Vegetarian Fake Meats

[lpetrich]

Both "plant" and "herb" have squeezed out a native English word: wort - Wiktionary, the free dictionary

There are no native English words.

???

 

[bilby]

Both "plant" and "herb" have squeezed out a native English word: wort - Wiktionary, the free dictionary

There are no native English words.

???

All English words are taken from other languages (including, in a neat bit of recursion, English). Even neologisms owe their roots to preexisting words, and though it might be fair to suggest that totally novel coinage is cromulent, this is very rare, and it is clear that such words owe their structure and form to the cadence of preexisting English.

 

[lpetrich]

There are no native English words.

???

All English words are taken from other languages (including, in a neat bit of recursion, English). ...

Total nonsense. English has oodles of native words, usually the more commonplace ones.

 

[lpetrich]

 Vegetarianism and religion

The Dharmic religions - Hinduism, Jainism, Buddhism, and Sikhism - often feature vegetarianism, though usually lacto vegetarianism.

 Jain vegetarianism and A meal according to Jains: Vegetarians among Vegetarians | Culinary Historians of ChicagoCulinary Historians of Chicago - lacto vegetarianism with rejection of:

• Roots: potato, garlic, onion, carrot, ...
• Stems: cauliflower, mushroom, ...
• Fruits: eggplant, fig, ...

Roots and stems they object to because collecting them involves killing the whole plant, though a mushroom is a fruiting body of a subterranean fungus. Eggplants and figs they object to because these fruits contain lots of seeds. Eggs they object to for the reason that they object to meat, because they don't want to kill animals.

They also object to honey, because collecting it involves stealing from bees, even though honey is completely vegetarian, derived from plant secretions like flower nectar that the bees collect.


Vegetarianism is not very common in the Abrahamic religions, however, and for a long time in the Western world, the best-known vegetarians were the followers of Pythagoras:  Pythagoreanism Along with that, they also refused to eat beans.

 

[lpetrich]

I've thought of some names for some of the vegetarian-like categories I've previously mentioned. Along with existing names,

• Pollotarianism - birds but not mammals
• Ectothermitarianism - reptiles (turtles, lizards, snakes, crocodilians) but not birds or mammals
• Amphibitarianism - frogs but not amniotes (reptiles, birds, mammals)
• Pescetarianism - fish but not land vertebrates
• Molluscatarianism - invertebrates but not vertebrates
• Vegetarianism - all of our planet's biota but animals
• Autotrophitarianism - autotrophic organisms (plants, algae, some bacteria), but not heterotrophic ones: animals, fungi (mushrooms, yeast, ...)
• Prokaryotarianism - prokaryotes (bacteria, blue-green algae) but not eukaryotes (plants, other algae, animals, fungi, ...)
• Abiotarianism - only food made by nonbiological processes, like in a lab or in a factory

 

[pood]

I haven’t read this whole thread, so maybe this has been mentioned, but there actually are “beatharians,” who believe one can live without any food just by breathing. I actually knew one such many years ago, though I noticed that while he advocated it, he never tried it for himself.

 

[Elixir]

I haven’t read this whole thread, so maybe this has been mentioned, but there actually are “beatharians,” who believe one can live without any food just by breathing. I actually knew one such many years ago, though I noticed that while he advocated it, he never tried it for himself.

I’ve heard that vegetarian breatharians are prone to suffering from vitamin and protein shortages. Meat based breatharians can stay healthy if they drink enough water.

 

[ZiprHead]

I haven’t read this whole thread, so maybe this has been mentioned, but there actually are “beatharians,” who believe one can live without any food just by breathing. I actually knew one such many years ago, though I noticed that while he advocated it, he never tried it for himself.

I’ve heard that vegetarian breatharians are prone to suffering from vitamin and protein shortages. Meat based breatharians can stay healthy if they drink enough water.

Water is just heavy gas.

 

[bilby]

I haven’t read this whole thread, so maybe this has been mentioned, but there actually are “beatharians,” who believe one can live without any food just by breathing. I actually knew one such many years ago, though I noticed that while he advocated it, he never tried it for himself.

I’ve heard that vegetarian breatharians are prone to suffering from vitamin and protein shortages. Meat based breatharians can stay healthy if they drink enough water.

Water is just heavy gas.

It's just an ordinary gas, as long as they consume it at above 100°C

Now, you might imagine that inhaling steam at >100°C would be harmful, but I have it from no less an authority than Gwyneth Paltrow, that nothing that is natural can be harmful. And water at >100°C occurs naturally in huge quantities in the Yellowstone National Park (amongst other places).

 

[lpetrich]

I haven’t read this whole thread, so maybe this has been mentioned, but there actually are “beatharians,” who believe one can live without any food just by breathing. I actually knew one such many years ago, though I noticed that while he advocated it, he never tried it for himself.

Breatharians? Some people have tried to live on that diet, but they end up losing weight and even dying. Seattle woman attempts to live on sunlight, water

If it means purely gaseous nutrition, that is an impossibility, because every organism needs liquid water as an internal solvent, and in some cases, as a metabolic feedstock. So we must make an exception for water.

Some organisms can indeed get much of their nutrition from gaseous sources, like methanogens. They get their energy from this chemical reaction:

CO2 + 4H2 -> CH4 + 2H2O ... where CH4 = methane, H2O = water.

Plants, algae, and cyanobacteria do 2H2O + (light) -> 2O2 + 4H+ + 4e- ... with the electrons then being used for fixing carbon and for biosynthesis. Carbon fixation: CO2 + 4H+ + 4e- -> (C) + 2H2O

Some methanogens go further, by fixing nitrogen: N2 + 3H2 -> 3NH3 ... ammonia.

This accounts for C, H, N, and O. The next element to consider is sulfur. It forms some room-temperature gases, like hydrogen sulfide, H2S, and some bacteria use H2S for energy metabolism.

However, all the other elements only occur in refractory forms, like phosphorus, as phosphate ions, PO4---, and iron, as iron ions, Fe++ and Fe+++.

So purely gaseous nutrition is impossible, though one can get close.

 

[unapologetic]

And water at >100°C occurs naturally in huge quantities in the Yellowstone National Park (amongst other places).

Yeah but is it non-toxic? Yellowstone gasses are probably full of sulfur and other dissolved minerals.

 

[bilby]

Yeah but is it non-toxic?

I refer you to Ms Paltrow's wisdom.

Allegedly, "natural" always implies "harmless", and usually goes further, implying "curative".

Anyone who tells you that natural things (like superhot volcanic springs full of sulphuric acid, hydrogen sulphide, cyanide, arsenic, etc.) are potentially toxic or harmful, is obviously a shill for the big corporations.

This is also why ascorbic acid is a dangerous food additive, but Vitamin C is a beneficial natural product.

 

[lpetrich]

Singapore Approves a Lab-Grown Meat Product, a Global First - The New York Times - Dec. 2, 2020 - "The approval for a U.S. start-up’s “cultured chicken” product is a small victory for the nascent laboratory meat industry. Less clear is whether other countries will follow."

The company, Eat Just, is based in San Francisco and describes its product as “real, high-quality meat created directly from animal cells for safe human consumption.” Singapore’s Food Agency said on Wednesday that it had approved the product for sale as an ingredient in chicken nuggets.

...
Eat Just already sells an egglike product that it makes from mung beans, Mr. Tetrick said. The product is sold in the United States and China, he said, and the company plans to expand to South Korea early next year.

No mention of how this chicken meat was grown. I'm guessing that it would need a well-digested nutrient broth: lots of amino acids and glucose and fatty acids and vitamins.

You Can Buy Meat Grown in a Lab in This Country - The New York Times - July 24, 2024

On a recent Saturday, visitors to the store, Huber’s Butchery, watched as a chef sautéed filets — 3 percent of which were generated from chicken cells and the rest from plant proteins — and served them in taco shells with avocado, pico de gallo and coriander.

...
The chicken served at Huber’s begins with a small sample of cells. These are put into temperature-controlled stainless steel vessels known as bioreactors at a factory run by a local firm, Esco Aster. They are fed with a mixture of amino acids, fats, vitamins and minerals to mirror the nutrients that a chicken eats on the outside. Once a significant number of cells is cultivated, they are harvested and processed with plant proteins at Singapore’s Food Tech Innovation Center.

Just what I expected: a nutrient broth.

 

[lpetrich]

Our Appetite for Meat Is Hurting the Environment. Enter Lab-Grown Meat. - The New York Times - Sept. 21, 2024 - "Are we ready for the future of meat?"

Worldwide, 80 billion animals are slaughtered every year for meat. Raising all those animals has already claimed most of the world’s farmland. It has led to zoonotic diseases and vast deforestation. It has polluted air and water and spewed planet-heating gasses into the atmosphere.

It has also enabled many more people to eat meat more often than ever before, which has in turn put pressure on governments to both keep meat prices affordable and reduce its climate hoofprint.

...
Its fans praise its extreme efficiency: feet, tails, feathers, snouts are eliminated. Its detractors say it’s a threat to culture and livelihoods.

...
Meat production today accounts for somewhere between 10 and 20 percent of total greenhouse gas emissions, depending on how you measure it. Reducing those emissions is vital if the world is to reduce the hazards of planetary heating.

The article then mentioned Florida banning lab-grown meats.

When Gov. Ron DeSantis, Republican of Florida, signed into law the ban on cultivated meat, he said he was “fighting back against the global elite’s plan to force the world to eat meat grown in a petri dish or bugs to achieve their authoritarian goals.” In treating meat’s future as a culture war issue — feet-and-feathers traditionalists vs. lab-grown disrupters — he was signaling just how deeply people feel about the matter.

Seems like MTG-level conspiracy-mongering.

 

[lpetrich]

Who’s Afraid of Lab-Grown Meat? - The New York Times - March 14, 2025 - "Mississippi became the third state to ban cell-derived meat, a product not for sale in the United States. But not all livestock producers are opposed to cultivated protein."

Last year, Florida and Alabama became the first states to outlaw the cultivation and sale of meat grown in laboratories, and a number of other states, including Nebraska and Georgia, are considering similar measures.

...
The opposition to cultivated meat has mostly taken hold in red states, but the trend defies easy categorization. Trade groups like the National Cattlemen’s Beef Association and the Meat Institute have come out against restrictive measures, and Republican lawmakers in Wyoming and South Dakota have quashed similar bills, with many describing the proposed bans as anathema to conservative values like limited government and free trade.

...
Some opponents of cultivated meat traffic in falsehoods about the health risks of cultivated meat, while others, like Gov. Ron DeSantis of Florida, have embraced the opportunity to defend domestic livestock producers.

But cultured meat has also been swept up in the nation’s culture wars. That’s in part because proponents often describe lab-grown meat as a “no kill” humane alternative to farmed animal products. Many also see it as a way to reduce the environmental impacts of raising millions of cows, pigs and chickens — and of the large quantities of antibiotics required to keep them healthy in crowded feeding sheds.

..
Such sentiments inflame politicians who look unkindly on vegetarians and environmentalists, and for whom the consumption of a juicy T-bone steak is an act of patriotism.

Governor DeSantis Signs Legislation to Keep Lab-Grown Meat Out of Florida | Executive Office of the Governor

“Today, Florida is fighting back against the global elite’s plan to force the world to eat meat grown in a petri dish or bugs to achieve their authoritarian goals,” said Governor Ron DeSantis. “Our administration will continue to focus on investing in our local farmers and ranchers, and we will save our beef."

However, "Backers of the Mississippi bill have not publicly explained their antipathy to cultivated meat".

Still, Mr. Gipson has not been shy in criticizing cultivated protein as hostile to farmers. “I want my steak to come from farm-raised beef, not a petri dish from a lab,” he wrote last year on his website.

 

[lpetrich]

 Veggie burger and  Vegetarian hot dog - yes they exist.

I've thought of an alternate name for autotrophitarianism: verditerianism, from verde, the Italian word for green, in analogy with pollotarianism, from pollo, Italian, "chicken", and pescetarian, from pesce, Italian, "fish".

GOOD Meat | The future of meat
Locations: a grocery store in Singapore and a restaurant in DC, US

GOOD Meat | Process - growing chicken cells in a vat with these nutrients:

• Glucose - Corn, sugar
• Protein - Soy, pea, wheat, yeast
• Fats - Soybean oil, corn oil
• Fiber - Corn, wheat
• Vitamins - Corn, yeast, fermentation
• Minerals - Natural ores and all of the above

Though the proteins are broken down into amino acids for easier absorption.

 

[lpetrich]

Fake meats: Impossible Foods and Beyond Meat: Vegan Meat, Plant Based Meat Substitutes and LightLife

Mission Barns - "As every cook knows, fat drives flavor. Our products combine cultivated pork fat with plant protein for a succulent, sustainable bite."

Mission Barns: Process - growing meat cells in vats with nutrients: sugars, amino acids, vitamins, minerals

Mission Barns: Newsroom noting Mission Barns unveils novel bioreactor for cultivated meat, fat

Progress has been made on every aspect of cultivated meat production from media formulations to cell lines. But the economics won’t add up unless the industry develops new bioreactors purpose-built for high-volume, low-value food, as opposed to low-volume, high-value pharma, says Mission Barns.

Founded in 2018 by former Eat Just scientist Eitan Fischer, San Francisco-based Mission Barns grows cultivated pork fat in proprietary bioreactors it claims can dramatically improve the efficiency of the production process. The fat is then combined with plant-based proteins to create meat alternatives such as sausages and bacon.

UPSIDE Foods | UPSIDE Foods - vat-grown chicken

Believer | A Better Future For Meat - more vat-grown chicken

 

[lpetrich]

Pollotarianism - birds (chicken, turkey, ...)
Pescetarianism - fish and invertebrates
Some people do both: pollo-pescetarianism or pesce-pollotarianism

Take Food Processing's Annual R&D Survey | Food Processing

Mentioning several companies that do precision fermentation or are starting to do so.

Onego Bio — egg protein from fermentation - ovalbumin - uses soil fungus Trichoderma reesei genetically engineered to make this protein - About that protein - About their production process

Nourish Ingredients - working on Tastilux "authentic meaty flavor and aroma" and Creamilux "authentic dairy mouthfeel, taste and function".

 

[lpetrich]

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Currently offering chocolate bars with its protein sweetener: Shop Chocolate – Oobli

Sweet Protein – Oobli

Derived from about a dozen fruits primarily found in West Africa and other equatorial environments, sweet proteins are a class of proteins that deliver a sugar-like sweetness but none of the negative health impacts.

How are Sweet Proteins Made? The Process of Precision Fermentation Explained – Oobli - Thaumatin, Monellin, Miraculin, Brazzein, all from various West African plants. But instead of harvesting those plants' berries, the genes for those proteins were sequenced and copied into yeast cells.

Why Precision Fermentation Is Crucial for Creating a More Sustainable Food System – Oobli - by reducing the amount of resources necessary for producing food items. Growing yeast takes much fewer resources than growing sweet-protein berry plants, or for that matter, sugarcane for "real" sugar.

Home - TurtleTree - makes lactoferrin, a milk protein that binds iron - TurtleTree Obtains the World's First Self-GRAS for Animal-Free Lactoferrin, LF+™ Now Approved to Commercialize in the U.S. - TurtleTree - GRAS = Generally Recognized As Safe - World Changing Ideas 2024: TurtleTree is creating milk protein without any cows - Fast Company - says that TurtleTree uses yeast that were genetically engineered to make this protein.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Beyond Meat is such a bad investment... it is apparently a safe investment to short. Have revenue that is roughly over $200 million (or roughly 40 Truth Socials), but they are bleeding money. Beyond Meat is pretty much the Rolls Royce of fake meat patties. But in 2027, their time might be up. So is this the time to buy another stock freezer and buy up as much Beyond Meat hamburger patties as you can?