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Whites abuse drugs just as often as blacks? Nope.

ApostateAbe

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Infotheist. I believe the gods to be mere information.
"Whites abuse drugs just as often as blacks, but blacks are much more likely to be arrested for it," so the claim goes. If the statistic is correct, it is a smoking-gun indictment of the racism of the American criminal justice system: it unfairly targets blacks.

The orgainization most responsible for the claim is the Brookings Institution, a large left-leaning think tank. Then, among many other media, the claim was picked up by:

The NAACP variation of the claim deserves special rebuke:

"5 times as many Whites are using drugs as African Americans, yet African Americans are sent to prison for drug offenses at 10 times the rate of Whites."

Instead of claiming that the rate of drug abuse is equal among the races, as is typically claimed, the NAACP takes the spin much further by failing to account for population share for the claim about racial differences in drug abuse but being perfectly responsible about the "rate" in the very next claim about racial differences in imprisonment, as though the author was consciously trying to mislead the reader about the racial differences.

But, even if they did claim that the rate of drug abuse was equal among the races, they would be wrong, due to a fallacy common to all of these publications: assuming that each race tells the truth about drug abuse equally.

The source data used to infer equality of drug abuse is the 2012 National Survey on Drug Use and Health of the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration of the USDHS. Their data is collected "through face-to-face interviews with a representative sample of the population at the respondent's place of residence". No drug tests. They just ask, i.e. "Did you do crack cocaine in the past month? No? OK, moving on."

Problem: races do not tell the truth about drug abuse at an equal rate. This is no mere speculation. This is established fact well known among researchers. They know it, because in some studies the researchers first ask the subjects which drugs they have used in the past month, and then they administer a drug test. The results: most subjects of any race are truth tellers, but blacks are many times more likely than whites to lie to researchers about their past drug abuse. The 2005 study by Michael Fendrich and Timothy P Johnson, "Race/Ethnicity Differences in the Validity of Self-Reported Drug Use: Results from a Household Survey," showed that the concordances between the interview and the drug test for cocaine was 90% for blacks and 99% for whites, and for marijuana it was 87% for blacks and 100% for whites.

The 2008 study by Ledgerwood et al, "Comparison between self-report and hair analysis of illicit drug use in a community sample of middle-age men," tells the same story. So does Miyong and Hill's "Validity of self-report of illicit drug use in young hypertensive urban African American males," 2003. So does Fendrich and Xu's "The validity of drug use reports from juvenile arrestees," 1994. So does Golub et al's "The Variation in Arrestees' Disclosure of Recent Drug Use Across Locations, Drugs, and Demographic Characteristics," 2005.

It is an established scientific reality. Blacks are many times more likely than whites to lie to researchers about their past drug abuse.

Maybe blacks have a good excuse to lie to researchers, and they don't trust the researchers because they see the researchers as part of the white establishment who oppresses them, or something like that. But, there is no good excuse for uncritically passing along a very bad interpretation of the statistics. It should not be claimed that the rate of drug abuse is equal between whites and blacks. The most you can say is that the SELF-REPORTS of drug abuse are equal between whites and blacks. More reliable data about the racial differences in drug abuse does not come from arrest statistics nor does it come from self-reports. It comes from racial differences in hospital emergency room visits. See Table 35 on page 115 of the report of the National Institute of Drug Abuse, "Drug Abuse Among Racial/Ethnic Minorities," 2003, a table of drug related emergency room visits. It shows that blacks are 21% of all drug-related emergency room visits as of 2000, in spite of being 12% of the population. In 2011, it was worse: blacks are reportedly 31% of drug-related ER visits, in spite of being 13% of the population, according to Table 6 on page 30 of Drug Abuse Warning Network, 2011: "National Estimates of Drug-Related Emergency Department Visits," of the USDHS.

So, why should we care? We do not have to conclude from the drug abuse statistics that blacks are inherently more criminal nor inherently more susceptible to addiction. But, we should not be drawn into the myths for the sake of the ideological belief that the main problem is an unfair justice system. One way or the other, regardless of the cause, blacks really do abuse drugs much more often than whites. They are more likely to be arrested for it, and they are more likely to die from it. So, if you want to solve the problem, then solve it where it really exists.
 
Well, that's easy...everyone knows White's "experiment with drugs" while Black's "abuse drugs".

You should fix your sunglasses Abe. Those Confederate Flag decals you put on them are fucking up your ability to see clearly.
 
Race/Ethnicity

Among persons aged 12 or older, whites and persons reporting two or more races in 2012 were more likely than other racial/ethnic groups to report current use of alcohol (57.4 and 51.9 percent, respectively). The rates were 43.2 percent for blacks, 41.8 percent for Hispanics, 41.7 percent for American Indians or Alaska Natives, and 36.9 percent for Asians
- From your link....


Why the fuck are all these White Mother Fuckers a bunch of whino, no good alcoholic's?

Abe are you concerned with the alarming rate of alcohol abuse among White people? The difference between Whites and Blacks abusing alcohol is significantly wider than that of drug abuse. Are you campaigning relentlessly to help your people? They appear to have a serious fucking problem.

Also...over 70% of the "drug abuse" you're reporting is for Marijuana. Can you please explain how in the fuck one would "abuse" Marijuana? The chances of a crime or domestic violence is significantly increased when Alcohol is abused vs someone smoking a half an ounce of weed and abusing their carpet with Dorito crumbs.

Have you drank alcohol in the last 30 days? You may be part of the serious problem with alcohol among Whites and therefore probably way too close to this Forest for the Trees.
 
Race/Ethnicity

Among persons aged 12 or older, whites and persons reporting two or more races in 2012 were more likely than other racial/ethnic groups to report current use of alcohol (57.4 and 51.9 percent, respectively). The rates were 43.2 percent for blacks, 41.8 percent for Hispanics, 41.7 percent for American Indians or Alaska Natives, and 36.9 percent for Asians
- From your link....


Why the fuck are all these White Mother Fuckers a bunch of whino, no good alcoholic's?

Abe are you concerned with the alarming rate of alcohol abuse among White people? The difference between Whites and Blacks abusing alcohol is significantly wider than that of drug abuse. Are you campaigning relentlessly to help your people? They appear to have a serious fucking problem.

Also...over 70% of the "drug abuse" you're reporting is for Marijuana. Can you please explain how in the fuck one would "abuse" Marijuana? The chances of a crime or domestic violence is significantly increased when Alcohol is abused vs someone smoking a half an ounce of weed and abusing their carpet with Dorito crumbs.

Have you drank alcohol in the last 30 days? You may be part of the serious problem with alcohol among Whites and therefore probably way too close to this Forest for the Trees.
Maybe you think I am trying to make the white race look good and the black race look bad? No, not really. The white race has plenty of their own problems, but it is not about which race is better or worse than another. Instead, I am trying to correct a common abuse of statistics, and I am failing among those who miss the point.
 
"Unfair justice system" is just a sliver of the real cause of addiction - psychological isolation. So yes, any population of socially marginalized individuals is likely going to show a higher rate of addiction.

You always have the choice of focusing more on understanding addiction and further cultivating your own sense of compassion toward all human beings than you do on this obscene hobby horse of justifying racism.
 
Maybe you think I am trying to make the white race look good and the black race look bad? No, not really. The white race has plenty of their own problems, but it is not about which race is better or worse than another. Instead, I am trying to correct a common abuse of statistics, and I am failing among those who miss the point.


"I'm really not a racist you guys! I'm not saying white people are better than black people or anything! I'm just... you know... starting a gazillion threads about how black people suck at everything. For science!" :rolleyes:
 
Maybe you think I am trying to make the white race look good and the black race look bad? No, not really. The white race has plenty of their own problems, but it is not about which race is better or worse than another. Instead, I am trying to correct a common abuse of statistics, and I am failing among those who miss the point.


"I'm really not a racist you guys! I'm not saying white people are better than black people or anything! I'm just... you know... starting a gazillion threads about how black people suck at everything. For science!" :rolleyes:
No, I am a racist. I accept that slur. I have the choice between accepting the ideological slur and accepting delusion/silence. We have each made our respective choices.
 
"Unfair justice system" is just a sliver of the real cause of addiction - psychological isolation. So yes, any population of socially marginalized individuals is likely going to show a higher rate of addiction.

You always have the choice of focusing more on understanding addiction and further cultivating your own sense of compassion toward all human beings than you do on this obscene hobby horse of justifying racism.
Yes. As "focusing more on understanding addiction and further cultivating your own sense of compassion toward all human beings" is not a social taboo, very many other people already walk down that path. My choice is to correct the ideological delusions. The ideological delusions influence not just this problem of the abuse of statistics that causes an inaccurate perception of the justice system and blindness to racial differences in drug abuse but also a large network of many other problems. It is the same reason I generally oppose religion.
 
"Unfair justice system" is just a sliver of the real cause of addiction - psychological isolation. So yes, any population of socially marginalized individuals is likely going to show a higher rate of addiction.

You always have the choice of focusing more on understanding addiction and further cultivating your own sense of compassion toward all human beings than you do on this obscene hobby horse of justifying racism.
Yes. As "focusing more on understanding addiction and further cultivating your own sense of compassion toward all human beings" is not a social taboo, very many other people already walk down that path. My choice is to correct the ideological delusions. The ideological delusions influence not just this problem of the abuse of statistics that causes an inaccurate perception of the justice system and blindness to racial differences in drug abuse but also a large network of many other problems. It is the same reason I generally oppose religion.

But the justice system IS part of that problem, it IS unfair... it's just not the whole problem. And blackness is not inherently more susceptible to addiction EXCEPT within a social system (to include the unfair justice system) that marginalizes blackness.
 
Yes. As "focusing more on understanding addiction and further cultivating your own sense of compassion toward all human beings" is not a social taboo, very many other people already walk down that path. My choice is to correct the ideological delusions. The ideological delusions influence not just this problem of the abuse of statistics that causes an inaccurate perception of the justice system and blindness to racial differences in drug abuse but also a large network of many other problems. It is the same reason I generally oppose religion.

But the justice system IS part of that problem, it IS unfair... it's just not the whole problem. And blackness is not inherently more susceptible to addiction EXCEPT within a social system (to include the unfair justice system) that marginalizes blackness.
If the justice system is unfair and part of the problem (maybe it is), then good arguments need to be used to argue for that end, not bad arguments, not abuses of statistics.
 
But the justice system IS part of that problem, it IS unfair... it's just not the whole problem. And blackness is not inherently more susceptible to addiction EXCEPT within a social system (to include the unfair justice system) that marginalizes blackness.
If the justice system is unfair and part of the problem (maybe it is), then good arguments need to be used to argue for that end, not bad arguments, not abuses of statistics.

Wait, you're saying there's no racial disparity in the justice system? In arrests, incarcerations, and/or sentencing?
 
If the justice system is unfair and part of the problem (maybe it is), then good arguments need to be used to argue for that end, not bad arguments, not abuses of statistics.

Wait, you're saying there's no racial disparity in the justice system? In arrests, incarcerations, and/or sentencing?
No.
 
Wait, you're saying there's no racial disparity in the justice system? In arrests, incarcerations, and/or sentencing?
No.

Ok, then, are you suggesting/implying that maybe there's no racial disparity in the justice system or that any disparity in the justice system is minimal and/or irrelevant to drug addiction being the result of blackness and not social isolation?

Otherwise, there is no point in even bringing it up unless you are willing to put forth the good arguments you call for. As it stands, it appears that you want to make claims about drug addiction being an inherent tendency of blackness and hold that as true until someone else argues against it.
 

Ok, then, are you suggesting/implying that maybe there's no racial disparity in the justice system or that any disparity in the justice system is minimal and/or irrelevant to drug addiction being the result of blackness and not social isolation?

Otherwise, there is no point in even bringing it up unless you are willing to put forth the good arguments you call for. As it stands, it appears that you want to make claims about drug addiction being an inherent tendency of blackness and hold that as true until someone else argues against it.
I am open to arguments that there are racial injustices in the American justice system. There could very well be. If one race has a higher crime rate than another, then I would kinda expect that the races with a higher crime rate would be unfairly treated by cops and courts, even out of proportion to the extra crime such races commit, as there would be an unconscious thought process among cops and courts of "black, therefore criminal." If we want to solve the problems, then I think that would be a better general perspective than the perspective with the false premise of "All races commit crimes equally, but the racist white cops arrest more blacks, so we need a revolution," or something like that.
 
Ok, then, are you suggesting/implying that maybe there's no racial disparity in the justice system or that any disparity in the justice system is minimal and/or irrelevant to drug addiction being the result of blackness and not social isolation?

Otherwise, there is no point in even bringing it up unless you are willing to put forth the good arguments you call for. As it stands, it appears that you want to make claims about drug addiction being an inherent tendency of blackness and hold that as true until someone else argues against it.
I am open to arguments that there are racial injustices in the American justice system. There could very well be. If one race has a higher crime rate than another, then I would kinda expect that the races with a higher crime rate would be unfairly treated by cops and courts, even out of proportion to the extra crime such races commit, as there would be an unconscious thought process among cops and courts of "black, therefore criminal." If we want to solve the problems, then I think that would be a better general perspective than the perspective with the false premise of "All races commit crimes equally, but the racist white cops arrest more blacks, so we need a revolution," or something like that.
Sentencing comparisons between blacks, whites, and latinos (or any other you want to add) would be a good measure of unfairness of the system. Even if it were true that blacks commit more crime and take more drugs by some inherent condition of blackness, then sentencing within a fair system would not show disparity between blacks, whites, and latinos for the same crimes and drugs.
 
I am open to arguments that there are racial injustices in the American justice system. There could very well be. If one race has a higher crime rate than another, then I would kinda expect that the races with a higher crime rate would be unfairly treated by cops and courts, even out of proportion to the extra crime such races commit, as there would be an unconscious thought process among cops and courts of "black, therefore criminal." If we want to solve the problems, then I think that would be a better general perspective than the perspective with the false premise of "All races commit crimes equally, but the racist white cops arrest more blacks, so we need a revolution," or something like that.
Sentencing comparisons between blacks, whites, and latinos (or any other you want to add) would be a good measure of unfairness of the system. Even if it were true that blacks commit more crime and take more drugs by some inherent condition of blackness, then sentencing within a fair system would not show disparity between blacks, whites, and latinos for the same crimes and drugs.
Yes, that seems reasonable, if I understand you correctly. If blacks commit crimes at a higher rate, then the sentencing would be higher, but it would be unfair and unjust if the sentencing rate is even higher than expected for the crime rate.
 
Sentencing comparisons between blacks, whites, and latinos (or any other you want to add) would be a good measure of unfairness of the system. Even if it were true that blacks commit more crime and take more drugs by some inherent condition of blackness, then sentencing within a fair system would not show disparity between blacks, whites, and latinos for the same crimes and drugs.
Yes, that seems reasonable, if I understand you correctly. If blacks commit crimes at a higher rate, then the sentencing would be higher, but it would be unfair and unjust if the sentencing rate is even higher than expected for the crime rate.

You need to be more clear about what you mean by "sentencing would be higher." If courts are unfairly sentencing blacks to tougher sentences than whites for the same crimes, then the percentage of blacks in the black population committing crimes compared to the percentage of whites in the white poputlation committing crimes is irrelevant.

In other words, if courts are unfairly sentencing blacks to tougher sentences than whites for the same crimes, then they are punishing blacks for being black and not for committing that particular crime.
 
Yes, that seems reasonable, if I understand you correctly. If blacks commit crimes at a higher rate, then the sentencing would be higher, but it would be unfair and unjust if the sentencing rate is even higher than expected for the crime rate.

You need to be more clear about what you mean by "sentencing would be higher." If courts are unfairly sentencing blacks to tougher sentences than whites for the same crimes, then the percentage of blacks in the black population committing crimes compared to the percentage of whites in the white poputlation committing crimes is irrelevant.

In other words, if courts are unfairly sentencing blacks to tougher sentences than whites for the same crimes, then they are punishing blacks for being black and not for committing that particular crime.
Yes, that seems reasonable, too.
 
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