Yet another war, this time with Iran

[ZiprHead]

Fed-up Trump threatens to ‘blow the s–t’ out of Iran — prompting Tehran to storm out of US peace talks

Along with the threats, the president suggested the US could take full control of the Strait of Hormuz and impose its own “Guardian Angel” toll system after repeatedly warning Iran not to charge fe…

nypost.com

Iranian negotiators stormed out of the high-level peace talks with the US in Switzerland on Sunday after a frustrated President Trump unleashed his fury on the regime — threatening to seize the Strait of Hormuz and “blow the s–t out of them.”

The talks were abandoned after just 80 minutes when the discussions entered a “difficult phase” following “an insulting message by the US president,” Iran’s state news agency reported.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Meantime, the Trump Administration indicates it has no idea how to negotiate. I feel bad for any of the professional wonks actually doing the grunt work here, and then having Trump or Vance do / say something that just made their last 48 hours of sleepless effort completely and utterly worthless.

The Trump Admin is so desperate to say that the US is coming out on top of this that VP Vance was bragging about agreements that weren't remotely finalized, such as inspection and buying American meat and crops with unfrozen funds (seriously!?!) and of course, that provides Iran some strength in negotiations. When Trump and Vance play poker, do they tell their opponents what they have... or do they just hold their cards facing outwards?!

Iranian officials said they have no plans to allow international inspections of their country’s damaged nuclear facilities, just a day after Vice President JD Vance said Iran had agreed to allow such inspections, which would restore a safeguard from President Barack Obama’s deal with Tehran that President Donald Trump threw out.
...
Baquaei also said Iran would be free to use unfrozen assets or revenue from oil sales as it sees fit, after Vance said that such funds, if unfrozen, would be subject to oversight and could benefit American farmers. “The important point is that Iran’s previously blocked assets are now available and can be used freely by Iran in accordance with its own priorities,” Baqaei said, according to Iranian state media.

The US is giving Iran so much and we aren't getting anything of value for it, definitely nothing Trump didn't freely give away in 2018. Nothing on Hamas, nothing on Hezbollah, nothing on the Houthis. Widening the security gap in the Middle East.

The US would be hard pressed to have negotiated a worse deal for US and Israel interests, without actively trying to do so.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

View attachment 54569

Huh? You have this backwards.

It's The Felon offering --->a ceasefire with Israel<---- while Hezbollah says "not interested".

One of the conditions was for Israel to withdraw from Lebanon, which it has still failed to do.

Yeah. But that's not Israel saying no to a deal between the US and Iran, that's Israel saying no to the US trying to force a deal on Israel.

Your two posts contradict each other.

No contradiction.

The Felon is offering something (ceasefire in Lebanon) that he is not in a position to offer.

Israel isn't saying there can't be a ceasefire between the US and Iran. Israel is saying that Hezbollah has already rejected the idea of a ceasefire in Lebanon, they won't stop shooting that those who are shooting at it.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Trump is going to need a giant excavator to lay the bar any lower than he is at the moment.

With Trump, I never assume we've found the bottom. Considering "We should militarily protect Iran's interests" is just a button press away on the elevator.

"Bottom" implies a concept of up and down. I don't think he has that.

 

[Tigers!]

How about a few hundred words saying this is what needs to be done to stop Hamas doing another Oct 7th?

Do you really think you could stop another October 7th? It was done with small arms and motorcycles. It could easily be repeated.

So Israel just has to put up with the possibility of such attacks forever?

What's your alternative?

Their grip on Gaza has been seriously comprised. Continue that pressure. Rebuild Gaza. Prevent any Hamas or sympathisers from gaining control or money.
Remove Hamas' safe havens in Qatar etc.
Find those who truly care about their people. Destroy the tunnels.
Much to do and it will not be easy or cheap.
But we can not maintain the status quo.

See Gospel's post 2879. It is very good.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

So you want genocide? Because that's what you get if you support the Palestinian cause but aren't after peaceful coexistence.

We didn't have peaceful coexistence with the USSR, but neither side was a victim of genocide. So, your conclusion seems a bit farfetched, unless you are fearful that Israel who clearly have the means to engage in genocide will be the one to be successful.

Russia had no interest in genocide, and also they knew they would also be destroyed in war.

But Iran is acting through Hamas and Hezbollah. That provides a firebreak, things will not spiral out of control. Thus there's no danger to Iran in supporting genocide.

I think recent events rebut your conclusion.

Iran attacked directly, bypassing their own firebreak.

 

[laughing dog]

So you want genocide? Because that's what you get if you support the Palestinian cause but aren't after peaceful coexistence.

We didn't have peaceful coexistence with the USSR, but neither side was a victim of genocide. So, your conclusion seems a bit farfetched, unless you are fearful that Israel who clearly have the means to engage in genocide will be the one to be successful.

Russia had no interest in genocide, and also they knew they would also be destroyed in war.

But Iran is acting through Hamas and Hezbollah. That provides a firebreak, things will not spiral out of control. Thus there's no danger to Iran in supporting genocide.

I think recent events rebut your conclusion.

Iran attacked directly, bypassing their own firebreak.

Israel and the US attacked on Feb 28, then Iran retaliated. Get your facts straight.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Iran attacked directly, bypassing their own firebreak.

Israel and the US attacked on Feb 28, then Iran retaliated. Get your facts straight.

Iran was already attacking Israel directly.

 

[robnisch]

MSN

Only one more month of oil reserve!!

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Testicles of protesting GOP members over Iran War powers shrivel and fall off. Ovary-ladened GOP members protesting Iran War powers remain intact.
link

GOP Sens. Rand Paul and Bill Cassidy, who had previously voted to rein in the president's war powers on Iran, changed their votes this; Paul voted present and Cassidy voted against advancing the resolution. GOP Sens. Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski once again voted for the resolution, while Democratic Sen. John Fetterman again voted against it. The final tally was 47-50-1.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The problem is you are proposing a fantasy solution.

The problem here is that this isn't my proposal, it's Israel's. I've explained that repeatedly, yet you keep arguing with me as though I personally drafted the policy. At some point, you're going to have to force that through your remarkably thick skull: I'm describing Israel's stated position, not presenting my own peace plan for your approval. Not a single living creature on earth is seeking your approval on anything.

I don't think Israel at any point since the 7/10 attacks have entertained the idea of Gazan self rule. I think that attack permanently removed that option from the table. So in Israeli parlance, removing Hamas, means Israel taking over.

Israel have tried their damndest to find a Muslim country they can give Gaza to. But they all keep saying no. Muslims are often also sick and tired of Muslim extremism. Which is a thing.

Seeing the Trump Administration appears to be ignoring Israeli security concerns as they relate to the Iranian Agreement, this is off-topic.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Seeing the Trump Administration appears to be ignoring Israeli security concerns as they relate to the Iranian Agreement, this is off-topic.

No, bringing up Trump concerning a conflict going on since he was born is off topic.
Tom

In a thread about the Trump/Netanyahu War with Iran, particularly as it concerns the Strait of Hormuz which hasn't been closed since before Trump was born?

Also, when do you think Trump was born?

 

[TomC]

Seeing the Trump Administration appears to be ignoring Israeli security concerns as they relate to the Iranian Agreement, this is off-topic.

No, bringing up Trump concerning a conflict going on since he was born is off topic.
Tom

In a thread about the Trump/Netanyahu War with Iran, particularly as it concerns the Strait of Hormuz which hasn't been closed since before Trump was born?

Also, when do you think Trump was born?

In the predictable derail about the Gaza/Israel thing. Which is what I was referring to and responding to.
I don't know how old he is exactly, but in the 50s. After the attempt at ethnic cleansing of 1948 commited by Israel's Muslim neighbors.
Tom

 

[laughing dog]

Seeing the Trump Administration appears to be ignoring Israeli security concerns as they relate to the Iranian Agreement, this is off-topic.

No, bringing up Trump concerning a conflict going on since he was born is off topic.
Tom

In a thread about the Trump/Netanyahu War with Iran, particularly as it concerns the Strait of Hormuz which hasn't been closed since before Trump was born?

Also, when do you think Trump was born?

In the predictable derail about the Gaza/Israel thing. Which is what I was referring to and responding to.
I don't know how old he is exactly, but in the 50s. After the attempt at ethnic cleansing of 1948 commited by Israel's Muslim neighbors.
Tom

Trump’s 8Oth birthday was this 11 days ago. He is older than the current state of Israel.

 

[TomC]

Trump’s 8Oth birthday was this 11 days ago. He is older than the current state of Israel.

Oh. That's so interesting and important to the topic at hand.
Tom

 

[laughing dog]

Trump’s 8Oth birthday was this 11 days ago. He is older than the current state of Israel.

Oh. That's so interesting and important to the topic at hand.
Tom

It should be for the arithmetic impaired - it means Trump was born before the 1950s in 1948.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Seeing the Trump Administration appears to be ignoring Israeli security concerns as they relate to the Iranian Agreement, this is off-topic.

No, bringing up Trump concerning a conflict going on since he was born is off topic.
Tom

In a thread about the Trump/Netanyahu War with Iran, particularly as it concerns the Strait of Hormuz which hasn't been closed since before Trump was born?

Also, when do you think Trump was born?

In the predictable derail about the Gaza/Israel thing. Which is what I was referring to and responding to.

But the Trump Admin didn't seem to think Gaza/Hamas was important enough to include in the Memo of Understanding when the Trump Admin allowed Iran to add Lebanon security (to protect Hezbollah). So it isn't on-topic. Just Trump's quasi-abandonment of Israel in this abhorrent agreement (or "understanding").

I don't know how old he is exactly, but in the 50s. After the attempt at ethnic cleansing of 1948 commited by Israel's Muslim neighbors.

He was born in '46. He pre-dates Israel. It isn't important to the thread or Israel or Trump screwing over Israel (which would be on-topic), but you brought it up his birth.

 

[TomC]

Trump’s 8Oth birthday was this 11 days ago. He is older than the current state of Israel.

Oh. That's so interesting and important to the topic at hand.
Tom

It should be for the arithmetic impaired - it means Trump was born before the 1950s in 1948.

The problem you're having is that you are mistaking me for someone who gives a shit about Trump's details.
Trump was an infant at the time. Probably less interested in the human situation than it* is now. It's still unimportant to the history between the Zionists and the Muslim neighbors who have been attacking them for a few generations.
Tom

*Yeah, I'm deliberately using "it" to be insulting

 

[laughing dog]

Trump’s 8Oth birthday was this 11 days ago. He is older than the current state of Israel.

Oh. That's so interesting and important to the topic at hand.
Tom

It should be for the arithmetic impaired - it means Trump was born before the 1950s in 1948.

The problem you're having is that you are mistaking me for someone who gives a shit about Trump's details.
Trump was an infant at the time. Probably less interested in the human situation than it* is now. It's still unimportant to the history between the Zionists and the Muslim neighbors who have been attacking them for a few generations.
Tom

*Yeah, I'm deliberately using "it" to be insulting

Yet, you found Trump’s age important enough to bring it up. Trust me, I would never mistake you for anyone who cares to know the facts.

 

[Colonel Sanders]

Anyway...

Trump's polling numbers are down to around 31% due to inflation and the Iran fiasco. They're his lowest approval numbers ever. This is vital because his numbers sank to as low as 34% in his first term.

Thank Jebus that made a big difference in him getting reelected.