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True Christian Diocese fires 42 lying, faker, godless pedophiles.

...

But you know, over these last few weeks, I've been struck by how furiously atheists (non-stamp collectors) here at Talk Freethought have fought against the suggestion that pedophiles hiding in the clergy might be atheists.

Why is that?

Are you defending atheism? Why so sensitive? Atheism isn't a club you belong to. You don't owe your "fellow atheists" undying loyalty. If an atheist (non-stamp collector) on the other side of the world just so happens to be committing fraud and reciting bible sermons about evil lust on Sunday then molesting children on Monday, what does that have to do with YOUR atheism?

It's a contradiction of your own mantra about the NTS fallacy.

I am surprised that you are making this kind of claim, because there is no evidence that any of them are atheists. OTOH, they are all priests, which is evidence that they are Christians. So you simply make this assertion and then scold others here for rejecting it merely because they are atheists. And, to dig yourself deeper into your hole, you even appear to assert that rejection of your preposterous claim is some kind of NTS fallacy among atheists. Why? Because nobody here believes that there are no true atheist pedophiles?

:strawman:

It turns out that, in your world, claiming it is possible for a person to put sugar on his porridge and still be considered a Scotsman is also some kind of "NTS fallacy".
 
The Roman Catholic diocese in Buffalo has released the names of 42 'priests' dismissed for alleged sexual abuse of a minor.
Good riddance!

https://www.northcountrypublicradio...-lists-42-priests-dismissed-for-alleged-abuse

Cue the NTS fallacy chorus of atheists wanting to disown them.

42 Christian pedophiles.

I wonder what it is about Christianity that makes so many of them pedophiles.

Sexual repression. Christianity imposes a bunch of arbitrary rules about sexual behaviour, all of which have the effect of limiting the options people who try to follow those rules have to release the buildup of sexual tension and desire. Prohibiting men from masturbation significantly increases the chances that they will release their sex drive in an uncontrolled way that can harm others. In the case of RC priests, this effect is made even worse by the prohibition against marriage - effectively the religious dogma says that men can and should completely abstain from orgasms for their entire life, and that attempting this is a laudable and positive thing. It's yet another example of how religion gets everything wrong.

A man who has no qualms about having a quick wank in private if he feels the urge to do so is unlikely to seek sexual release by raping people. A man who is allowed no sexual release at all will likely fail to restrain himself sooner or later (due to basic biology); And when he does, it is likely to happen when in the presence of, and at the expense of, people he is supposed to care for, again for basic biological reasons. The endocrine system can only be suppressed by the CNS for so long, and the hormones involved in erotic love are much the same as the ones involved in filial love.

Trying to avoid harmful sexual encounters while remaining completely celibate and sexless is about as easy as trying to avoid crashing your car while driving drunk - the chemicals in your bloodstream make it very difficult indeed. Of course, not all priests rape children; Some are lucky (just as some people get away with driving drunk without crashing); Some are smart (or fortunate) enough to choose non-harmful outlets such as masturbation, or a (theologically unsanctioned) consenting relationship with another adult - often another priest, or a parishioner or congregant, due to availability - but then suffer needless psychological trauma because their religion sets them up to feel intensely guilty about doing that.

The whole thing is HUGELY fucked up. If priests were allowed to jerk off in the privacy of their own bathroom or bedroom; and/or were allowed to have normal sexual relationships with other adults (including marriage if they so choose), this problem would be FAR less prevalent.

Successful religions always try to control and dictate the lives of their members, and to convert or kill non-members. This power grab is absolute - they are like the Party in Orwell's 1984, who demand obedience in ALL things, for obedience's sake. Dictatorial control inevitably leads to harmful attempts to break free; And when everything is subject to inviolable rules, it becomes hard for the enslaved to understand which rules are more immoral than others. This utter and abject failure to grasp which rules should or could be safely broken is visible throughout the response of the RCC to these scandals - they cannot grasp how blaming the victims is wrong, because their twisted and immoral dogma implies that everyone involved - including (or even especially) the victims - are sinners and should be punished. Indeed, the degree of blame that they actually attach to an offence seems to be determined not by the severity of the crime (or sin), but by the identity and hierarchical position of the criminal (or sinner). A Bishop is entitled to more presumption of innocence, and to greater protection from his crimes, than is a priest; A priest is less blameworthy than a parishioner; and adults who toe the dogmatic line are less blameworthy than children, who often do not (simply because they are untrained in the arbitrary regulations that the church seeks to impose).

It's a vile and pernicious ideology, in which morality is dependent, not upon what is done, but rather upon who is doing it.

Of course there's also likely an element of the fact that people with an innate paedophile tendency might be attracted to the 'easy pickings' that come with being a priest; But it's probably easier for such people to get access to children by becoming sports coaches, teachers, or childcare workers, than it is to go through seminary, whereby it could be years, if ever, before they are given charge over their victims.
 
But you know, over these last few weeks, I've been struck by how furiously atheists (non-stamp collectors) here at Talk Freethought have fought against the suggestion that pedophiles hiding in the clergy might be atheists.

Why is that?

Oh, _that’s_ your question?

The easy answer to that is that priesthood is not the only way to be a pedophile, and for an atheist it would be an excrutiating one. Gah, imagine have to preach every day and repeat that dreck? So much easier to buy a sleeping bag and become a boyscout leader.
 
But you know, over these last few weeks, I've been struck by how furiously atheists (non-stamp collectors) here at Talk Freethought have fought against the suggestion that pedophiles hiding in the clergy might be atheists.

Why is that?

Oh, _that’s_ your question?

The easy answer to that is that priesthood is not the only way to be a pedophile, and for an atheist it would be an excrutiating one. Gah, imagine have to preach every day and repeat that dreck? So much easier to buy a sleeping bag and become a boyscout leader.

I think it's quite fucking obvious. Atheists don't become part of the clergy....we have better things to do. There is absolutely zero suggestion that pervert pedos are atheists in clergy jobs...they all claim to be, and have the track record of....TRUE xtians. pious perverts to a man.
 
...
Of course there's also likely an element of the fact that people with an innate paedophile tendency might be attracted to the 'easy pickings' that come with being a priest; But it's probably easier for such people to get access to children by becoming sports coaches, teachers, or childcare workers, than it is to go through seminary, whereby it could be years, if ever, before they are given charge over their victims.

However, devout Catholics who feel sexual attraction to children would likely have feelings of guilt. The priesthood might appear to be a path to dealing with those unwanted feelings and the guilt. I doubt that most of these priests started out with the calculation that they could use their occupation to molest children, but the job would put them into contact with lots of children, who would be inclined to trust them as representatives of God and maybe forgive them for their sinful weaknesses. Who knows? People who end up committing crimes don't always start out as criminals.
 
I know we're not supposed* to mention the words "homosexual" and "pedophile" in the same sentence but I think you're overlooking an obvious confluence of attraction to the clergy.

*Because no True Homosexual can ever be attracted to young boys
 
But you know, over these last few weeks, I've been struck by how furiously atheists (non-stamp collectors) here at Talk Freethought have fought against the suggestion that pedophiles hiding in the clergy might be atheists.
Might be?

Who's arguing against 'they might be' atheists?

Anyone? Hands?

What I see is Lion making a positive assertion that they are ALL atheists, as defined by their apparent guilt of diddling children entrusted to their care (or at least parked within their reach). And the accompanying assertion that the people who fired them are all True Christains, as identified by their firing the atheist pedophiles.
The 'pushback' seems, to me, to be the claim that they are all True Christains or Atheists.

And then Lion twisting the results to something else...

As usual for Lion.

IIRC, we had a former pastor on here who became an atheist before he quit being a pastor. So it's possible some of them might be atheists, but that's not a foregone conclusion just because of their sexuality.
And some of those who fired these 42 pedophiles might also be pedophiles involved in covering their own ass, no?

So mostly, this thread is a display of Lion exhibiting his prejudices and acting all butthurt that people are reacting exactly as he expected them to...
 
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I know we're not supposed* to mention the words "homosexual" and "pedophile" in the same sentence but I think you're overlooking an obvious confluence of attraction to the clergy.

*Because no True Homosexual can ever be attracted to young boys

Probably because homosexuality is a completely different thing which isn't related to the raping of children, which is probably why we don't mention it in relation to discussions about pedophilia any more than we mention that some people like chocolate.
 
blah blah blah

Are you going to tell us why you think these pedophiles are atheists anytime soon? Or are you going to run away and hide again? You are not helping your cause here; all you are doing is reinforcing the stereotype of the Christian apologists who use lies and misinformation to support their worldview.

I don't have tell you why I think they are atheists. I can just assert it - in exactly the same way phands asserts they are True Christians. If an atheist and/or a pedophile can masquerade as a priest and simply call themself something they are not, then I'm not going to have reservations about saying "no you're NOT".

Now, if there were some huge, glaring logical contradiction between being a True Atheist and;
- sexual perversion
- hedonism
- self interest
- living like there's no tomorrow (afterlife)
- lying
- blaspheming and treating holy religious institutions like your own personal brothel

...then I might be willing to reconsider the otherwise obvious link.

First, I appreciate you taking the time to post a real response, and not just a quick dig. And for acknowledging that you don't actually know that these priests were atheists.

As I posted in my email, there is no contradiction between being a sinner and a Christian. In fact, the very existence of Christianity is predicated on the assumption that all humans are sinners in need of salvation. So it would make sense that some Christians, even though they believe in the teachings of the Bible, are led to do bad things. They are human after all. Being a priest does not take away their drives, criminal or otherwise, it just places them on a pedestal that is slightly more elevated than regular people in terms of expectations as to how they will behave. You can be a Christian priest who believes in God and still do bad things. Agree?


But you know, over these last few weeks, I've been struck by how furiously atheists (non-stamp collectors) here at Talk Freethought have fought against the suggestion that pedophiles hiding in the clergy might be atheists.

Why is that?

Are you defending atheism? Why so sensitive? Atheism isn't a club you belong to. You don't owe your "fellow atheists" undying loyalty. If an atheist (non-stamp collector) on the other side of the world just so happens to be committing fraud and reciting bible sermons about evil lust on Sunday then molesting children on Monday, what does that have to do with YOUR atheism?

It's a contradiction of your own mantra about the NTS fallacy.

I don't think they are defending atheism. I think they are reacting to your characterization of these criminals as atheists when you have no evidence to support it. I am sure some priests who go into the clergy lose their faith over time and become nonbelievers, but continue in their chosen profession because of various reasons. But that doesn't mean you have to be an atheist in priests clothing to molest children.

I don't know where you live, but here in the southern United States it is difficult to be an out-of-the-closet atheist. There is a social stigma attached to atheism that rivals that of being a hardened criminal. Being a shunned minority makes people sensitive.
 
I wish it were possible to have a discussion about morals with Christians or Muslims without the no true Scotsman fallacy being used.

Muslim: Islam makes people morally superior!
Me: But what about the suicide bombers and ISIS?
Muslim: Aha, but those are not real Muslims, therefore my moral claim is still true!​
 
I wish it were possible to have a discussion about morals with an everyday, garden variety, stereotypical atheist group-thinker, without them presuming that all muslims are wannabe suicide bombers.
 
I wish it were possible to have a discussion about morals with an everyday, garden variety, stereotypical atheist group-thinker, without them presuming that all muslims are wannabe suicide bombers.
Leaving aside the fact that you can easily find atheist group thinkers who do not presume that at all (e.g., most left wingers qualify), why would you want to discuss morals with a group thinker, instead of an atheist who isn't a group thinker?
 
But you know, over these last few weeks, I've been struck by how furiously atheists (non-stamp collectors) here at Talk Freethought have fought against the suggestion that pedophiles hiding in the clergy might be atheists.
Might be?

Who's arguing against 'they might be' atheists?

Anyone? Hands?
Ditto in a huge way on this point! The all or nothing thingy....kind of reminds me of child throwing sand in a sandbox...

What I see is Lion making a positive assertion that they are ALL atheists, as defined by their apparent guilt of diddling children entrusted to their care (or at least parked within their reach). And the accompanying assertion that the people who fired them are all True Christains, as identified by their firing the atheist pedophiles.
The 'pushback' seems, to me, to be the claim that they are all True Christains or Atheists.

And then Lion twisting the results to something else...

As usual for Lion.

IIRC, we had a former pastor on here who became an atheist before he quit being a pastor. So it's possible some of them might be atheists, but that's not a foregone conclusion just because of their sexuality.
And some of those who fired these 42 pedophiles might also be pedophiles involved in covering their own ass, no?

So mostly, this thread is a display of Lion exhibiting his prejudices and acting all butthurt that people are reacting exactly as he expected them to...
Yup
 
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