• Welcome to the Internet Infidels Discussion Board.

Noah’s Ark Found!!

 
 
 
Bronzeage said:
Elixir said:
Bronzeage said:
Elixir said:
Bronzeage said:
to raise the water level by 10(choose any unit, meters, feet, etc), the volume will increase by a factor of 1000.
Click to expand...
That would be applicable to sea levels
if all the water was at the same depth in a static container. Neither is the case.
Click to expand...
Are you saying the volume of a sphere is not related to the cube of the radius?
Click to expand...
No, I’m saying that depending on levels, the amount of water needed ro raise sea levels is variable due to terrain. Different amounts of water on the earth’s surface are displaced by solid matter at different levels. Once it’s ALL submerged, subsequent increases should follow the formula (discounting tidal bulges, flattened poles etc)
Click to expand...
As I said in the original post, "The Earth is a sphere, more or less". Whatever correction factors which would be needed to get a more precise answer to a hypothetical question, it would still be a lot more water than "not really a lot more water".
Click to expand...
I’ve heard so many different and bizarre explanations. One was that there were no deep oceans prior to Noah. The continents were all together and drifted apart in merely forty days creating these enormous caverns that filled with the water. The absurdity of continents moving apart in only 40 days (or whatever) is lost on them. Of course that happened in 2012. Bottom line is that these fundies use whatever bullshit rationale that they can think of to explain the patently absurd. They’ve abandoned scientific reasoning.

Sadly, so many are following these shit for brains down an anti-enlightenment path. Many of them are blatantly opposing the enlightenment and critical of it - despite it being the foundation of our modern society. I can only quote Voltaire: “"Certainement qui est en droit de vous rendre absurde est en droit de vous rendre injuste.”

Or as is more modernly stated: “Those who can make you believe in absurdities can make you commit atrocities.”

I truly fear we are heading into a new dark ages.
 
Last edited:
SLD said:
I truly fear we are heading into a new dark ages.
Tonto said:
What you mean,”we”, white man?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
I don’t expect to live to see the dystopian outcome I anticipate. Putting it mildly, the next 50 or more years are going to be less comfortable for “average Americans” than the last 50 have been.
 
Elixir said:
SLD said:
I truly fear we are heading into a new dark ages.
Tonto said:
What you mean,”we”, white man?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
I don’t expect to live to see the dystopian outcome I anticipate. Putting it mildly, the next 50 or more years are going to be less comfortable for “average Americans” than the last 50 have been.
Click to expand...
Reading a good book on this subject. End Times: Elites, Counter-Elites, and the Path of Political Disintegration https://a.co/d/07V6CHjp

It’s a good analysis of the rise and fall of societies over long periods and the factors that impact them. It’s hard to argue that indeed share some commonalities with other societies that have gone through such declines. But as he points out, there are exceptions to the rule and it doesn’t always happen. So there is hope. And of course, out of such declines come rejuvenations.
 
SLD said:
Elixir said:
SLD said:
I truly fear we are heading into a new dark ages.
Tonto said:
What you mean,”we”, white man?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
I don’t expect to live to see the dystopian outcome I anticipate. Putting it mildly, the next 50 or more years are going to be less comfortable for “average Americans” than the last 50 have been.
Click to expand...
Reading a good book on this subject. End Times: Elites, Counter-Elites, and the Path of Political Disintegration https://a.co/d/07V6CHjp

It’s a good analysis of the rise and fall of societies over long periods and the factors that impact them. It’s hard to argue that indeed share some commonalities with other societies that have gone through such declines. But as he points out, there are exceptions to the rule and it doesn’t always happen. So there is hope. And of course, out of such declines come rejuvenations.
Click to expand...
That sounds similar to the book Collapse, which I read many years ago. It is mainly about how humans have a long history of destroying their own habitats if I remember correctly. Apparently he did a revised edition.

https://www.amazon.com/Collapse-Societies-Choose-Succeed-Revised-

In Jared Diamond’s follow-up to the Pulitzer-Prize winning Guns, Germs and Steel, the author explores how climate change, the population explosion and political discord create the conditions for the collapse of civilization

Environmental damage, climate change, globalization, rapid population growth, and unwise political choices were all factors in the demise of societies around the world, but some found solutions and persisted. As in Guns, Germs, and Steel, Diamond traces the fundamental pattern of catastrophe, and weaves an all-encompassing global thesis through a series of fascinating historical-cultural narratives.
Click to expand...
 
  • Like
Reactions: SLD
SLD said:
Bronzeage said:
Elixir said:
Bronzeage said:
Elixir said:
Bronzeage said:
to raise the water level by 10(choose any unit, meters, feet, etc), the volume will increase by a factor of 1000.
Click to expand...
That would be applicable to sea levels
if all the water was at the same depth in a static container. Neither is the case.
Click to expand...
Are you saying the volume of a sphere is not related to the cube of the radius?
Click to expand...
No, I’m saying that depending on levels, the amount of water needed ro raise sea levels is variable due to terrain. Different amounts of water on the earth’s surface are displaced by solid matter at different levels. Once it’s ALL submerged, subsequent increases should follow the formula (discounting tidal bulges, flattened poles etc)
Click to expand...
As I said in the original post, "The Earth is a sphere, more or less". Whatever correction factors which would be needed to get a more precise answer to a hypothetical question, it would still be a lot more water than "not really a lot more water".
Click to expand...
I’ve heard so many different and bizarre explanations. One was that there were no deep oceans prior to Noah. The continents were all together and drifted apart in merely forty days creating these enormous caverns that filled with the water. The absurdity of continents moving apart in only 40 days (or whatever) is lost on them. Of course that happened in 2012. Bottom line is that these fundies use whatever bullshit rationale that they can think of to explain the patently absurd. They’ve abandoned scientific reasoning.

Sadly, so many are following these shit for brains down an anti-enlightenment path. Many of them are blatantly opposing the enlightenment and critical of it - despite it being the foundation of our modern society. I can only quote Voltaire: “"Certainement qui est en droit de vous rendre absurde est en droit de vous rendre injuste.”

Or as is more modernly stated: “Those who can make you believe in absurdities can make you commit atrocities.”

I truly fear we are heading into a new dark ages.
Click to expand...
If we go back to the Antediluvian internet, there was BBS discussion groups and a lot of were just like this place, but with less color on the monitor. One of my favorites was Alt.history. It was fun to discuss and spin historical counterfactuals such as What if the Luftwaffe had jet fighters for the Battle of Britain? It's a fair question, but it had to be based on realistic premises.

The one premise which earned instant ridicule was the ASB plotline, in which alien space bats appear and provide some element of the scenario, The entire story of Noah and the Ark are entirely plausible if one concedes that the natural laws we observe today have not always been so consistent. One reliable trait of any kind of fanatic is their belief that they know more than they actually do. Just as 911 Truthers will never understand why the Twin Towers collapsed because they do not understand why they could stand in the first place. The Floodies want to use geology in their argument, but don't understand it well enough to realize they've just invoked the power of alien space bats.
 
pood said:
Learner said:
God then said he will reduce the age of man to down to 120 years in Genesis 6:3

Anyway since AI is the thing and quite useful. What are people in the modern world suggesting?

There is no consensus on a fixed maximum human lifespan, with estimates ranging from 115 to 150 years based on current biological limits, while theoretical models suggest ages up to 1,000 years if aging is medically cured.
🙄

The verified oldest person in history was Jeanne Calment, who lived to 122 years and 164 days. Current scientific debate centers on whether this represents a hard biological cap or simply a statistical plateau due to limited supercentenarian data.

Biological Limit Estimates: Recent studies using computer models and resilience metrics suggest a natural hard limit between 120 and 150 years, as the body loses the ability to recover from physiological stressors.


Demographic Predictions: Statistical models from the University of Washington estimate a 99% probability that someone will reach 124 years and a 13% probability of reaching 130 years by 2100.


Contrasting Views: Some researchers argue there is no fixed upper limit, citing late-life mortality plateaus in data, while others maintain a cap around 115–125 years due to intrinsic bodily decay.


I think this is the one shown below for pood to poo poo.

Theoretical Potential: Geneticists propose that if cellular aging were "cured," average human lifespan could exceed 1,000 years, with maximum lifespans potentially reaching 20,000 years.

Didn't God of the bible reduce the life span of humans? Calm down, please note: the above is not my argument.. however... non of the above is from the religious perspective of the bible.
Click to expand...

And what does any of this have to do with your mythical Noah and his myhthical flood?
Click to expand...
You could have asked oor forum friend , Ideologyhunter that too who brought up the age of Noah. But you must admit...what I posted was interesting, no? Looks like we have believers of another kind who don't happen to be religious but think plausible that life expectancy could exceed a 1,000.years.😛

(I hope you can understand what I've posted above. I took a little more time)

But my word... this thread has been busy.
 
If all humans died except Noah and company 3000-4000 years ago it is hard to explain how all the different civilizations and cultures arise so quickly with all the genetic diversity.

I watched a show on genetics that traced modern humans back in time and how they spread.

Native Americans have their own creation myths. Generics says otherwise.

AI Overview

Native Americans genetically trace back to ancestral populations in northeast Asia and Siberia, having crossed into the Americas via the Bering land bridge (Beringia) during the last Ice Age
Click to expand...


Nah, it couldn't be possible ancient writers exaggerated by saying somebody lived 100s of years.
 
Learner said:
pood said:
Learner said:
But you must admit...what I posted was interesting, no?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

No. And what are the cites for any of these claims?
Learner said:
pood said:
Learner said:
Looks like we have believers of another kind who don't happen to be religious but think plausible that life expectancy could exceed a 1,000.years.😛
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Cite?
Learner said:
(I hope you can understand what I've posted above. I took a little more time)

But my word... this thread has been busy
Click to expand...

Where did all the water come from for your flood? Where did it all go?

Do you believe, as the ancients did, that there is a solid firmament encircling the earth with a shit ton of water above it, and that Goddie, when he got pissed off at humans, opened trap doors in the firmament to flood the earth? If this is how things supposedly are, why have our astronauts never encountered this solid firmament or any water above it?

I invite you to answer those questions and stop the digresssion about potential human life span. Because even it were true that scientifically it is possible to indefinitely extend human life span (cites still needed) such science certainly was not available in the time of Noah.
 
Ovazor said:
Learner said:
Ovazor said:
No, the process cannot be anything even close the similar. Remember, you are claiming that three earth ocean's worth of water was added in a matter of days.
Click to expand...
Water added? A trivial amount in relation to the much larger part? The oceans were much much lower. There are many built structures worldwide undersea across the world. A lot more water would be added than your much smaller amount anyway.
Click to expand...

Three times the current each oceans is not trivial. And it cannot appear and disappear without leaving any trace.
Click to expand...
The oceans on the earth is merely a thin layer in contrast to the mass of the earth. It is quite easy to picture mentally and differentiate the size proportions between the two.

Ovazor said:
Learner said:
Now if you didn't get the "spatial" perspective(.that word again) that the earth is many times the volume mass of the oceans. In answer to the the missing volume of water that would have total the global flood.. .the by the gargantuan size comparison should be able to absorb / drink that missing volume of water.
Click to expand...
The fact that the globe on your desk is hollow does not mean the planet is.
Click to expand...
I'm hoping you are also thinking that the earth is not a solid cue-ball either.

Anyway... this was a recent publication which I took an excerpt from on this site. The claim has been about for over a decade.

"..Scientists have found a massive reservoir of water buried about 700 kilometers below Earth’s surface, and it could hold three times as much water as all the oceans combined..."

https://www.futura-sciences.com/en/...e-scientists-stunned-by-new-discovery_900241/


* I took another who excerpt from another site. Jacobsen is one of these scientists.

"Jacobsen explained that this cycle shows Earth has a water system far bigger than what we see in clouds, rivers, and seas. It also helps explain why liquid water has lasted for billions of years, supporting life while planets like Mars or the Moon lost theirs long ago."

https://dailygalaxy.com/2026/05/vast-ocean-found-700km-under-earth-surface/


Scientists who published papers on the ringwoodite underground ocean include
Steve Jacobsen (Northwestern University), Brandon Schmandt (University of New Mexico), and Graham Pearson (University of Alberta).

Steve Jacobsen and Brandon Schmandt published findings in the journal Science (2014), using seismic data and lab experiments to identify the water reservoir in the mantle transition zone.

Graham Pearson and his team published in the journal Nature (2014), providing the first physical proof by analyzing a diamond inclusion containing hydrous ringwoodite.

Alfred (Ted) Ringwood, the Australian earth scientist after whom the mineral is named, laid the foundational theoretical groundwork for high-pressure mantle phase transitions.


* Despite the above. My point s simply: the earth can easily drink a very large volume of water because the earth is many times bigger in volume.

Also asking where that missing volume of water came from (as if the level of the sea was always as it is).... is faulty thinking...

...that missing volume of water would have come from the very same source -because the larger existing volume of water covering a whole 71,% of the earth is the remainder volume..hinting the (obliviously) obvious!
 
Last edited:
Learner said:
Looks like we have believers of another kind who don't happen to be religious but think plausible that life expectancy could exceed a 1,000.years.
Click to expand...
It is absurd to claim that anyone in the pre-Industrial era lived for a thousand years. It is not equally absurd to imagine that, through technological advances, people might in the future live indefinitely extended lives.

The difference is one of mechanism. It is absurd to claim that people in 200AD could travel from Londinum to Rome in three hours; It was routine for people in 2000AD to travel from London to Rome in less than three hours, simply because by 2000AD we had jet airliners.

Envisioning the extension of existing knowledge and technology is reasonable. Envisioning miracles for which no reliable evidence exists, entailing a dramatic change in reality whose sole motive for the imagining is to attempt to align reality with an old text, is not reasonable.

Your equivocation on the meaning of "believer" is stupid and ridiculous. Declaring that a fictional event (for which the only possible mechanism is an unevidenced change in the very fabric of reality, ie a "miracle") actually occured in the past is believing an absurdity. Declaring that a fictional but not physically impossible event might potentially occur in the future is a completely different category of belief. It is not unreasonable to imagine that you might be able to pick the winner of this years Melbourne Cup; It is unreasonable to imagine that you actually picked the winner of last years Cup, when you had your money on Buckaroo* to win.









* Buckaroo finished 24th in a field of 24 competitors
 
I thought it was an act of anger.

God was pissed off the way humans he creat3e were going, so he hit the reset button.

Choosing a drunk who lies around naked.

AI Overview

According to the Bible (Genesis 6), God sent the great flood to cleanse the earth because widespread human corruption, lawlessness, and extreme violence had filled the world, and every inclination of people's hearts was only evil all the time.
Click to expand...


The Biblical Account

• The Event: According to Genesis 9:20–21, after the flood, Noah farmed the land and planted a vineyard. He drank wine from the vineyard, became drunk, and lay uncovered inside his tent
Click to expand...


How are you going to farm land tat has been under water for a year?

Also, if the water rose above the highest mountain like Everest, it would be pretty thin on oxygen.
 
steve_bank said:
Also, if the water rose above the highest mountain like Everest, it would be pretty thin on oxygen.
Click to expand...
Nope; The pressure of the atmosphere (and therefore partial pressure of oxygen) at sea level would barely change as sea level rose, because the rising water would push the air up with it.

The amount of atmosphere above a given point at sea level (and hence sea level atmospheric pressure) is proportional to the surface area of the planet, which is proportional to the square of its radius.

If the planet's sea level radius increases from 6,371km to 6,380km because you magically add a 9km depth of water, so as to cover Everest, the proportional increase in surface area (and therefore reduction in atmospheric pressure) is about 0.28%, which is barely noticable - it's equvalent to climbing less than 24 metres above the original sea level.
 
Last edited:
steve_bank said:
I thought it was an act of anger.

God was pissed off the way humans he creat3e were going, so he hit the reset button.

Choosing a drunk who lies around naked.

AI Overview

According to the Bible (Genesis 6), God sent the great flood to cleanse the earth because widespread human corruption, lawlessness, and extreme violence had filled the world, and every inclination of people's hearts was only evil all the time.
Click to expand...


The Biblical Account

• The Event: According to Genesis 9:20–21, after the flood, Noah farmed the land and planted a vineyard. He drank wine from the vineyard, became drunk, and lay uncovered inside his tent
Click to expand...


How are you going to farm land tat has been under water for a year?

Also, if the water rose above the highest mountain like Everest, it would be pretty thin on oxygen.
Click to expand...

Does the God of Love act in a fit of anger? Then, upon acting in anger, regret the act?
 
The idea of the bible god of wrath as a god of love that includes all appears to be a modern invention.

Jesus as the first Hippy.

Yahweh evolved over time.

Yaweh is classified as a storm god. One of many.

Yahweh, the God of the Hebrew Bible, exhibits strong characteristics of an ancient Near Eastern warrior and storm god in his earliest literary layers, though scholars debate his exact pre-Israelite origins

Theophanies of Storms: The oldest poetic passages in the Bible (such as the Song of Deborah in Judges 5 and various Psalms) describe Yahweh marching from the southern/edemite regions (Seir, Edom, Sinai) accompanied by thunder, lightning, earthquake, and torrential rain


Divine Warrior: He is frequently portrayed as a fierce divine warrior leading troops or fighting cosmic forces, much like regional deities of the ancient Levant

Absorption of Storm Motifs: As the cult of Yahweh grew in the Iron Age, many traditional Northwest Semitic storm-god motifs—such as riding on clouds, wielding lightning as weapons, and subduing the chaotic sea monster (Leviathan/Yamm)—were integrated into his description, mirroring traits previously associated with Baal
Click to expand...

en.wikipedia.org

Weather god - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
southernhybrid said:
Learner said:
Ovazor said:
No. Materials have certain properties, and no matter who does the design, one cannot make the structure stronger than the materials allow.
Click to expand...
That's funny, I agree with the above and say the same thing. We may disagree with where the limits lay.
Ovazor said:
Unless you want to go all the way of "it was a miracle" - in which case you could as well claim that the ark was made of folded newspapers and miraculously stayed together and afloat.
Click to expand...
This is very much the same argument error as the previous above, : "We could as well have claimed the ark was made of folded paper.etc.." , would only be seen that way to you, and since that line is a nonexistent theist claim, then obviously ...theists don't use your example to analogously demonstrate the ark argument the way you do, or think it can.
Click to expand...
Are you a Biblical literalist Learner? Hopefully not as it always amazes me when anyone still believes the old myths in the Bible, especially the insane stories in the OT to be literal.
Click to expand...
Yes I am...but the bible isn't all literal. Thall shalt not commit murder etc, I.e. the commandments, to feed the poor and hungry, to love your neighbour...and your enemy is literal.

southernhybrid said:
The ark is one of the craziest ones. The dimensions are written in the Bible and there is now way it could hold all animal life, the food needed to feed them for 40 days or the waste matter they would excrete. There were a lot of floods way back in ancient times. Other religious mythology is full of similar stories and symbols that are in the Bible, but anyone with a reasonable mind has to realize these things are all allegories at best, or myths etc.
Click to expand...
I'll comment more on this with the other posts which I'm sure would also apply to the above.

southernhybrid said:
Plus, how do Biblical literalists justify all the cruelty demonstrated by Bible god, one of the worst monsters ever created? Doesn't all that hate and killing including the Noah's Ark story, help people realize that this god was obviously created by men to resemble men?
Click to expand...
It would be interesting to hear if you ask this from the Jewish believers too, and what their response would be.

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom