• Welcome to the Internet Infidels Discussion Board.

Are you Supportive of these Onesies?

Don2 (Don1 Revised)

Don2 (Don1 Revised)

Contributor
Joined
Apr 1, 2004
Messages
14,238
Location
USA
Basic Beliefs
non-practicing agnostic
RFK Jr is an asshole and it's an insult to the American people that he was nominated. This only shows the amount of respect Trump has for the citizens. Basically none.
 
Elixir said:
A real shit circus of assclowns.
I doubt the country will ever truly recover.
Click to expand...

I think it depends on a few things (spit-balling it here) like how long this chaos lasts, how deeply they are able to gut federal agencies, and how fast it sinks the ship of state. I've read that this is just the initial "shock and awe" designed to keep everyone back on their heels until they get the regime firmly in place, but the way it's going makes me wonder if they're going to be able to rein in the shit they've released.

Will it last a year before the combination of incompetence and a cratering economy convinces them to shift course and bring back subject matter experts, or will we be living under a dictatorship by then?

I'm kinda hoping for it to crash and burn sooner than later, because if they get entrenched, there's no "recover" until there's a bunker and a couple shots.
 
Ford said:
Elixir said:
A real shit circus of assclowns.
I doubt the country will ever truly recover.
Click to expand...

I think it depends on a few things (spit-balling it here) like how long this chaos lasts, how deeply they are able to gut federal agencies, and how fast it sinks the ship of state. I've read that this is just the initial "shock and awe" designed to keep everyone back on their heels until they get the regime firmly in place, but the way it's going makes me wonder if they're going to be able to rein in the shit they've released.

Will it last a year before the combination of incompetence and a cratering economy convinces them to shift course and bring back subject matter experts, or will we be living under a dictatorship by then?

I'm kinda hoping for it to crash and burn sooner than later, because if they get entrenched, there's no "recover" until there's a bunker and a couple shots.
Click to expand...

The best and brightest in the federal government are being fired, or will resign out of fear or disgust. "Institutional knowledge" will be lost.

Many of the best and brightest in foreign countries have flocked to America's universities -- best in the world -- or to American companies, especially high-tech companies. These foreigners will be MUCH less eager to come.

Americans prone to violence and racism will feel enabled. Many policemen or entire police forces are already in the MAGA camp. The recent Jon Stewart episode was a grim reminder that progressive leaders either do not appreciate the grave dangers, or are understandably too intimidated to speak or act forcefully. A generation of young Americans are growing up with a new definition of American values and the American dream. No, I don't expect a Maoist "Cultural Revolution" or Hitler-Jugend but the more subdued pace of America's "cultural revolution" will just make it more insidious.

A key part of the Trumpist agenda is to use deregulation and changes to taxes and spending to further enhance the already-huge power of America's billionaires. We can expect inflation and other economic turns that adversely affect the average American, but asset prices will continue their rise; corporations and billionaires will be delighted.

The 6-3 SCOTUS majority may become 7-2. Other horrid changes and appointments will also last far beyond a 4-year term. (Recall that Biden had to live with the Trump-appointed criminal Postmaster-General throughout Biden's entire term.)

The BEST we can hope for is some severe backlash maybe soon, more probably some time in the 2030's. I don't think we can predict what form that backlash will take. But the excesses in late 18th-century France led to the Reign of Terror and the rise of Napoleon; the American Civil War led to the excesses of Reconstruction; and so on.

Sorry if I cannot offer more sanguine predictions.
 
Ford said:
Elixir said:
A real shit circus of assclowns.
I doubt the country will ever truly recover.
Click to expand...

I think it depends on a few things (spit-balling it here) like how long this chaos lasts, how deeply they are able to gut federal agencies, and how fast it sinks the ship of state. I've read that this is just the initial "shock and awe" designed to keep everyone back on their heels until they get the regime firmly in place, but the way it's going makes me wonder if they're going to be able to rein in the shit they've released.
Click to expand...
I suppose part of it depends on who is making the calls. WashPo is reporting that Musk is making decisions and deeply involved with certain aspects without requiring the approval of other senior officials. That seems insane.
article said:
The proposal, emailed late in the day to many of the nation’s 2.3 million federal workers, blindsided some advisers to President Donald Trump, including officials in the budget office and agencies that typically would be consulted in advance of such monumental changes to personnel and spending policies, the people said.

...

Musk’s team also was critical to building the system that sent an email from “hr@opm.gov” to most federal employees across a dizzying array of agencies — a capacity that had not existed before last week. Musk touted the offer on X soon after it hit employees’ inboxes, arguing it was a crucial first step in reorganizing a federal bureaucracy he has long characterized as lazy and disloyal. The email emphasized the importance of a “reliable, loyal, trustworthy” workforce.
Click to expand...
Musk's involvement is like Musk is trying to run the Federal Bureaucracy like it is his corporation. Musk overestimates his managing skills by astronomical levels. The progress of SpaceX and Tesla might very well be in spite of him not because of him (minus his ability to help with liquidity). He waltzes into DC and thinks that his managing skills are Level 8274 and then just repeats his Manic anti-human overseeing. Likely quite unaware that there are different rules in a massive Bureaucracy.
 
Jimmy Higgins said:
Ford said:
Elixir said:
A real shit circus of assclowns.
I doubt the country will ever truly recover.
Click to expand...

I think it depends on a few things (spit-balling it here) like how long this chaos lasts, how deeply they are able to gut federal agencies, and how fast it sinks the ship of state. I've read that this is just the initial "shock and awe" designed to keep everyone back on their heels until they get the regime firmly in place, but the way it's going makes me wonder if they're going to be able to rein in the shit they've released.
Click to expand...
I suppose part of it depends on who is making the calls. WashPo is reporting that Musk is making decisions and deeply involved with certain aspects without requiring the approval of other senior officials. That seems insane.
article said:
The proposal, emailed late in the day to many of the nation’s 2.3 million federal workers, blindsided some advisers to President Donald Trump, including officials in the budget office and agencies that typically would be consulted in advance of such monumental changes to personnel and spending policies, the people said.

...

Musk’s team also was critical to building the system that sent an email from “hr@opm.gov” to most federal employees across a dizzying array of agencies — a capacity that had not existed before last week. Musk touted the offer on X soon after it hit employees’ inboxes, arguing it was a crucial first step in reorganizing a federal bureaucracy he has long characterized as lazy and disloyal. The email emphasized the importance of a “reliable, loyal, trustworthy” workforce.
Click to expand...
Musk's involvement is like Musk is trying to run the Federal Bureaucracy like it is his corporation. Musk overestimates his managing skills by astronomical levels. The progress of SpaceX and Tesla might very well be in spite of him not because of him (minus his ability to help with liquidity). He waltzes into DC and thinks that his managing skills are Level 8274 and then just repeats his Manic anti-human overseeing. Likely quite unaware that there are different rules in a massive Bureaucracy.
Click to expand...
"Disloyal".

Says all you need to know, really.

How much longer before the loyalty pledges? How much longer before consequences for not pledging loyalty? How much longer for draconian police state observation to ensure it?
 
I'd say the interesting part is with the right maneuvers, the Trump Admin can fire a lot of people, all the disloyal folk. But there is the issue of determining the loyalty of 900,000 or so workers. That takes time (and resources). One of the reasons Musk wanted to create a central communication set up.
 
The entire purpose of the US Government is to be disloyal. To uphold the Constitution, even if doing so goes against supporting the President (or any other person).

Even if the person in question is someone to whom you are normally deeply loyal - your spouse, your child, the leader of your church, the King of England - as an employee of the US Government, you are expected to put the Constitution of the United States of America above your personal loyalty.

That's what distinguishes the USA from any tinpot dictatorship or feudal fiefdom.

Disloyalty is how the country got started, and how it's supposed to work. It has been a very effective way to do things for a couple of centuries.

The opposite of "disloyalty" is "nepotism" and "corruption". Though unlike these things, "loyalty" can be spun as a virtue rather than as the vice it actually is, by conflating the virtue of loyalty to the constitution, with the vice of loyalty to a person.
 
bilby said:
The entire purpose of the US Government is to be disloyal. To uphold the Constitution, even if doing so goes against supporting the President (or any other person).

Even if the person in question is someone to whom you are normally deeply loyal - your spouse, your child, the leader of your church, the King of England - as an employee of the US Government, you are expected to put the Constitution of the United States of America above your personal loyalty.

That's what distinguishes the USA from any tinpot dictatorship or feudal fiefdom.

Disloyalty is how the country got started, and how it's supposed to work. It has been a very effective way to do things for a couple of centuries.

The opposite of "disloyalty" is "nepotism" and "corruption". Though unlike these things, "loyalty" can be spun as a virtue rather than as the vice it actually is, by conflating the virtue of loyalty to the constitution, with the vice of loyalty to a person.
Click to expand...
It depresses me to read such a stirring description of what was once the American national ethos, coming as it does from the pen of a well-read foreigner. Your perception of our political culture is apt but out of date, for we've altogether forgotten about it here. Anyone who opposes the government on a matter of principle is now "woke scum", an object of terror and paranoia for the right, and a hushed embarassment to the left. 12 Democratic senators just voted to indefinitely detain any undocumented resident accused of crimes without a trial or any formal charge, and we're all supposed to smile and nod and congratulate them for reaching across the aisle on the important project of bringing back the internment camp system. I love the land. I love some of its people. But this country disgusts me sometimes. I hope Australia or somewhere is ready to pick up the "Great Experiment", as it is in its death throes here.
 
bilby said:
The entire purpose of the US Government is to be disloyal. To uphold the Constitution, even if doing so goes against supporting the President (or any other person).

Even if the person in question is someone to whom you are normally deeply loyal - your spouse, your child, the leader of your church, the King of England - as an employee of the US Government, you are expected to put the Constitution of the United States of America above your personal loyalty.

That's what distinguishes the USA from any tinpot dictatorship or feudal fiefdom.

Disloyalty is how the country got started, and how it's supposed to work. It has been a very effective way to do things for a couple of centuries.

The opposite of "disloyalty" is "nepotism" and "corruption". Though unlike these things, "loyalty" can be spun as a virtue rather than as the vice it actually is, by conflating the virtue of loyalty to the constitution, with the vice of loyalty to a person.
Click to expand...
I'm stealing this. Bravo!
 
Anyone who indoctrinates their children into anything (aside from just how to be a decent person) is disgusting.
 
Politesse said:
I hope Australia or somewhere is ready to pick up the "Great Experiment", as it is in its death throes here.
Click to expand...
Don't look at us. We started out as a prison, and our legal system reflects that.

Anything that is not mandatory here is prohibited.

We survive by mostly ignoring the law and relying on the authorities to do the same, but don't try being an undocumented immigrant, a Muslim, or an Aborigine, at least not outside the major urban centres.
 
Politesse said:
But this country disgusts me sometimes. I hope Australia or somewhere is ready to pick up the "Great Experiment", as it is in its death throes here.
Click to expand...

I clicked the link here, and discover that three U.S. citizens (natives of Puerto Rico -- "many people don't know that's part of the U.S.") were arrested for speaking Spanish and detained, despite speaking perfect English, until their birth certificates were eventually produced.

All is OK though. The ICE agents "said they were sorry." . . . Although not quite sorry enough to transport the victims from the place of detention to at least the point of arrest, if not to their home.
 
That's the size of it. Our civil liberties are down the toilet. They can arrest any of us at any time, call our unlawful detention "immigration law", their theft of our property "civil forfeiture", their illegal stops and searches "narcotics law", their censorship activities "parental rights", their union breaking and human trafficking activities "the right to work" and all along the way, no one calls them on it. They glibly ignore both our rights and their responsibilities to the actual law. We're deeply embroiled in a losing war with a hostile power that has seized control of multiple critical channels of government and has clear plans on how to take the others. So far, most Americans aren't woke to what's going on at all, or are only experiencing this quiet coup as a sort of vague anxiety or confusion. I hope that changes, and it still could, but I am very worried. People only seem to wake up and take truly notice when things burst into brief fits of active violence, but those times aren't the most dangerous times, they are just the zits on the surface of the cthonic sea of snake oil they have made of our once proud democracy.

Orwell was right, why fight a war with bullets when words will suffice to confuse the very means by which people encounter the world: our perception? It's not a secret, they've published their basic game plan in extravagant documents that they know most people won't or can't read, so confident they are of their position. It was never practically necessary to publish Project 2025 so openly: it's bragging, a game, to toy with the sanity those of us who still read stuff. The purloined letter grinning from the mantelpiece. They'll tell you to your face that what they are principally against is "wokeness" - awareness - smugly confident that they have already effectively poisoned that well, that only an ever shrinking intellectual class will even attempt to call them on it, and since the public doesn't trust educated voices anyway, who cares? We can bleat all we like, they won the war of words and perception years ago.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom