fromderinside
Mazzie Daius
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2008
- Messages
- 15,945
- Basic Beliefs
- optimist
See the last part of my answer above.
It's fascinating that all woo claims begin by failing to make this simple, straightforward and obvious connection.Every single "evidence" that the video cites is with reference to physical brains made up of matter. The video does NOT make the claim that consciousness can exist independent of a material substrate. Go back and watch it again, and pay attention this time.
... the logical symmetry that drives it.
Why? Why why?
. . .Kurt Vonnegut said:Tiger got to hunt, bird got to fly;
Man got to sit and wonder 'why, why, why?'
Tiger got to sleep, bird got to land;
Man got to tell himself he understand.
It's fascinating that all woo claims begin by failing to make this simple, straightforward and obvious connection.Every single "evidence" that the video cites is with reference to physical brains made up of matter. The video does NOT make the claim that consciousness can exist independent of a material substrate. Go back and watch it again, and pay attention this time.
What is obvious, is failing to connect the correct "argument" above, to the right person(s).
(post #198)
What is obvious, is failing to connect the correct "argument" above, to the right person(s).
(post #198)
So, I understand that you are accepting that non-materialism - whatever that is in your understanding - always proceeds from materialism. And that the discussion about non-materialism is an academic/intellectual exercise comparable to a discussion of angels on pinheads. I'm cool with that, it's your basic mysticism.
What is obvious, is failing to connect the correct "argument" above, to the right person(s).
(post #198)
So, I understand that you are accepting that non-materialism - whatever that is in your understanding - always proceeds from materialism. And that the discussion about non-materialism is an academic/intellectual exercise comparable to a discussion of angels on pinheads. I'm cool with that, it's your basic mysticism.
Depends.... if you actually understand at all, the plain and simple context, differentiating Solid, Structural, Observable, Able-to-touch, Physical Matter from non-solid, non-physical, non-structural, invisible forces and energies. Hey if you need to catagorize with materialsim, then I don't mind and cool with that too - I'll notice those 'technical' tricks, should there be any going on (I've always thought Atheists would make good Lawyers ).
So it's quite simple really: Something from Something as opposed to atheistic belief, "something from nothing."
Or come up with false dilemmas to help justify their arbitrary solution to said dilemmas.... in regards to the universe or creator, which came first?
Physical things do physical stuff. No need to consider a creator.
Since physical things do physical stuff there is no need to specify a beginning since physical things do physical stuff.
We know there is physical stuff. The presence of physical stuff is sufficient for physical things to take place.
Some people may just like to curiously know, discuss or debate about the possibilty.
Based on their statement, a fart would qualify. Non-solid, non-physical, invisible, but deadly.Depends.... if you actually understand at all, the plain and simple context, differentiating Solid, Structural, Observable, Able-to-touch, Physical Matter from non-solid, non-physical, non-structural, invisible forces and energies. Hey if you need to catagorize with materialsim, then I don't mind and cool with that too - I'll notice those 'technical' tricks, should there be any going on (I've always thought Atheists would make good Lawyers ).
So it's quite simple really: Something from Something as opposed to atheistic belief, "something from nothing."
So you are saying there are things non physical? Like what?
...
OUR little universe could have been 'Created' by a super massive black hole 13.2 Billion years ago.. What we call today the 'Big Bang'. And there will be an infinite number of universes within universes.
The CMB, entropy etc fit in with our Current observable universe.
Sadly we will never be able to see 'outside' our universe to prove my theory but i will die believing in it.
...
OUR little universe could have been 'Created' by a super massive black hole 13.2 Billion years ago.. What we call today the 'Big Bang'. And there will be an infinite number of universes within universes.
The CMB, entropy etc fit in with our Current observable universe.
Sadly we will never be able to see 'outside' our universe to prove my theory but i will die believing in it.
This viewpoint, with an infinite series of universes fitted together like a Russian doll, is not too dissimilar to the Penrose idea that started the whole thread! The two main differences are:
(a) Penrose, an expert on black holes and general relativity, views "our universe" as created in an "entropy death" after super massive black holes have evaporated;
(b) Penrose believes it MAY be possible to "see" the prior universe via faint patterns in the CMB.
Depends.... if you actually understand at all, the plain and simple context, differentiating Solid, Structural, Observable, Able-to-touch, Physical Matter from non-solid, non-physical, non-structural, invisible forces and energies. Hey if you need to catagorize with materialsim, then I don't mind and cool with that too - I'll notice those 'technical' tricks, should there be any going on (I've always thought Atheists would make good Lawyers ).
So it's quite simple really: Something from Something as opposed to atheistic belief, "something from nothing."
So you are saying there are things non physical? Like what?
Depends.... if you actually understand at all, the plain and simple context, differentiating Solid, Structural, Observable, Able-to-touch, Physical Matter from non-solid, non-physical, non-structural, invisible forces and energies. Hey if you need to catagorize with materialsim, then I don't mind and cool with that too - I'll notice those 'technical' tricks, should there be any going on (I've always thought Atheists would make good Lawyers ).
So it's quite simple really: Something from Something as opposed to atheistic belief, "something from nothing."
So you are saying there are things non physical? Like what?
Bumpity bump bump...
Hoping Learner tells me what he means by non-physical. I can't see the water molecules floating around in front of me but I take them to be physical.
What say you, Learner?
Bumpity bump bump...
Hoping Learner tells me what he means by non-physical. I can't see the water molecules floating around in front of me but I take them to be physical.
What say you, Learner?
I mean shit, even neutrinos are physical, even DARK MATTER is physical, even though we don't know what it is, even though it's interactions are weak as shit.
How could we tell, from outside the event horizon?Yet the biggest black hole explosion ever recorded does not appear to have created a bubble universe:
''The biggest cosmic explosion on record has been detected – an event so powerful that it punched a dent the size of 15 Milky Ways in the surrounding space. The eruption is thought to have originated at a supermassive black hole in the Ophiuchus galaxy cluster, which is about 390m light years from Earth''
Perhaps a greater event is necessary, something to destabilize the singularity itself?