Freddie Gray dies a week after being injured during arrest

[Tom Sawyer]

As with the fall off the building. There is no evidence of a fall, but like the surgery, it must have happened because no evidence = probable event. Impeccable logic says so.

Well, it's not probable, but it can't be completely 100% discounted, so therefore we need to give it equal likelihood to any other possible explanation such as police brutality or his being wounded in a zombie invasion.

 

[Horatio Parker]

I haven't seem any mention of the "rough ride" or "nickel ride".

When I was a teenager back in Flint, MI, I knew guys who said they were cuffed with their hands behind their backs and put in the back of the squad car. Then the cops would stop suddenly, "for a dog". No way could you escape bashing your face into the partition. So I would guess this is a venerable police tradition.

From the NY Times:

In Baltimore, they call it a “rough ride.” In Philadelphia, they had another name for it that hints at the age of the practice — a “nickel ride,” a reference to old-time amusement park rides that cost five cents. Other cities called them joy rides.

The slang terms mask a dark tradition of police misconduct in which suspects, seated or lying face down and in handcuffs in the back of a police wagon, are jolted and battered by an intentionally rough and bumpy ride that can do as much damage as a police baton without an officer having to administer a blow.

The exact cause of the spinal injury that Freddie Gray, 25, sustained while in police custody in Baltimor before his death April 19 has not been made clear. The police have said that he was not strapped into a seatbelt, a violation of department policy. That has led some to wonder whether he was deliberately left unbuckled, reminiscent of a practice that while little known has left a brutal, costly legacy of severe injuries and multimillion-dollar settlements throughout the country.

 

[Derec]

Now the word is that the autopsy shows that Grey's injury matches a particular bolt. Maybe he had sex with Jeremy Piven back there?

In any case it gets curiouser and curiouser. Like for example, what happened during that second, undisclosed stop?

 

[Rhea]

It is now being reported that the police investigation confirms that Freddie Gray died due to injuries he received while inside the van - specifically from his head being slammed into a bolt inside the van.

Just for clarity, I'm not seeing the bolt listed as "cause" of the fatal injury, but rather as an additional injury that places definite trauma occurring inside the van. Not a killing blow, but a clue to how and where the killing blow may have happened.

 

[Rhea]

Also, that inhaler - I wonder if that was an early symptom of his injuries? From everything I'm reading, I'm not sure it presents convincing evidence that _all_ of the damage happened in a rough ride in the van.

The pictures of him being dragged to the van, and also asking for an inhaler - first injury?
Broken vocal box - second injury and inflicted by hand?
The bolt injury to the head - third injury and worst damage to previous injuries?

It does not appear to tie up in a neat package. Instead it looks messy, brutal and ongoing. And sick.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Now the word is that the autopsy shows that Grey's injury matches a particular bolt. Maybe he had sex with Jeremy Piven back there?

Aren't deaths from police abuse great openers for comedy?

In any case it gets curiouser and curiouser. Like for example, what happened during that second, undisclosed stop?

What is getting curiouser is how people continue to pull a Frank Dreben here, or are saying "we need to wait to see", when the evidence keeps pointing to him dying needlessly.

 

[Rhea]

I keep reading some of these update links and looking at the comments section. The amount of hate and bile and dehumanizing is getting to me. I just can't imagine having so much blanket hate that one starts to think the people "deserve" to have their windpipes crushed before a trial. Holy shit. it's just... unbelievable. I can't wrap my brain around it, let alone my heart.

These people are commenting that someone who has been arrested for marijuana in the past DESERVES TO DIE. That someone who sees a cop and says, "shit, I'm outa here, this never ends well," DESERVES TO DIE. And not just die, but die alone, locked in a car, gasping for breath, trying to bang on the wall for help. Because he saw police and didn't want to talk to them.

And they call him animal, they say he DESERVES TO DIE for this.

I'm just so sad. So very disturbed and sad. That kind of hate is horrible.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Death ruled a Homicide

Yup. Time to shift from 'he died from a weak neck based on heavy lead paint chips landing on his as a child' to 'the officers are being railroaded'.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Death ruled a Homicide

Yup. Time to shift from 'he died from a weak neck based on heavy lead paint chips landing on his as a child' to 'the officers are being railroaded'.

Just because it's a homicide doesn't mean that it wasn't a justifiable homicide. Leg irons are heavy, so if he'd kicked the officers while wearing them, they could have died. Therefore, they were just standing their ground.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

Death ruled a Homicide

Yup. Time to shift from 'he died from a weak neck based on heavy lead paint chips landing on his as a child' to 'the officers are being railroaded'.

Just because it's a homicide doesn't mean that it wasn't a justifiable homicide. Leg irons are heavy, so if he'd kicked the officers while wearing them, they could have died. Therefore, they were just standing their ground.

And I understand body armor does not protect against kicks.

 

[ksen]

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/05/0...tentID=33601816&pgtype=article&_r=0&referrer=

 

[ksen]

I didn't notice any charges against Freddy's spinal surgeon.

 

[Derec]

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/05/0...tentID=33601816&pgtype=article&_r=0&referrer=

The question is, does the prosecutor really have probable cause against all six (and incredibly 2nd degree murder - which requires intent to kill - against one) or are the six merely sacrificial lambs to appease the thugs and rioters?

 

[Tom Sawyer]

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/05/0...tentID=33601816&pgtype=article&_r=0&referrer=

The question is, does the prosecutor really have probable cause against all six (and incredibly 2nd degree murder - which requires intent to kill - against one) or are the six merely sacrificial lambs to appease the thugs and rioters?

Well, if one of them did it and the other five were aware of what he was doing (ie - driving him around so he was banged around in the back, et al), then there's probable cause against all of them.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/05/0...tentID=33601816&pgtype=article&_r=0&referrer=

The question is, does the prosecutor really have probable cause against all six (and incredibly 2nd degree murder - which requires intent to kill - against one) or are the six merely sacrificial lambs to appease the thugs and rioters?

From Wikipedia:
Depraved-heart murder, also known as depraved-indifference murder, is an American legal term for an action that demonstrates a "callous disregard for human life" and results in death. In most states, depraved-heart killings constitute second-degree murder.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

More info:

The most severe charges are leveled against Officer Caesar R. Goodson, Jr., identified as the driver of the van that transported Gray to a police station. He is charged with second degree depraved heart murder, which carries a maximum penalty of 30 years in prison.

The investigation by the prosecutor's office found there had been no reason to detain Gray — and that his arrest was in itself illegal, Mosby said. She said that the knife that police officers had found on Gray turned out to be legal.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

The question is, does the prosecutor really have probable cause against all six (and incredibly 2nd degree murder - which requires intent to kill - against one) or are the six merely sacrificial lambs to appease the thugs and rioters?

From Wikipedia:
Depraved-heart murder, also known as depraved-indifference murder, is an American legal term for an action that demonstrates a "callous disregard for human life" and results in death. In most states, depraved-heart killings constitute second-degree murder.

Ya, if it's a killing caused by dangerous conduct and the offender's obvious lack of concern for human life, then it's second degree murder. You don't need an intent to kill. If they did one of these nickel rides and Grey died as a result, that's dangerous conduct which showed an obvious lack of concern for his life and it fits quite well.

 

[Derec]

Well, if one of them did it and the other five were aware of what he was doing (ie - driving him around so he was banged around in the back, et al), then there's probable cause against all of them.

Still, where is intent? She charged one with second degree murder which requires intent. If she has no evidence that there was intent to kill this is prosecutorial misconduct - bringing charges she knows are groundless.
She also alleged that the arrest itself was illegal even though running from police constitutes probable cause.

 

[Derec]

From Wikipedia:
Depraved-heart murder, also known as depraved-indifference murder, is an American legal term for an action that demonstrates a "callous disregard for human life" and results in death. In most states, depraved-heart killings constitute second-degree murder.

Ya, if it's a killing caused by dangerous conduct and the offender's obvious lack of concern for human life, then it's second degree murder. You don't need an intent to kill. If they did one of these nickel rides and Grey died as a result, that's dangerous conduct which showed an obvious lack of concern for his life and it fits quite well.

Second degree murder, covered under Maryland Criminal Code § 2-204, makes it illegal to commit any murder, even if it was not premeditated, willful, or deliberate. The distinction between second degree murder and manslaughter is in the intent. Therefore, a second degree murder must be intentional.

From here.
Yet another case where racial politics trumps the rule of law I guess. Kinda like charging Z with second degree murder against Trayvon, which was widely criticized as overreach.

 

[dismal]

The question is, does the prosecutor really have probable cause against all six (and incredibly 2nd degree murder - which requires intent to kill - against one) or are the six merely sacrificial lambs to appease the thugs and rioters?

Well, if one of them did it and the other five were aware of what he was doing (ie - driving him around so he was banged around in the back, et al), then there's probable cause against all of them.

Correct answer appears to be only one is charged with murder.

Presumably this will be van driver.

Still seems like a tough case as I'm not sure how you'd drive a van to get someone sitting on bench to hit his head with lethal force on a bolt on the back door. I guess we'll have to wait and see what evidence they have.