12-14-2012 Never Forget

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The day I realized that gun control would never be reasonable in the US.

 

[James Brown]

 

[Underseer]

Those children died so that conservative men could feel better about having small penises. That's OK, those children were already-born, so their lives were meaningless anyway.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Those children died so that conservative men could feel better about having small penises. That's OK, those children were already-born, so their lives were meaningless anyway.

And let us not confuse the conversation here. This isn't merely about the murder of so many young children. This is also about the NRA and the gun owners that came out immediately after the shooting cautioning Americans not to get too excited and that the rights of people to own guns should not also become a victim. The response was almost as depressing as it was immediate.

 

[Underseer]

Those children died so that conservative men could feel better about having small penises. That's OK, those children were already-born, so their lives were meaningless anyway.

And let us not confuse the conversation here. This isn't merely about the murder of so many young children. This is also about the NRA and the gun owners that came out immediately after the shooting cautioning Americans not to get too excited and that the rights of people to own guns should not also become a victim. The response was almost as depressing as it was immediate.

Yup, that's kind of what I was hinting at.

The gun ownership issue is just about dick-waving and compensation, so those children died just so that gun owners could feel like they had bigger dicks, which in turn allows the gun manufacturers to sell more product.

Oh, and to all the conspiracy nuts who think these springs were staged by actors: you are scum. It's one thing to be stupid and evil enough to fail for a conspiracy theory on the internet, but it's quite another to harass grieving families.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

And let us not confuse the conversation here. This isn't merely about the murder of so many young children. This is also about the NRA and the gun owners that came out immediately after the shooting cautioning Americans not to get too excited and that the rights of people to own guns should not also become a victim. The response was almost as depressing as it was immediate.

Yup, that's kind of what I was hinting at.

The gun ownership issue is just about dick-waving and compensation, so those children died just so that gun owners could feel like they had bigger dicks, which in turn allows the gun manufacturers to sell more product.

Oh, and to all the conspiracy nuts who think these springs were staged by actors: you are scum. It's one thing to be stupid and evil enough to fail for a conspiracy theory on the internet, but it's quite another to harass grieving families.

Yes. Most of the grieving families are blissfully unaware of the absurd CT's out there, including Sandy Hook, so it must be a terrible shock to have such treatment placed upon them.

 

[credoconsolans]

Oh, and to all the conspiracy nuts who think these springs were staged by actors: you are scum. It's one thing to be stupid and evil enough to fail for a conspiracy theory on the internet, but it's quite another to harass grieving families.

Yes. Most of the grieving families are blissfully unaware of the absurd CT's out there, including Sandy Hook, so it must be a terrible shock to have such treatment placed upon them.

Underseer - you are too nice. When I read a CT from some Sandy Hook denier, I use much harsher language to tell them what they are.

I hope you are right, Jimmy.

 

[Elixir]

Those children died so that conservative men could feel better about having small penises. That's OK, those children were already-born, so their lives were meaningless anyway.

And let us not confuse the conversation here. This isn't merely about the murder of so many young children. This is also about the NRA and the gun owners that came out immediately after the shooting cautioning Americans not to get too excited and that the rights of people to own guns should not also become a victim. The response was almost as depressing as it was immediate.

The NRA has a vast catalog of prepared responses to every conceivable form of gun abuse. Expertly crafted responses, perfectly loaded with the exact buzzwords that have been determined to both diminish the perception of tragedy and raise fears of reprisal against gun owners, these lie ready for the next massacre. As each event unfolds and the NRA rolls out their counter-measures against public backlash, the reception is noted and wherever possible, the response is refined even further to mitigate any damage to gun sales and if possible, leverage the event into even greater gun sales. The NRA are the ultimate Boy Scouts - they are prepared to a "T".
Compare that to the hapless media, who can only react as if shocked each time - they have no preparation at all, and merely stumble all over each other trying to compete for audience. This makes them easy fodder for the NRA - MSM will show as much blood as possible, presented by a semi-coherent field reporter choking back tears, interview some grieving parents and then give air to the NRA's well thought-out propaganda statement, whatever that crap-du-jour may be.
The reliable result? Every active shooter event that goes down sells more guns than the sum of sales resulting from a year of national paid advertising. No wonder you don't see a lot of broadcast ads for gun manufacturers - why bother, when the NRA will get you your air time for free, as soon as some idiot uses your product to shoot up a public place?

 

[Malintent]

Every time something happens that the public believes will impact individual's rights to own guns, the gun manufacturers make a TON of money on massively increased sales.
If you really want to reduce gun ownership in America, stop adding to the hype that gun ownership should be banned. That will never happen in any of our lifetimes, so a more thoughtful solution is needed.

We can save millions of lives if we ban automobiles that can drive faster than 30 miles per hour. Only people with small penises and compensation disorders NEED a car that can go faster than 30.

 

[credoconsolans]

Every time something happens that the public believes will impact individual's rights to own guns, the gun manufacturers make a TON of money on massively increased sales.
If you really want to reduce gun ownership in America, stop adding to the hype that gun ownership should be banned. That will never happen in any of our lifetimes, so a more thoughtful solution is needed.

We can save millions of lives if we ban automobiles that can drive faster than 30 miles per hour. Only people with small penises and compensation disorders NEED a car that can go faster than 30.

Are you trying to equate a gun and a car?

 

[Malintent]

Every time something happens that the public believes will impact individual's rights to own guns, the gun manufacturers make a TON of money on massively increased sales.
If you really want to reduce gun ownership in America, stop adding to the hype that gun ownership should be banned. That will never happen in any of our lifetimes, so a more thoughtful solution is needed.

We can save millions of lives if we ban automobiles that can drive faster than 30 miles per hour. Only people with small penises and compensation disorders NEED a car that can go faster than 30.

Are you trying to equate a gun and a car?

We can go there*... what I am trying to do is point out that fully one-sided propositions have the opposite of the desired effect. Those that actually wish there to be less guns in the hands of less people need to take a more balanced and reasonable approach.... because history shows the efforts of those people have directly and measurably caused MORE guns to be in MORE people's hands.

Funny that... I recently (since the Hillary Campaign) became introduced to the sport of Trap shooting... I have been a paper target shooter since I was a kid.. small caliber stuff. A friend of mine bought a bunch of 'home defense' style weapons, including a shotgun, stating that there was a chance given a Hillary Presidency that it will become illegal (or unreasonably difficult) to acquire guns, so he bought a few before it was too late. After taking that shotgun with him to the range with me to try out, I became very interested, and bought one myself for Trap shooting. Great sport... I am loving it. Now I own one more gun indirectly because of public concern of bans.

* in 2013, approximately 32,000 people died at the hands of the operator of a motor vehicle, almost all accidents.
in 2013, 11,700 people died at the hands of the operator of a gun, almost all intentional.

It takes a concerted effort to kill someone with a gun (only 505 accidental deaths)
Almost all deaths by motor vehicle are by accident (300 cases of vehicular homicide - some (even all) could have been unintentional by logged as homicide due to circumstances).

I could kill you with a pencil... what someone can theoretically kill someone with that wants to kill a person is irrelevant.
What can accidently kill you without even trying is much more of a safety concern.

So, to answer you question, no. I am not comparing motor vehicle deaths with gun deaths...
motor vehicles are EXTREEMLY dangerous and should be completely banned... and guns are not dangerous AT ALL, if we look at death rates.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Every time something happens that the public believes will impact individual's rights to own guns, the gun manufacturers make a TON of money on massively increased sales.
If you really want to reduce gun ownership in America, stop adding to the hype that gun ownership should be banned. That will never happen in any of our lifetimes, so a more thoughtful solution is needed.

We can save millions of lives if we ban automobiles that can drive faster than 30 miles per hour. Only people with small penises and compensation disorders NEED a car that can go faster than 30.

Are you trying to equate a gun and a car?

Yeah, apparently some people don't understand the difference between accidental deaths and homicides.

 

[TV and credit cards]

It always seems like fear and ignorance wins the day. The lunatics reach positions of power and it's all we can do to restrain them, as best we can.
And the fear just feeds upon itself.
I didn't think being happy was going to take so much effort.

This occurrence is my saddest memory. And afterwards, just despair.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

So, to answer you question, no. I am not comparing motor vehicle deaths with gun deaths...
motor vehicles are EXTREEMLY dangerous and should be completely banned... and guns are not dangerous AT ALL, if we look at death rates.

You are comparing apples and oranges. People drive or ride in motor vehicles hours a day. Most guns are not utilized hours a day. Also, you are not normalizing by the number of items out there or looking at the usefulness of the items. A motor vehicle is pretty much required for work but a gun isn't required.

Anyway, how would your statistics pan out if you were looking at probability of death by accident or on purpose per device man hours of use?

 

[hurtinbuckaroo]

And let us not confuse the conversation here. This isn't merely about the murder of so many young children. This is also about the NRA and the gun owners that came out immediately after the shooting cautioning Americans not to get too excited and that the rights of people to own guns should not also become a victim. The response was almost as depressing as it was immediate.

If the government ever starts breaking down doors and confiscating weapons, it won't be the libruls who are in charge. It will be someone just like Trump, with more political savvy and without a private empire to distract him. The gun-huggers will never see it coming.

 

[bilby]

Every time something happens that the public believes will impact individual's rights to own guns, the gun manufacturers make a TON of money on massively increased sales.
If you really want to reduce gun ownership in America, stop adding to the hype that gun ownership should be banned. That will never happen in any of our lifetimes, so a more thoughtful solution is needed.

We can save millions of lives if we ban automobiles that can drive faster than 30 miles per hour. Only people with small penises and compensation disorders NEED a car that can go faster than 30.

You are right.

All guns should, like cars, be registered and insured; And a license should be required in order to use one - a license that both written and practical tests of competency are needed to obtain, and that is revoked for infringements of any of a very strict set of regulations about exactly how the equipment is used.

Banning guns is stupid. They just need to be properly regulated, like cars are (and as guns are in places like the United Kingdom, where gun ownership by private citizens most certainly is not banned).

 

[Malintent]

Are you trying to equate a gun and a car?

Yeah, apparently some people don't understand the difference between accidental deaths and homicides.

yes, exactly...
what is worse, a product that kills more people accidently than on purpose.. or a product that kills more people on purpose than by accident? Since agency is at play here, let's cancel out the 'on purpose' aspect, since any person can kill any other person with any item, as long as they try hard enough. What we are left with is accidental deaths, for which there are an incredibly small number with guns and an incredibly large number with cars.

 

[Malintent]

So, to answer you question, no. I am not comparing motor vehicle deaths with gun deaths...
motor vehicles are EXTREEMLY dangerous and should be completely banned... and guns are not dangerous AT ALL, if we look at death rates.

You are comparing apples and oranges. People drive or ride in motor vehicles hours a day. Most guns are not utilized hours a day. Also, you are not normalizing by the number of items out there or looking at the usefulness of the items. A motor vehicle is pretty much required for work but a gun isn't required.

Anyway, how would your statistics pan out if you were looking at probability of death by accident or on purpose per device man hours of use?

I don't see the relevance of 'hours in use'... or as a popular article that is cited often in these debates uses, "miles driven versus bullets shot".

Most guns exist in their useful life without harming an individual
Very few cars exist in their useful life without harming an individual

.. and we are not even considering all the CO2 contribution to the mass extinction of the entire human race in this all...

How many cars saved the life of a person by stopping someone from doing harm to many others?
How many guns saved the life of a person by stopping someone from doing harm to many others?

There are lots of difficult comparisons to make.. and it appears obvious to me that cars are more dangerous / deadly than guns.

 

[Malintent]

Every time something happens that the public believes will impact individual's rights to own guns, the gun manufacturers make a TON of money on massively increased sales.
If you really want to reduce gun ownership in America, stop adding to the hype that gun ownership should be banned. That will never happen in any of our lifetimes, so a more thoughtful solution is needed.

We can save millions of lives if we ban automobiles that can drive faster than 30 miles per hour. Only people with small penises and compensation disorders NEED a car that can go faster than 30.

You are right.

All guns should, like cars, be registered and insured; And a license should be required in order to use one - a license that both written and practical tests of competency are needed to obtain, and that is revoked for infringements of any of a very strict set of regulations about exactly how the equipment is used.

Banning guns is stupid. They just need to be properly regulated, like cars are (and as guns are in places like the United Kingdom, where gun ownership by private citizens most certainly is not banned).

I'd agree with that... except maybe the insurance part.. I need to think on that longer... I would add that the licensing for BOTH drivers AND gun handlers should be MUCH more rigorous and more frequently updated with required renewals. An Annual road test / gun safety test for license holders would be great.