UK Labour party can't say what a woman is.

[TSwizzle]

The BBC reports that an 83 year old woman decapitated a 68 year old woman;

An adult female torso was found in a bag inside a shopping trolley near 83-year-old Harvey Marcelin's apartment in Brooklyn, New York. She has now been charged with second degree murder and concealment of a human corpse. Marcelin had previously spent more than 50 years in prison for killing two female friends. When police searched her apartment on 4 March, they found a human head and saw blades.

BBC

The fact is, Harvey Marcelin is a man, a serial killer it seems who has recently declared himself a woman. He was convicted as a man for previous murders of actual women. But here we are, a once respected news source going along with the charade, only once mentioning that we are in fact dealing with a male serial killer. No pockets picked, no bones broken I suppose but the BBC cannot be trusted.

 

[repoman]

So picking evil bastards as an example is kind of lame.

Even nice and kind people born male are still male forever despite any interventions or transition.

 

[Metaphor]

So picking evil bastards as an example is kind of lame.

Even nice and kind people born male are still male forever despite any interventions or transition.

The point is not that Harvey Marcelin is an evil bastard, though he is. The point is that gender ideology is so pervasive that reporting the actions of a man who previously killed two women, long before he 'identified' as being a woman, are told as if he were a woman, right now and back then (of course, he was a man the entire time).

And if Marcelin changes his name, the media that is in the clutches of gender ideology, such as the BBC, will refuse to 'deadname' him, too - effectively concealing his criminal past. Trans ideologists would not recognise that as a privilege, but of course it is.

 

[Jarhyn]

What is the world coming to if we can't get our five minutes hate on, right?

I guess some people, despite their claims that they seek egalitarianism, wish not to be egalitarian as regards to accepting that neither gender nor sex is germane to whether someone holds the will to be shitty to others.

It's treated as if it is so important to be able to tear someone down further than they have already torn themselves.

You don't have to find a way to get a kick in on "the criminal", and everyone who sees you do it anyway only lowers their opinion of YOU, not "the criminal".

Plenty of women have killed two women, perhaps in disrespectful hate of all (other) women.

This one has a lot of testosterone affect and killed some folks, so I would think it be prudent to house her with folks who have a lot of testosterone in their history and possibly only those so violent in their dispositions of the moment as to kill folks, regardless of what fuzzy labels folks attach to each other or themselves.

 

[thebeave]

How does a persons gender choice "pick your pocket or break you bones"

TJ

That's really not a simple question.

Under the large majority of circumstances someone else's sex or gender are extremely unimportant. And most of the time people will range from minimally polite to supportive. But this isn't always true.
Sometimes, a person's sex matters more than their gender. Examples would be competitive sports divisions and public spaces where women feel vulnerable (such as public restrooms and changing facilities). Pushing boundaries in those circumstances really does harm women.

And notice I specified "women". For reasons that are both psychological and physical, men (as a group) just aren't as vulnerable to women. I'm a dude, over 6 foot and 200 pounds. There are still women who could kick my ass. But if one joined me in the shower at the city pool I'd be more amused than threatened. I've just never worried about that. My sisters are different. I'm confident that the large majority of women are similarly different. Any male is a big problem, and a penis is the usual way of distinguishing a male.
Tom

Saw this in my news feed today.

Swimmer Lia Thomas becomes first transgender athlete to win an NCAA D-I title

Must especially suck to be the second place winner here, though the third place winner doesn't seem to phased. TomC's great comment had me thinking about the locker room arrangements for Lia's swim team. Is Lia in the same locker room (group shower?) as the other female swimmers?

 

[Metaphor]

How does a persons gender choice "pick your pocket or break you bones"

TJ

That's really not a simple question.

Under the large majority of circumstances someone else's sex or gender are extremely unimportant. And most of the time people will range from minimally polite to supportive. But this isn't always true.
Sometimes, a person's sex matters more than their gender. Examples would be competitive sports divisions and public spaces where women feel vulnerable (such as public restrooms and changing facilities). Pushing boundaries in those circumstances really does harm women.

And notice I specified "women". For reasons that are both psychological and physical, men (as a group) just aren't as vulnerable to women. I'm a dude, over 6 foot and 200 pounds. There are still women who could kick my ass. But if one joined me in the shower at the city pool I'd be more amused than threatened. I've just never worried about that. My sisters are different. I'm confident that the large majority of women are similarly different. Any male is a big problem, and a penis is the usual way of distinguishing a male.
Tom

Saw this in my news feed today.

Swimmer Lia Thomas becomes first transgender athlete to win an NCAA D-I title

Must especially suck to be the second place winner here, though the third place winner doesn't seem to phased. TomC's great comment had me thinking about the locker room arrangements for Lia's swim team. Is Lia in the same locker room (group shower?) as the other female swimmers?

Yes, he is.

 

[TomC]

The fact is, Harvey Marcelin is a man, a serial killer it seems who has recently declared himself a woman. He was convicted as a man for previous murders of actual women. But here we are, a once respected news source going along with the charade, only once mentioning that we are in fact dealing with a male serial killer. No pockets picked, no bones broken I suppose but the BBC cannot be trusted.

So BBC can't be trusted to follow your preferred pronoun protocols. Who cares?

Unless there's something about this I don't know, your post looks very gratuitous. Maybe the murderer's gender matters in some way. Maybe they used their trans to gain access to vulnerable women. Then it would matter. Otherwise, it doesn't.
Tom

 

[TomC]

Yes, he is.

If the team is OK with that then it's none of your damn business. It's entirely their affair.

Although I'd be careful if I were Lia. An awful lot of strong and competitive women would benefit if she had "an accident".
Tom

 

[thebeave]

Yes, he is.

If the team is OK with that then it's none of your damn business. It's entirely their affair.

Although I'd be careful if I were Lia. An awful lot of strong and competitive women would benefit if she had "an accident".
Tom

Heh. Where's Tonya Harding when you need her.

I think there's a lot of pressure on the team to not say anything "transphobic" about the situation with Lia for threat of disciplanary action, so I do wonder if some women who ARE bothered by Lia's presence in the locker room are keeping quiet out of fear of reprisal.

 

[Trausti]

How does a persons gender choice "pick your pocket or break you bones"

TJ

That's really not a simple question.

Under the large majority of circumstances someone else's sex or gender are extremely unimportant. And most of the time people will range from minimally polite to supportive. But this isn't always true.
Sometimes, a person's sex matters more than their gender. Examples would be competitive sports divisions and public spaces where women feel vulnerable (such as public restrooms and changing facilities). Pushing boundaries in those circumstances really does harm women.

And notice I specified "women". For reasons that are both psychological and physical, men (as a group) just aren't as vulnerable to women. I'm a dude, over 6 foot and 200 pounds. There are still women who could kick my ass. But if one joined me in the shower at the city pool I'd be more amused than threatened. I've just never worried about that. My sisters are different. I'm confident that the large majority of women are similarly different. Any male is a big problem, and a penis is the usual way of distinguishing a male.
Tom

Saw this in my news feed today.

Swimmer Lia Thomas becomes first transgender athlete to win an NCAA D-I title

Must especially suck to be the second place winner here, though the third place winner doesn't seem to phased. TomC's great comment had me thinking about the locker room arrangements for Lia's swim team. Is Lia in the same locker room (group shower?) as the other female swimmers?

 

[Emily Lake]

So picking evil bastards as an example is kind of lame.

Even nice and kind people born male are still male forever despite any interventions or transition.

The point here is that this man is obviously gaming the system.

He is a serial killer whose prey are women - female women. But now... because of the impact of this ideology that says a declaration made out loud must be accepted as incontrovertible proof... this man gets access to easier jail time (women's prisons are lower security with higher degrees of freedom because women are, quite simply, less aggressive and violent). He also gets access to his preferred victim pool in a confined location where they can't get away from him.

And the media, buying in to the dogmatic demand that pronouns are sacrosanct... LIES to the public and makes this seem as if a female did all of this murdering, when in fact, it was done by yet another male of the human species.

Oh, and to top it off... there's a high likelihood that this guy's crimes get recorded in official records as if they had been committed by a woman, which obscures the fact that men commit far more violent crimes than women, and that women are far more likely to be the victims of this sort of crime than men.

 

[Jarhyn]

I'll note that it seems that no matter how we seek to make systems egalitarian rather than prejudiced on the basis of mere labels (so, to make the system ignorant of and agnostic to such "sloppiness", and so immune to any attempt to hide "inside the slop"), there are two groups that cling very tightly to those labels: those who wish to game the sloppiness of the current system (like Lia, apparently), and those who wish to maintain the sloppiness of the system because it allows them to invent problems and then place responsibility for the problems THEY invent on an out-group.

Of course, both of these situations are resolved by replacing "the sloppiness" with something a little more well-defined, such as hormone exposures, or in the case of prison, also what conduct got them there in the first place.

For all the blatherskite about various folks being "gender cultists", it is apparent that using this methodology we don't even have to consider gender nor genitals. Instead we get to consider actually prescient biological facts. I endorse a completely post-gender approach to the issues.

The fact is that there are some games people play that the government has zero right or responsibility to weigh in on. Who qualifies to be a "man" or a "woman" is such a game the government shouldn't involve itself in.

It means you can toss Lia in with the team mostly (entirely?) otherwise populated with boys, without calling her something she isn't. She then has no pathway available by any kind of rules-lawyering towards anything else.

Of course there are almost certainly serial killers whose prey is "women" who I am sure Emily would acknowledge as "women" yet she has no apparent problem throwing those people in with their victims. I don't see her arguing, for instance, against housing XXY folks in the female estate.

The same happens among people who are entirely acknowledged by her as "men": people are thrown into a bin full of their preferred victims.

Then she goes into apologetics for prejudicial discrimination.

I don't think she would be very happy if some guy started talking about how "women tend to be less/more °°° so we shouldn't let them •••", so I don't know have a pretty good guess why she is in here saying "men tend to be less/more °°° so we shouldn't let them •••".

It is sexism plain and simple.

 

[Emily Lake]

What is the world coming to if we can't get our five minutes hate on, right?

I guess some people, despite their claims that they seek egalitarianism, wish not to be egalitarian as regards to accepting that neither gender nor sex is germane to whether someone holds the will to be shitty to others.

It's treated as if it is so important to be able to tear someone down further than they have already torn themselves.

You don't have to find a way to get a kick in on "the criminal", and everyone who sees you do it anyway only lowers their opinion of YOU, not "the criminal".

Plenty of women have killed two women, perhaps in disrespectful hate of all (other) women.

This one has a lot of testosterone affect and killed some folks, so I would think it be prudent to house her with folks who have a lot of testosterone in their history and possibly only those so violent in their dispositions of the moment as to kill folks, regardless of what fuzzy labels folks attach to each other or themselves.

Does it bother you even a teensy tiny bit that you have more care and compassion for the gender affirmation of the serial killer's feelings... than you do for his past and potential victims? You express not a whit of care that this is a guy who ruthlessly and brutally murders women as prey, because they are women. But boy oh boy you sure do care a LOT that this asshole gets the "correct" pronouns, and is given the privilege of serving ail time in a women's prison with his victim pool easily at hand.

 

[Emily Lake]

Saw this in my news feed today.

Swimmer Lia Thomas becomes first transgender athlete to win an NCAA D-I title

Must especially suck to be the second place winner here, though the third place winner doesn't seem to phased. TomC's great comment had me thinking about the locker room arrangements for Lia's swim team. Is Lia in the same locker room (group shower?) as the other female swimmers?

The "second place" swimmer, in my opinion, is the winner of this women's race.

And yes, Thomas IS using the women's locker room, something that their teammates have actually complained about, and do not like, because Thomas frequently walks around naked with their penis in full view of a bunch of women who don't want to see their penis.

 

[Emily Lake]

With all the truly awful things going on in the world, it is fascinating that gender bigots have to vent their spleen with misleading claims about what people allegedly "can't" (as opposed to the factually accurate "won't) say.

Ah yes, we are at the 'gender cultist appeals to the world having bigger problems' whataboutism stage of the debate.

You know, I kind of see the astonishingly high levels of violence against females across the globe as a "world has a bigger problem", and I'm not inclined to dismiss this incident.

 

[Jarhyn]

What is the world coming to if we can't get our five minutes hate on, right?

I guess some people, despite their claims that they seek egalitarianism, wish not to be egalitarian as regards to accepting that neither gender nor sex is germane to whether someone holds the will to be shitty to others.

It's treated as if it is so important to be able to tear someone down further than they have already torn themselves.

You don't have to find a way to get a kick in on "the criminal", and everyone who sees you do it anyway only lowers their opinion of YOU, not "the criminal".

Plenty of women have killed two women, perhaps in disrespectful hate of all (other) women.

This one has a lot of testosterone affect and killed some folks, so I would think it be prudent to house her with folks who have a lot of testosterone in their history and possibly only those so violent in their dispositions of the moment as to kill folks, regardless of what fuzzy labels folks attach to each other or themselves.

Does it bother you even a teensy tiny bit that you have more care and compassion for the gender affirmation of the serial killer's feelings... than you do for his past and potential victims? You express not a whit of care that this is a guy who ruthlessly and brutally murders women as prey, because they are women. But boy oh boy you sure do care a LOT that this asshole gets the "correct" pronouns, and is given the privilege of serving ail time in a women's prison with his victim pool easily at hand.

Nothing I said implies I don't care about her victims. Then, you are the ones using her victims as a fucking prop, for the sake of excusing your abuses of her. She still has dignity as a human being, even if she's been a really shitty human being.

You express not a whit of care that there are hundreds or even thousands of others who ruthlessly and brutally murder folks as prey because of what they are outside of this case.

But you sure do care that THIS one is. Personally...

I would think it be prudent to house her with folks who have a lot of testosterone in their history and possibly only those so violent in their dispositions of the moment as to kill folks, regardless of what fuzzy labels folks attach to each other or themselves.

 

[Emily Lake]

those who wish to maintain the sloppiness of the system because it allows them to invent problems and then place responsibility for the problems THEY invent on an out-group.

Sure sure, because females have totally just "invented" the massively skewed statistics on sexual and domestic crimes where males are OVERWHELMINGLY the perpetrators and Females are OVERWHELMINGLY the victims. We just invented rape and sexual assault statistics out of thin air to take advantage of the "sloppiness" of extremely well documented male patterns of violence and the "sloppiness" of the 99.98% phenotypically accurate classification of human sex.

 

[Jarhyn]

those who wish to maintain the sloppiness of the system because it allows them to invent problems and then place responsibility for the problems THEY invent on an out-group.

Sure sure, because females have totally just "invented" the massively skewed statistics on sexual and domestic crimes where males are OVERWHELMINGLY the perpetrators and Females are OVERWHELMINGLY the victims. We just invented rape and sexual assault statistics out of thin air to take advantage of the "sloppiness" of extremely well documented male patterns of violence and the "sloppiness" of the 99.98% phenotypically accurate classification of human sex.

Yet we still live in a country where discrimination on the basis of "sex" is illegal and every human has every right to be judged purely on the basis of who they are and how they themselves act.

Your statistics still don't justify your sexism.

 

[Emily Lake]

It means you can toss Lia in with the team mostly (entirely?) otherwise populated with boys, without calling her something she isn't. She then has no pathway available by any kind of rules-lawyering towards anything else.

How do you know what Thomas is or is not? I'm evaluating based on actual real objectively verifiable facts. What are you basing it on?

So far as I can tell, you're basing it entirely on what Thomas claims about themself. Thomas says they are a woman, and you accept it without a moment of critical thinking whatsoever. They are what they say they are, and no questions can be asked.

Yet you simultaneously feel justified in declaring what OTHER PEOPLE ARE (me, Met, etc.) based on YOUR beliefs... and doing so IN CONTRADICTION of what we say of ourselves.

Why is it that you accept without question some people's declarations of what they are, and expect that everyone else must also accept their declarations... but you deny what other people declare about themselves? Why the double standard? What do you think justifies you to determine which are unquestionably correct and accurate enough to contradict objective reality, and others can be discarded without any consideration at all based on how you feel about it?

 

[Emily Lake]

Of course there are almost certainly serial killers whose prey is "women" who I am sure Emily would acknowledge as "women" yet she has no apparent problem throwing those people in with their victims. I don't see her arguing, for instance, against housing XXY folks in the female estate.

The same happens among people who are entirely acknowledged by her as "men": people are thrown into a bin full of their preferred victims.

Then she goes into apologetics for prejudicial discrimination.

I don't think she would be very happy if some guy started talking about how "women tend to be less/more °°° so we shouldn't let them •••", so I don't know have a pretty good guess why she is in here saying "men tend to be less/more °°° so we shouldn't let them •••".

It is sexism plain and simple.

Dude, seriously. Take this shit up with your fellow men, as they're the ones doing a MASSIVELY disproportionate amount of the sex crimes and the domestic abuse. Take it up with fucking biology, which has evolved males to be more aggressive and violent than women.

[removed]