Trump - Alleged Poor Empathy

[sharon45]

I don't understand how it relates to what you wrote, but it is based on many people's responses I have seen when someone without much confidence tries to be empathic, and are quickly shown that they are not very good at dealing with any unexpected backlash.

Hey, there might be a few flies left outside that still have their wings on.

 

[sharon45]

She doesn't do anything of the sort, because she is supposed to be a good little mourner. The real point of my illustration is that there are really no pleasing words, only such platitudes from a kind of Hallmark card. The mother is obviously an adult, but she is forced into a wretched position that has to make her look like a child.

So then the question becomes, could Trump empathize and skillfully deal with that if it happened? Answer: Given the evidence of what and how he is, almost certainly not.

His response, no matter how ill-conceived it may have sounded to others, was at least his words, and not basically a well-rehearsed form letter as most presidents give.

Actually, according to Kelly, that lien was rehearsed.
The part of the complaint that the Congresswoman attributes even more to the widow than the now oft quoted phrase, was that your President didn't call her husband by his name and called him "your guy", not "your husband". Perhaps Don Trump thought he was talking to Mary "My Guy" Wells, a Motown artist from his youth.

Yeah, I did hear about that after I wrote this. Same with the confusion of whether is was about a mother, an aunt, then I hear that it is actually the wife.

 

[sharon45]

I purposely left that typo there for anyone wishing to abuse it. If people don't like being tested, don't fall for them.

Suuure. I totally believe you.

The teacher-pupil relationship only exists amongst adults with the consent of both parties; You can declare yourself to be someone's teacher, but if they didn't ask you to be, and you make the claim anyway, that's just going to result in people thinking that you are an arsehole.

There, now you might have learned something today.

What, are you telling me that you missed my typo a lot further up in this thread? Was that not poetically apt also? I purposely leave all of my typos I don't catch early enough. You will notice that my posts are never shown as edited afterward at the bottom.

 

[sharon45]

I purposely left that typo there for anyone wishing to abuse it. If people don't like being tested, don't fall for them.

Suuure. I totally believe you.

The teacher-pupil relationship only exists amongst adults with the consent of both parties;

Uh, fallacy. Our brains are learning almost all of the time while awake. People are constantly teaching me things, and I am learning from them without either of each other's consent.

You can declare yourself to be someone's teacher,

I didn't do any such thing. I said that I am here to teach, but that obviously doesn't mean that others are forced to learn from me.

but if they didn't ask you to be, and you make the claim anyway, that's just going to result in people thinking that you are an arsehole.

People have assumed much about me without bothering to ask. When I was here in 2011, some thought that I was an Obamabot, because I talked a lot about our current president, at that time. Now, some assume that I am some kind of Trumpsucker or whatever other pejorative, again, because I talk a lot about our now current president, yet I am still an independent thinker who honestly supported or supports neither.

There, now you might have learned something today.

I learn plenty every day, if only I had the worthy memory to actually retain it all.

 

[bilby]

Suuure. I totally believe you.

The teacher-pupil relationship only exists amongst adults with the consent of both parties; You can declare yourself to be someone's teacher, but if they didn't ask you to be, and you make the claim anyway, that's just going to result in people thinking that you are an arsehole.

There, now you might have learned something today.

What, are you telling me that you missed my typo a lot further up in this thread? Was that not poetically apt also? I purposely leave all of my typos I don't catch early enough. You will notice that my posts are never shown as edited afterward at the bottom.

Well aren't you just so fucking special.

You seem awfully keen to teach, but as someone who obviously has a LOT to learn, perhaps you should keep that fact to yourself, lest others think you an arrogant ass.

 

[Elixir]

What, are you telling me that you missed my typo a lot further up in this thread? Was that not poetically apt also? I purposely leave all of my typos I don't catch early enough. You will notice that my posts are never shown as edited afterward at the bottom.

Well aren't you just so fucking special.

You seem awfully keen to teach, but as someone who obviously has a LOT to learn, perhaps you should keep that fact to yourself, lest others think you an arrogant ass.

IMO, in order to truly appear arrogant, one must establish a lofty perch from which one can condescend. AFAICS, the poster has failed to do that.
It's hard to appear arrogant when speaking up from a gutter.

 

[funinspace]

I thought it would be a further challenge to use his naturally shitty speaking ability, add empathy, and still make the statement a much better one.

Challenge accepted!

"Mrs. Whateveryourname is, I am calling to let you know that nobody feels your pain like I do. I feel it bigly. Nobody has ever felt the pain I feel, and this call is so hard for me. Previous Presidents never felt pain like I do, and I get no credit for it. I feel the greatest pain. So I needed to tell you it was Rex's fault for getting into that fight with Chad which made me have to put them on the travel ban list, which made them stop patrolling the area where your guy got rubbed out. They're really bad people who did that, and if it wasn't for Obama I would have prevented it. Enjoy!"

How'd I do?

Did good! I was thinking that the 'if it wasn't for Obama" should have contained one of Don the Con's signature belittling name tags, but then I couldn't think of one he used on Pres Obama. Sure he lied a lot about Pres. Obama. I dug around a bit, and still didn't find one he tweeted...like 'Liddle Bob Corker'.

 

[KeepTalking]

That isn't the point. First, I didn't create such a test anywhere near what you describe here, and second, just like walking and chewing gum, I can easily partake in discourse, and teach at the same time. Of course this doesn't guarantee that others will learn, but I know that I at least will.

When you say things like "I came here to teach", it certainly makes it seem like you aren't interested in learning. It isn't my fault that you are having a difficult time communicating your purpose in this thread when you say things like that.

When you do call a grieving person about their lost loved one, you had better make sure you do so with empathy.

As I pointed out a few times before, everyone has their own personal idea of empathy.

That point must have gotten lost in your spectacular failure to properly employ the Socratic method. In fact, the best I can tell, the point you eventually got around to making after you dispensed with your testing, was that grieving person likely doesn't want empathy, whether that empathy be false or real. So, if you really did make the point you claim to have made more than once, perhaps you can provide a link to where that was. Regardless, I don't agree with your point. It is extremely obvious that the statement attributed to Trump lacked empathy. It is also without dispute, at least in this thread, that the statement I constructed did contain empathy. If you want to say it did not, please show your work.

The real mistake here is thinking your version is the same as someone else's.

em·pa·thy
noun
the ability to understand and share the feelings of another.

If you have another definition (version) for empathy that you are employing, please share it with us. Otherwise, you are incorrect, "empathy" is not a word that has a wide range of meaning.

The leader of the free world failed to meet that bar, likely because he is incapable of feeling empathy in such a situation. That is what this is about.

Once again, it is not honestly about empathy, even if the title of this thread is.

If it's not about empathy, why did you just tell me that your point was that "everyone has their own personal idea of empathy". You seem very confused about your own participation in this thread.

Not that you will learn anything from this exchange, given that you are only here to teach.

Obviously I learned here as I said, and taught way above, but looks like you weren't able to learn this, yet.

Okay, I'll bite. Please share with me what you have learned about the subject of this thread while participating in this discussion.

 

[Elixir]

em·pa·thy
noun
the ability to understand and share the feelings of another.

Oh, but republitards each have their own ideas about definitions, facts, etc..

Crowd sizes, numbers of fraudulent votes cast in the 2016 election, Trump's past support of foreign wars, muslims celebrating 9/11 attacks, Obama's birthplace, what empathy really is, the sun setting the West... "everyone has their own personal idea" of all those things, don't ya know.

 

[funinspace]

em·pa·thy
noun
the ability to understand and share the feelings of another.

Oh, but republitards each have their own ideas about definitions, facts, etc..

Crowd sizes, numbers of fraudulent votes cast in the 2016 election, Trump's past support of foreign wars, muslims celebrating 9/11 attacks, Obama's birthplace, what empathy really is, the sun setting the West... "everyone has their own personal idea" of all those things, don't ya know.

Wut bout personal ideas of teachers

 

[Elixir]

Oh, but republitards each have their own ideas about definitions, facts, etc..

Crowd sizes, numbers of fraudulent votes cast in the 2016 election, Trump's past support of foreign wars, muslims celebrating 9/11 attacks, Obama's birthplace, what empathy really is, the sun setting the West... "everyone has their own personal idea" of all those things, don't ya know.

Wut bout personal ideas of teachers

View attachment 12864

To be valuable, personal ideas have to be based on experience.
Sign me up for that class!

 

[sharon45]

What, are you telling me that you missed my typo a lot further up in this thread? Was that not poetically apt also? I purposely leave all of my typos I don't catch early enough. You will notice that my posts are never shown as edited afterward at the bottom.

Well aren't you just so fucking special.

Let's just say that I have much experience with getting picked it, because I don't quite fit a mold others may want me in.

You seem awfully keen to teach, but as someone who obviously has a LOT to learn, perhaps you should keep that fact to yourself, lest others think you an arrogant ass.

Being honest as much as possible is not arrogant, it is humble. As I have said, I have no pride, but I am not ashamed either. OTOH, Trump projects that he has a lot of pride, and that is mainly why he constantly gets into various political scraps.

 

[sharon45]

Well aren't you just so fucking special.

You seem awfully keen to teach, but as someone who obviously has a LOT to learn, perhaps you should keep that fact to yourself, lest others think you an arrogant ass.

IMO, in order to truly appear arrogant, one must establish a lofty perch from which one can condescend. AFAICS, the poster has failed to do that.
It's hard to appear arrogant when speaking up from a gutter.

Exactly. You seem to get it. Dust from dust.

 

[sharon45]

When you say things like "I came here to teach", it certainly makes it seem like you aren't interested in learning. It isn't my fault that you are having a difficult time communicating your purpose in this thread when you say things like that.

That could possibly apply if I was a drive-by poster, but instead, I have no problem going over misunderstandings with my material many times if necessary. One is this: "I came here to teach." Some people go to restaurants to talk, but that doesn't mean they won't eat or drink anything while talking there. I just said above that we all learn from and teach almost the entire day among others.

When you do call a grieving person about their lost loved one, you had better make sure you do so with empathy.

As I pointed out a few times before, everyone has their own personal idea of empathy.

That point must have gotten lost in your spectacular failure to properly employ the Socratic method. In fact, the best I can tell, the point you eventually got around to making after you dispensed with your testing,

I am about never done testing.

was that grieving person likely doesn't want empathy, whether that empathy be false or real.

You would have to ask the widow, but of course it doesn't mean that you will get an honest answer. For me personally, I don't want or need such coddling, be it an act or not.

So, if you really did make the point you claim to have made more than once, perhaps you can provide a link to where that was. Regardless, I don't agree with your point. It is extremely obvious that the statement attributed to Trump lacked empathy. It is also without dispute, at least in this thread, that the statement I constructed did contain empathy. If you want to say it did not, please show your work.

You haven't yet truly shown your work, since empathy is merely a personal opinion. I said that Trump did not show empathy, because it can't be honest when he isn't actually connected with this widow or the soldier's family. People themselves already have a very hard time comprehending their own feelings, let alone dare think they could understand another's. That is my view and work, and others are surely free to agree or disagree.

The real mistake here is thinking your version is the same as someone else's.

em·pa·thy
noun
the ability to understand and share the feelings of another.

If you have another definition (version) for empathy that you are employing, please share it with us. Otherwise, you are incorrect, "empathy" is not a word that has a wide range of meaning.

I just gave you the one above. People can't possibly understand and share the feelings of another, they can only try then fail or pretend.

The leader of the free world failed to meet that bar, likely because he is incapable of feeling empathy in such a situation. That is what this is about.

Once again, it is not honestly about empathy, even if the title of this thread is.

If it's not about empathy, why did you just tell me that your point was that "everyone has their own personal idea of empathy".

I gave that referring to what empathy means, as your dictionary cite.

You seem very confused about your own participation in this thread.

The issue is about people expecting a stranger to put on an act for them in order to make them somehow feel better. If one likes Trump, this may pass, but if one doesn't like him, this easily won't pass.

Not that you will learn anything from this exchange, given that you are only here to teach.

Obviously I learned here as I said, and taught way above, but looks like you weren't able to learn this, yet.

Okay, I'll bite. Please share with me what you have learned about the subject of this thread while participating in this discussion.

If I wasn't learning here, I wouldn't be able to understand and then answer your questions and comments. It is others here who claim confusion by me, but I am not confused by me or them.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

People can't possibly understand and share the feelings of another, they can only try then fail or pretend.

...

It is others here who claim confusion by me, but I am not confused by me or them.

So you are feeling misunderstood?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

People can't possibly understand and share the feelings of another, they can only try then fail or pretend.

...

It is others here who claim confusion by me, but I am not confused by me or them.

So you are feeling misunderstood?

Doubt it, seeing all they are doing is trolling.

 

[KeepTalking]

That could possibly apply if I was a drive-by poster, but instead, I have no problem going over misunderstandings with my material many times if necessary. One is this: "I came here to teach." Some people go to restaurants to talk, but that doesn't mean they won't eat or drink anything while talking there. I just said above that we all learn from and teach almost the entire day among others.

When you do call a grieving person about their lost loved one, you had better make sure you do so with empathy.

As I pointed out a few times before, everyone has their own personal idea of empathy.

That point must have gotten lost in your spectacular failure to properly employ the Socratic method. In fact, the best I can tell, the point you eventually got around to making after you dispensed with your testing,

I am about never done testing.

was that grieving person likely doesn't want empathy, whether that empathy be false or real.

You would have to ask the widow, but of course it doesn't mean that you will get an honest answer. For me personally, I don't want or need such coddling, be it an act or not.

So, if you really did make the point you claim to have made more than once, perhaps you can provide a link to where that was. Regardless, I don't agree with your point. It is extremely obvious that the statement attributed to Trump lacked empathy. It is also without dispute, at least in this thread, that the statement I constructed did contain empathy. If you want to say it did not, please show your work.

You haven't yet truly shown your work, since empathy is merely a personal opinion. I said that Trump did not show empathy, because it can't be honest when he isn't actually connected with this widow or the soldier's family. People themselves already have a very hard time comprehending their own feelings, let alone dare think they could understand another's. That is my view and work, and others are surely free to agree or disagree.

The real mistake here is thinking your version is the same as someone else's.

em·pa·thy
noun
the ability to understand and share the feelings of another.

If you have another definition (version) for empathy that you are employing, please share it with us. Otherwise, you are incorrect, "empathy" is not a word that has a wide range of meaning.

I just gave you the one above. People can't possibly understand and share the feelings of another, they can only try then fail or pretend.

The leader of the free world failed to meet that bar, likely because he is incapable of feeling empathy in such a situation. That is what this is about.

Once again, it is not honestly about empathy, even if the title of this thread is.

If it's not about empathy, why did you just tell me that your point was that "everyone has their own personal idea of empathy".

I gave that referring to what empathy means, as your dictionary cite.

So, it seems that your new point is not that people who are grieving don't want empathy, or that people have differing operational definitions of empathy, but rather that empathy is a meaningless term. Is that your final decision on the point you are trying to make in this thread, or should I expect further vacillation if I make any attempt to discuss this new point?

You seem very confused about your own participation in this thread.

The issue is about people expecting a stranger to put on an act for them in order to make them somehow feel better. If one likes Trump, this may pass, but if one doesn't like him, this easily won't pass.

Not that you will learn anything from this exchange, given that you are only here to teach.

Obviously I learned here as I said, and taught way above, but looks like you weren't able to learn this, yet.

Okay, I'll bite. Please share with me what you have learned about the subject of this thread while participating in this discussion.

If I wasn't learning here, I wouldn't be able to understand and then answer your questions and comments. It is others here who claim confusion by me, but I am not confused by me or them.

I don't agree. I can certainly understand questions and answer them without having learned anything. It is having your questions answered that usually leads to learning. Also, if you had learned anything about this topic in this thread, you should be able to tell me what it is you have learned. Would you like to try to do that now?

It is others here who claim confusion by me, but I am not confused by me or them.

Well, I am glad you are not confused about what anyone else is saying in this thread. The problem seems to be that others, myself included, are confused by what you are saying in this thread, and you are the only one who can clear that up for us. A bit of consistency in the point you are trying to make would certainly go a long way toward resolving that confusion.

 

[Elixir]

Well, I am glad you are not confused about what anyone else is saying in this thread. The problem seems to be that others, myself included, are confused by what you are saying in this thread, and you are the only one who can clear that up for us. A bit of consistency in the point you are trying to make would certainly go a long way toward resolving that confusion.

'45 obviously harbors opinions that would be unpopular and subject to scathing criticism on this forum if they were articulated concisely. It's a shame that the poster (apparently) lacks the courage to clearly state her positions since that reticence negates any possibility of cogent discussion. IMHO it's a waste of time to respond to cryptic quasi-assertions, having seen that when what is implied by such posts is responded to, the implications are uniformly met by "you're confused". Well, no shit - when that was the intent from square one, it is stupid to expect anything else.

 

[sharon45]

Well, I am glad you are not confused about what anyone else is saying in this thread. The problem seems to be that others, myself included, are confused by what you are saying in this thread, and you are the only one who can clear that up for us. A bit of consistency in the point you are trying to make would certainly go a long way toward resolving that confusion.

'45 obviously harbors opinions that would be unpopular and subject to scathing criticism on this forum if they were articulated concisely.

You got this right.

 

[sharon45]

People can't possibly understand and share the feelings of another, they can only try then fail or pretend.

...

It is others here who claim confusion by me, but I am not confused by me or them.

So you are feeling misunderstood?

I am quite used to being misunderstood, because I mostly like to talk about unpopular concepts. I grew up in a family that would constantly argue against the many different ideas that I came up with.