WI Supreme Court Election

[Tigers!]

No. Its pathetic that so many cannot be fagged voting.
Make voting compulsory.,

It is pathetic.

On the other hand, while I go to vote in every election in my town, I often leave many positions blank because the candidates have made zero effort to inform me of who they are and why I should vote for them. Not even a post card mass mailer. I don't vote for a person unless I have some idea who they are and what they want to accomplish.

I'd be in favor of compulsory voting if there was always a "none of the above" option and if "none of the above" wins, they have to do it again.

Yes an option like "none of the above" is often suggested in Australia. The pollies don't want it, neither do the electoral commissions, as it might win sometimes and that is embarrassing. Makes it hard to have a representative too though. The seat of X was won by Mr/Mrs/Ms/Miss Nobody.

 

[Tigers!]

Make voting compulsory.,

Absolutely. I've advocated for that for ... ever. Republicans can't win under such rules, though. So they obstruct every effort to move in that direction.

That might be true. But since you have never had compulsory voting there is no historical data to use.

 

[Elixir]

We have the history of Republican opposition. You can’t blame them; they’re a minority party trying to cling to power. If everyone had to vote, they’d be toast.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

What is interesting is that in 2023 (mid-mid term Spring election, typically lower turnout, but this was "high" for a "low" turnout) Daniel Kelly lost by 13 pts.

2020, Daniel Kelly lost in a high turnout, pre-Roe v Wade reversal, election... by 11 pts. Trump energized his base, he also energized the opposition. And Roe v Wade seems to have become the brick on the accelerator for opposition turnout.

Food for thought, Trump lost Wisconsin in 2020 by less than 1 pt, so Kelly lost by 10 more points in Wisconsin than Trump. I'm having a difficult time parsing the meaning of this. I mean, Trump and the GOP are the reason for Roe v Wade being overturned. It seems odd, that the voters in Wisconsin are fine with Federal laws and oversight being hammered, but not State laws. And the other question becomes, what person in the GOP thought it was a good idea to rerun the guy that lost by 10 more points in Wisconsin than Trump in 2020... for this extremely important seat on the Court? Whatever the reason, that person or people, need a round of drinks as a thanks.

 

[southernhybrid]

We have the history of Republican opposition. You can’t blame them; they’re a minority party trying to cling to power. If everyone had to vote, they’d be toast.

I agree that this is likely because when I was working I always tried to talk my young coworkers into voting. They were mostly poor Black women who would have voted for the Democrats if they bothered to vote. I finally got two to register and vote when Obama was running, bt one "forgot" to vote in the next election. She didn't even know that we have 3 full weeks of early voting in Georgia.

I've known other people who never voted and most of them would vote for the Dems if they bothered to vote. On the other hand, there are many Americans who only vote Republican for two reasons, they have been told that the Dems are going tot take away their guns, or they believe that abortion should be banned.

I like what a woman in her 80s, who still worked part time told me. "My daddy told me that the Republican Party is the party for the rich and the Democratic Party is the party for the rest of us". She was a white Southerner who voted Democrat her entire life. There are plenty like her, but it doesn't help when young liberals demonize older adults without having a clue which party they support when they vote.

On the other hand, I've never understood why good people, like my dear neighbor across the street, who is in his late 70s, vote Republican. He's a good man but for some reason, he still believes that Obama was born in Kenya. Ignorance is another problem that we may never overcome.

The Republicans have done a great job of manipulating voters by demonizing the Democrats over gun control and abortion. Conservative Christians churches sometimes tell their congregants to vote Republican. I know this because my mother, who died recently, used to complain to her atheist daughter about how her pastor tried to get people to vote Republican. Fortunately, my mom was never persuaded to vote Republican.

We have so many issues that make it difficult for the Dems, from gerrymandering to voter suppression and the damn electoral college. That's why we need everyone to vote.

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

“One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors” – Plato

 

[Tigers!]

“One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors” – Plato

Plato did seem to have an high opinion of himself. He also advocated slavery IIRC.

 

[Tigers!]

We have the history of Republican opposition. You can’t blame them; they’re a minority party trying to cling to power. If everyone had to vote, they’d be toast.

How do you know the Republican are the minority as opposed to the democrats? You have never had compulsory voting to find out.

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

Biden got 7 million more votes than Trump.

 

[Elixir]

H

We have the history of Republican opposition. You can’t blame them; they’re a minority party trying to cling to power. If everyone had to vote, they’d be toast.

How do you know the Republican are the minority as opposed to the democrats? You have never had compulsory voting to find out.

Registrations, for one. Republicans’ terror at the very thought of compulsory voting, for another. Google is your friend.

On December 17, 2020, Gallup polling found that 31% of Americans identified as Democrats, 25% identified as Republicans, and 41% as Independent.

Given Republicans’ antipathy to all things independent, that 41% figure looms large.

 

[Tigers!]

H

We have the history of Republican opposition. You can’t blame them; they’re a minority party trying to cling to power. If everyone had to vote, they’d be toast.

How do you know the Republican are the minority as opposed to the democrats? You have never had compulsory voting to find out.

Registrations, for one. Republicans’ terror at the very thought of compulsory voting, for another. Google is your friend.

Voter registrations < total voter body. You are assuming that the % of democrats vs. % republicans in voter registrations is replicated in (total voters - registrations). I am merely pointing that that is an assumption for which no data exists. It may be right or it may be wrong.

On December 17, 2020, Gallup polling found that 31% of Americans identified as Democrats, 25% identified as Republicans, and 41% as Independent.

Given Republicans’ antipathy to all things independent, that 41% figure looms large.

There is a saying in Australia that the only poll that counts in on election day. 41% of independents on a random poll should not be taking at a indication of voting intentions when faced with a ballot paper.
Since you really do not have independents at a presidential level that 41% is effectively unknown.

 

[Patooka]

Voter registrations < total voter body. You are assuming that the % of democrats vs. % republicans in voter registrations is replicated in (total voters - registrations). I am merely pointing that that is an assumption for which no data exists. It may be right or it may be wrong.

It's is a guess, you're right there, but it's the smart way to bet. Republicans haven't had a majority vote in literally decades. You can also look at how the Senate votes go per state and correlate them with how many votes each party received in the Presidential Election. Basically, when the US Senate is 50% Democrat and 50% Republican, the Democrats represent 186 million Americans and Republicans only 145 million. I get what you are saying about non voters being "unknown", but there is plenty of statistical evidence that very strongly suggests undecided are far more likely to vote Democrat. The reasoning I always go to is that Trump got roughly the same percentage of Americans to vote for him as Romney and McCain in 2016. He won because not enough people turned up for Hillary. Hardly are ringing endorsement for a political party that the only time they have a chance in hell of winning is if the other people don't turn up.

There is a saying in Australia that the only poll that counts in on election day. 41% of independents on a random poll should not be taking at a indication of voting intentions when faced with a ballot paper.
Since you really do not have independents at a presidential level that 41% is effectively unknown.

Firstly, in some places in America, who you register as determines which elections you're allowed to vote in. Secondly, labelling Independents as undecided is a bit of a myth. Of that 41%, 10 % will either vote Democrat or not at all and vice versa for the Republicans. So the truly undecided figure is roughly 20% of voters. Democrats still consistently receive the majority of votes despite such a margin of error so it's not as unknown as you'd suspect. It's the outcome and the winner that's up in the air - for pretty much the reasons everyone has said in the thread.

 

[Elixir]

H

We have the history of Republican opposition. You can’t blame them; they’re a minority party trying to cling to power. If everyone had to vote, they’d be toast.

How do you know the Republican are the minority as opposed to the democrats? You have never had compulsory voting to find out.

Registrations, for one. Republicans’ terror at the very thought of compulsory voting, for another. Google is your friend.

Voter registrations < total voter body. You are assuming that the % of democrats vs. % republicans in voter registrations is replicated in (total voters - registrations). I am merely pointing that that is an assumption for which no data exists. It may be right or it may be wrong.

On December 17, 2020, Gallup polling found that 31% of Americans identified as Democrats, 25% identified as Republicans, and 41% as Independent.

Given Republicans’ antipathy to all things independent, that 41% figure looms large.

There is a saying in Australia that the only poll that counts in on election day. 41% of independents on a random poll should not be taking at a indication of voting intentions when faced with a ballot paper.
Since you really do not have independents at a presidential level that 41% is effectively unknown.

Cheato lost the last election by over seven million votes. The last Republican to win the popular vote left office nearly 30 years ago. You can pretend they’re not a minority party, but the facts don’t support that wish.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

H

We have the history of Republican opposition. You can’t blame them; they’re a minority party trying to cling to power. If everyone had to vote, they’d be toast.

How do you know the Republican are the minority as opposed to the democrats? You have never had compulsory voting to find out.

Registrations, for one. Republicans’ terror at the very thought of compulsory voting, for another. Google is your friend.

Voter registrations < total voter body. You are assuming that the % of democrats vs. % republicans in voter registrations is replicated in (total voters - registrations). I am merely pointing that that is an assumption for which no data exists. It may be right or it may be wrong.

On December 17, 2020, Gallup polling found that 31% of Americans identified as Democrats, 25% identified as Republicans, and 41% as Independent.

Given Republicans’ antipathy to all things independent, that 41% figure looms large.

There is a saying in Australia that the only poll that counts in on election day. 41% of independents on a random poll should not be taking at a indication of voting intentions when faced with a ballot paper.
Since you really do not have independents at a presidential level that 41% is effectively unknown.

Cheato lost the last election by over seven million votes. The last Republican to win the popular vote left office nearly 30 years ago. You can pretend they’re not a minority party, but the facts don’t support that wish.

W won it in 2004. So it was nearly 20 years ago.

I think there is minutia that is being lost on Tigers. The US poll, voting setup isn't apples to apples to other nations. The US doesn't have 41% that vote for a third party,. The whole "independent" thing is more rhetorical. Then we have the stupid psychology of the American voter, which we just don't have time to explain those patterns... ie the White House usually loses seats in the first mid-term, or the desire for "charge" for change's sake (see 2000 after the wildly popular Democrat President). Just think of US polling and voting like Quantum Mechanics. The math works and we just leave it there.

Everyone voting would be nice, but we know that most people aren't really that in-tuned with issues to vote intelligently. So, the votes become more noise that cancels each other out. The issue right now in the US is the false accusations of fraud... of which the news companies responsible for a portion of that are in court and very likely to pay out heavily for the false accusations they knew were lies. But GOP controlled state legislatures are still continuing to pass laws aimed at "protecting" elections from the fraud that is happening at levels so small, they are barely even detectable (and when they are detected, typically right-wing voters, when excluding the entrapped felons who did their time).

 

[lpetrich]

Justice Janet Protasiewicz is sworn in, giving liberals control of Wisconsin Supreme Court | Wisconsin Public Radio - "Protasiewicz's oath of office Tuesday gives liberals a majority on the court for the first time since 2008"

Promising to ensure justice and fairness for all, Justice Janet Protasiewicz was officially sworn in to a 10-year term on the Wisconsin Supreme Court Tuesday, flipping the court from a conservative to a liberal majority for the first time since 2008.

The investiture ceremony bore similarities to a governor's inauguration. Hundreds gathered in the state Capitol rotunda to hear Protasiewicz speak, punctuating the roughly hour-long event with standing ovations and cheers.

Protasiewicz, who spoke for just over 20 minutes, largely avoided some of the hot-button themes that helped her mobilize Democratic voters in her high-turnout, double-digit victory in April. Absent was any mention of her belief that women have a right to choose when it comes to abortion or her assertion that the political maps drawn by Republicans were "rigged."

Instead, Protasiewicz talked about her time growing up on Milwaukee's south side, spending 25 years as a prosecutor in the Milwaukee County District Attorney's office and most of the last decade as a circuit court judge.

 

[lpetrich]

These four swing states had conservative supreme courts. Now progressives control them all

During the 2012 elections, Barack Obama carried Michigan, Minnesota, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin, continuing a string of Democratic presidential victories in each state going back to 1992. But at the same time, Republicans or conservatives enjoyed majorities on all four states' supreme courts. Now, however, Democrats or progressives control all of them.

WI: 4-3
PA: 4-2 (one D seat vacant)
MI: 4-3
MN: 5-2, will soon be 6-1