevor Noah, and I think with time I will l, but he has to be an someone with a vested interest in this country to make the show make sense to me. Noam Chomsky has been asked several times why he is so critical of American foreign policy (and Israel to some extent). His reasoning is that those that are vested in this country, those that have a voice in the system, are those that have the most responsibility to speak out against the terrible things our country does (and that Israel does with our country's support). I don't mean to make this more political than it needs to be, but it is a political show and it's heart so...

 

[Underseer]

Ah, so that must be it.

You're so depressed about missing Jon that you're lashing out at Trevor and latching on to the first criticism that comes to mind.

I have to say though, that this criticism seems a bit bizarre.

Honestly, I would have preferred they went with that Egyptian guy who made appearances with Jon towards the end of his run, but I'm still waiting to give Trevor the benefit of doubt. I hope the Egyptian guy makes return appearances. Apparently he was inspired by Jon and has been needling various governments around the middle east in similar fashion. That deserves some attention.

 

[Samhain]

Ah, so that must be it.

You're so depressed about missing Jon that you're lashing out at Trevor and latching on to the first criticism that comes to mind.

I have to say though, that this criticism seems a bit bizarre.

It's equally bizarre to me that you couldn't find merit it anything that I said and automatically assumed that I must be some conservative or libertarian. Then again, you said you don't really watch the show that much so somehow I don't feel like it's a failure on my part to explain it.

 

[Iznomneak]

I didn't like him much at first, but I gave him a chance and I'm liking him better. I suspect they are using some of the same writers as before so the humor would be very similar. I can't say I watch it every night (nor did I Jon Stewart), but I'll watch when I can.

 

[thebeave]

Ah, so that must be it.

You're so depressed about missing Jon that you're lashing out at Trevor and latching on to the first criticism that comes to mind.

I have to say though, that this criticism seems a bit bizarre.

It's equally bizarre to me that you couldn't find merit it anything that I said and automatically assumed that I must be some conservative or libertarian. Then again, you said you don't really watch the show that much so somehow I don't feel like it's a failure on my part to explain it.

Samhain, you need to look deep in your heart and admit you are nothing but a right wing racist, as shown by your microaggressions and lack of enthusiasm about a foreign "person of color". At this point, it would be wise for you to confess your racism via a video apology in the Support Fireside forum. Its likely the members here will forgive you and allow you to move on and once again become a respected member of TFT. For inspiration on your apology video, I recommend Jimmy Swaggart:

 

[braces_for_impact]

I thought about making a new thread for what I'm about to say, but since this had already been started I figured I'd post it here instead.

So, it's been about a month and a half since Trevor Noah took over and I've watched all of the episodes thus far, but I've come to the conclusion that he doesn't work for The Daily Show. First, let me just say that total viewership in the first month is down 37%. Now, that could mean any number of things, but if viewers anything like me, then while we were sad to see Jon leave the show, we were also ready to embrace new blood.

However, for me, the new blood hasn't worked out well. I understand the push Jon wanted and perhaps CC wanted to give the show a more international voice, but I think that is precisely where they erred. Noah is a foreigner, but not in the same sense that John Oliver is a foreigner (and no, it's not because he's black). The reason why The Daily Show with Jon Stewart worked is because Jon was an American, not in spite of it. When you watched Jon the reason why you listened is because you knew, to some extent, he was just like you when it came to politics. While his view of news was mostly satirical, you also could sense that underlying that was a deep sense of disgust with certain parts of the way the US Government functions, and the reason why that was there to begin with was because he was American. Ultimately, for Jon, this is his country, he wants it to do well, he has an inherent interest in changing the way politics works for the better, because he is American. With Noah, you get a different sense. So far he views American politics as an outsider, which is precisely why the show doesn't work nearly as well. There have been genuine moments with Noah, but even they feel slightly off. For example, when he addressed the Oregon mass shooting, he did a great job, but it still felt like, to me at least, that he was addressing these things as someone outside the system. Now, with time, Noah may end up working out, but how many years might it take for that to happen? It has worked out well for John Oliver, for example, but remember that he was a correspondent on The Daily Show for 7 years prior to landing his own show on HBO. Noah hasn't even lived in the US that long. Ultimately, The Daily Show is about America and American politics, while it is interesting to view our current state of affairs through a foreign lens from time to time, to rely solely upon it doesn't work. Now, to some extent The Daily Show isn't even about Trevor Noah, it's about the writers. But while many of the jokes are still Jon Stewart jokes, where Jon's presence is going to be missed most is going to be his interview skills (which is ironic, because Jon was never a great interviewer). But it makes me think of one of the episodes from the last couple of months with Jon on the air, when he interviewed Judith Miller of the NY Times. His contempt and disgust with the media is clear, he doesn't hold back any punches and he berates Miller for her role in the lead-up to the Iraq war to an extent that one might actually begin to feel sorry for her. But he's right to be disgusted with all of it, and he lays out his case in such a way that you find it hard to disagree with his feelings on the subject...but it's because he cared. He cared enough about what a massive debacle the war was and how poorly the media vetted the stories at the beginning to actually say something about it. He takes it personally in a way that Trevor Noah simply can't at this point, and that's really what makes it hard for me to watch Noah coming off of watching Jon for years and years.

I think there's a lot of truth in what you said. But, there's also something that's different that I can't quite put my finger on. Now, I know that Trevor is pretty new to all this, and so are the writers in setting him up every night, but there seems to be something lacking. As you say, it may just take some time. What else I noticed though, were my thoughts of shows past. Do you remember when John was off making that movie in bumfuck egypt and Jon Oliver took the show for awhile? I thought he did a great job; it surprised me how much I enjoyed him taking the reigns of the show. I don't get that feeling with Noah though. Yet, they're both foreigners. Interesting.

 

[Rhea]

I'm also trying to give him the benefit of a break-in period, but I think Samhain's points have merit.

The show had always been to me about perspective - and that was the perspective of being deeply affected by the political outcomes that were happening. And hence the humor had a strong - very strong - reliance on the nuances of how politics affect us all.

And I agree that Trevor Noah's tone doesn't (yet?) have that sense of personal risk.
He may gain that over time.
But right now I can't really picture him being _actually_outraged_ over what some politics are doing to our country. I don't see him as being _invested_. (yet?) So instead of gallows humor, it's "just" humor. If that makes sense.

I agree with Samhain's premise. Not sure if it is permanent or a transition. But I would like to see _inside_ Trevor Noah a little bit. maybe he could do some bits where he is immersed and affected somehow, so we can see him get, or become aware that he has, some sort of emotional, financial and moral investment in the political process. I think it makes the jokes better, more layered and more pointed when we see that as the broth in which they are delivered.

 

[Samhain]

So instead of gallows humor, it's "just" humor. If that makes sense.

I like this line; it seems to sum up pretty well the feelings about Noah that I was struggling to put down in writing. Like everyone else, I'm willing to give him some more time to figure it out. Jon Stewart wasn't Jon Stewart when he first started either, I realize that. But I do wish that they had thought about this a bit more prior to the transition. In an ideal world John Oliver would have taken over, I really liked his brief stint as host. But really, I like Last Week Tonight in its own right at this point and more so because it is Oliver's own show rather than John Oliver hosting Jon Stewart's Daily Show.

 

[Horatio Parker]

What Jon Stewart had was insight plus the ability to communicate, often in a funny way.

Noah is funny, but, so far anyway, isn't as deep as JS.

But he's doing OK, give him time.

 

[Toni]

I'm with Samhain re: Noah. He's very cute and engaging but he doesn't quite work for me. Part of it is the fact that he's not American. One reason that Stewart's schtict worked is because he is American and there was a thread of self deprecation in the humor and satire. It's like one can tell a certain kind of unflattering stories about yourself and your family that don't quite word from an outsider.

 

[Philos]

What Jon Stewart had was insight plus the ability to communicate, often in a funny way.

Noah is funny, but, so far anyway, isn't as deep as JS.

But he's doing OK, give him time.

Folks,

That's how it feels for me. Colbert seems to have picked up some of Stewart's thunder and John Oliver is working it too, in his British way. Trevor Noah is lighter, but "give him time".

Alex.

 

[Horatio Parker]

What Jon Stewart had was insight plus the ability to communicate, often in a funny way.

Noah is funny, but, so far anyway, isn't as deep as JS.

But he's doing OK, give him time.

Folks,

That's how it feels for me. Colbert seems to have picked up some of Stewart's thunder and John Oliver is working it too, in his British way. Trevor Noah is lighter, but "give him time".

Alex.

I don't think he has to be. Plenty of smart people have studied John Stewart over the years.

I've watched some of John Oliver's monologues. Some are as perceptive as Stewart's, and I assume JO doesn't write his own stuff. So it's not as if it were magic. I wouldn't blame Noah if he wanted to keep it on the light side until he gets his bearings; those are some damn big shoes.

 

[Underseer]

OK, I watched it last night, well most of a show anyway. I just watched the monologue, but then I did the same thing with Jon's show.

He's definitely growing on me. I've noticed that they are doing more comedy based on his ability to do unusual accents, something Jon didn't do, and it works well.