Was Shia LeBeouf raped?

[Bomb#20]

The actor Shia LaBeouf has claimed a woman raped him during the performance of his one-man art piece #IAMSORRY earlier this year.

And there was me hoping he'd got prison

(..sorry)

Don't give up hope.

"Affirmative consent" means affirmative, conscious, and voluntary agreement to engage in sexual activity. It is the responsibility of each person involved in the sexual activity to ensure that he or she has the affirmative consent of the other or others to engage in the sexual activity. Lack of protest or resistance does not mean consent, nor does silence mean consent. Affirmative consent must be ongoing throughout a sexual activity and can be revoked at any time.​

(Source)

I don't see anywhere in LaBeouf's version of events where he says the woman ever said "Yes". Sounds like he raped her.

 

[Jolly_Penguin]

If what he says is true, then yes that is rape. I hope he has more than just an empty claim though if he made the accusation.

 

[Axulus]

It's rape, but not all cases of rape are necessarily all equal in the amount of damage they cause the victim. I would peg this one on the lower end of the damage scale, which doesn't mean I think that the woman involved shouldn't be criminally prosecuted.

 

[Axulus]

And there was me hoping he'd got prison

(..sorry)

Don't give up hope.

"Affirmative consent" means affirmative, conscious, and voluntary agreement to engage in sexual activity. It is the responsibility of each person involved in the sexual activity to ensure that he or she has the affirmative consent of the other or others to engage in the sexual activity. Lack of protest or resistance does not mean consent, nor does silence mean consent. Affirmative consent must be ongoing throughout a sexual activity and can be revoked at any time.​

(Source)

I don't see anywhere in LaBeouf's version of events where he says the woman ever said "Yes". Sounds like he raped her.

The key word is "engage". She engaged in it, he didn't (according to his version).

 

[dx713]

And there was me hoping he'd got prison

(..sorry)

Don't give up hope.

"Affirmative consent" means affirmative, conscious, and voluntary agreement to engage in sexual activity. It is the responsibility of each person involved in the sexual activity to ensure that he or she has the affirmative consent of the other or others to engage in the sexual activity. Lack of protest or resistance does not mean consent, nor does silence mean consent. Affirmative consent must be ongoing throughout a sexual activity and can be revoked at any time.​

(Source)

I don't see anywhere in LaBeouf's version of events where he says the woman ever said "Yes". Sounds like he raped her.

The thread explaining affirmative consent is not necessarily verbal wasn't long enough for you?

 

[Sabine Grant]

To the question "why did he not leave" or another being why did he not react by either a physical or verbal expression of non consent? IMO, there is no way he could have anticipated that his art exhibit/social experiment bit would result in a stranger female giving a him BJ. Meaning he was in a state of shock, having no previous anticipation and resulting process of setting up a plan in case such situation were to occur. He was not a deprived male from sexual intimacy at all. Has a steady girl friend and I am certain that like any other popular and attractive Hollywood actor, he has his "groupies" where he could find ample opportunities to get BJs at will!

The thought did not cross his mind that some deranged stranger female would assume it is fine and dandy to push that art exhibit/social experiment bit to the point of initiating a sexual act on him. I really think he simply was in a state of shock, not being able to rationally process what was happening and thus react with any expression of non consent.

I will also confirm 100% that lack of an expression of non consent is to be never equated for meaning consent.

Does what happened qualify as an unwanted and non mutually consenting sexual act on his person? Absolutely.

 

[ksen]

He has a steady girlfriend?

Oh, that explains his cry of rape then.

"But baby, she raped me!"

 

[Rhea]

Yes, he was raped, but seeing how he was not restrained by the woman, threatened or otherwise intimidated by the woman, it makes me wonder why he didn't just leave.

Yes, I wonder, too. And it doesn't change the fact that it was rape.
Very very weird, and very clearly non-consenting.

 

[ksen]

He wasn't under the influence of anything other than his own hubris.

Do you think his girlfriend will buy his excuse for letting another girl blow him?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The whole point of the exhibit was for him to be utterly passive and unresponsive in front of people who, for whatever reason, wanted to see him that way. He presented them with the opportunity to do whatever they wanted to a faceless "other", and they did. Apparently, what one woman wanted to do was rape him.

At some point, you have to stop the performance art nonsense when someone is perpetuating a crime on yourself. Only a moron would let things proceed into the illegal side of things.

Artists are known to 'suffer' for their work, but that usually doesn't mean allowing yourself to be victimized by criminals.

Agreed. There was no incapacity. There was no indication that her actions were unacceptable. There was no fear that would keep him from resisting. I don't think a jury would convict her.

 

[PyramidHead]

At some point, you have to stop the performance art nonsense when someone is perpetuating a crime on yourself. Only a moron would let things proceed into the illegal side of things.

Artists are known to 'suffer' for their work, but that usually doesn't mean allowing yourself to be victimized by criminals.

Agreed. There was no incapacity. There was no indication that her actions were unacceptable. There was no fear that would keep him from resisting. I don't think a jury would convict her.

I think pulling somebody's pants down and having sex with them in a gallery without their consent doesn't need to be explicitly spelled out as 'unacceptable.' The burden of proof goes the other way.

 

[ksen]

How do you know this wasn't actually part of the art show?

 

[PyramidHead]

The one legal recourse the woman may have, and it's a stretch, is to capitalize on what Arctish said about the exhibit being about allowing people to do whatever they please to a "nameless other."

 

[dx713]

The one legal recourse the woman may have, and it's a stretch, is to capitalize on what Arctish said about the exhibit being about allowing people to do whatever they please to a "nameless other."

Could work, with a "he didn't object so I thought I was still within the exhibit limits". Or not, illegal is still illegal after all.
I'd be interested to see how a judge sees that.

 

[Bomb#20]

The key word is "engage". She engaged in it, he didn't (according to his version).

The thread explaining affirmative consent is not necessarily verbal wasn't long enough for you?

Why do you guys think any of that matters? I don't see anywhere in LaBeouf's version of events where he says the woman in any way expressed affirmative consent that was ongoing throughout the sexual activity. The law is quite specific that consent can be revoked at any time. She may have changed her mind and revoked consent after he was inside her; her silence and lack of protest or resistance does not mean she continued to consent any more than LaBeouf's silence and lack of protest or resistance means he consented; I don't see anywhere in LaBeouf's version of events where he says he made any attempt to make sure he still had her consent after she took him into her; and the law is quite specific that ensuring that he had her affirmative consent was his responsibility.

 

[Arctish]

At some point, you have to stop the performance art nonsense when someone is perpetuating a crime on yourself. Only a moron would let things proceed into the illegal side of things.

Artists are known to 'suffer' for their work, but that usually doesn't mean allowing yourself to be victimized by criminals.

Agreed. There was no incapacity. There was no indication that her actions were unacceptable. There was no fear that would keep him from resisting. I don't think a jury would convict her.

They should.

"He didn't say no" is not a valid excuse for sexual contact with a person who can't, won't, or hasn't indicated their consent.

 

[Toni]

The thread explaining affirmative consent is not necessarily verbal wasn't long enough for you?

Why do you guys think any of that matters? I don't see anywhere in LaBeouf's version of events where he says the woman in any way expressed affirmative consent that was ongoing throughout the sexual activity. The law is quite specific that consent can be revoked at any time. She may have changed her mind and revoked consent after he was inside her; her silence and lack of protest or resistance does not mean she continued to consent any more than LaBeouf's silence and lack of protest or resistance means he consented; I don't see anywhere in LaBeouf's version of events where he says he made any attempt to make sure he still had her consent after she took him into her; and the law is quite specific that ensuring that he had her affirmative consent was his responsibility.

Whoa whoa whoa: to the best of my knowledge, no state has passed legislation which mandates affirmative consent with the exception of California and such legislation is narrowly focused on state funded schools. Even that law does not make sex acts without affirmative consent to be criminal.

Legally, this is a gray area: we don't know what acts were performed or attempted. We do not know whether legally, consent could have been reasonably construed. He did not inject to being beaten for 10 minutes; he did not object to having his clothing removed. Is it reasonable for her to have assumed that he consented? There were no restrictions on his ability to object to any actions except those which were self imposed and he seems not to have been under the influence of any alcohol or drug whichight have clouded his judgement. I have my doubts about his mental health but no claims as to diminished capacity have been made that I am aware of.

If he had actually been unable to respond, it would be much more clear that it was rape. But there was no incapacity, no force, no intimidation. He is a competent adult who was or drunk, or drugged or coerced.

I am not saying he was not raped but that it isn't a clear cut case of rape.

 

[Arctish]

The thread explaining affirmative consent is not necessarily verbal wasn't long enough for you?

Why do you guys think any of that matters? I don't see anywhere in LaBeouf's version of events where he says the woman in any way expressed affirmative consent that was ongoing throughout the sexual activity. The law is quite specific that consent can be revoked at any time. She may have changed her mind and revoked consent after he was inside her; her silence and lack of protest or resistance does not mean she continued to consent any more than LaBeouf's silence and lack of protest or resistance means he consented; I don't see anywhere in LaBeouf's version of events where he says he made any attempt to make sure he still had her consent after she took him into her; and the law is quite specific that ensuring that he had her affirmative consent was his responsibility.

So you're saying a person who initiates and sustains a sexual activity entirely through their own efforts and an utterly passive, unresponsive recipient are equally liable if the sex act was non consensual on the part of either one? A person is a rapist if s/he fails to ask his/her assailant if they want to have sex?

 

[laughing dog]

At some point, you have to stop the performance art nonsense when someone is perpetuating a crime on yourself. Only a moron would let things proceed into the illegal side of things.

Artists are known to 'suffer' for their work, but that usually doesn't mean allowing yourself to be victimized by criminals.

Agreed. There was no incapacity. There was no indication that her actions were unacceptable. There was no fear that would keep him from resisting. I don't think a jury would convict her.

The failure to resist as implicit consent has been rejected prior to the 21st century.

 

[Toni]

Agreed. There was no incapacity. There was no indication that her actions were unacceptable. There was no fear that would keep him from resisting. I don't think a jury would convict her.

The failure to resist as implicit consent has been rejected prior to the 21st century.

Unfortunately, I think that you are incorrect with respect to the law. To the best of my knowledge, affirmative consent is not part of criminal law in any state in the USA. If I am incorrect, I am happy to read links correcting my misinformation.