3 brave officers disarm 17 year old girl by shooting her to death

[arkirk]

There isn't really enough to this story to come to any good conclusion. We don't even know what sort of weapon she brandished. Was it a knife? If so, I agree this was a severe overreaction. If it was a gun, it may not have been. Since this happened in a police station there should be ample video documentation of the encounter. I'm sure there will eventually be enough information available to come to a solid informed conclusion.

We DO know the weapon was a knife...in the hands of a rather smallish young girl if the pic in Ksen's post is accurate. And three big tough, trained policemen HAD TO KILL HER. I go along with Ksen on this one. The cops have USED UP THEIR QUOTA OF BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT POINTS.

There is an ongoing civil rights campaign alive and well in our country and there are marches in the streets with signs saying BLACK LIVES MATTER. Well, actually the signs will have to be redone to simply say HUMAN LIFE MATTERS.

 

[aeebee50]

The Texas Rangers will solve the case.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I agree fully with our police overlords, but the fact of the matter is that if she didn't have a gun, their lives weren't at risk. Potential injury, yes, but not likely their lives.

You don't know that. You have next to no idea what happened. This could certainly be another case of police misuse of force, but it is irrational to assume it is on such flimsy information.

You don't got at someone with a gun.

In addition I find it crazy how people seem to think someone with a knife isn't a threat to your life.

Three plus allegedly trained officers verses a teenaged girl with a knife. Someone could get hurt, but you fucking signed up for that. You don't shoot first because you are afraid of getting hurt.

Let's say hypothetically that she did have a knife. It seems most people seem to think the safe thing to do would be for the three police officers to tackle and restrain her. This isn't the movies, where it is a simple matter of catching their wrist and applying a little pressure to make them drop the knife.

No, this is a matter of psychology (of which it seems officers don't know about) and tactics. If three plus officers can't disarm a teenage girl, do we really need them as Police?

If she really wanted to hurt them (which they have to assume), any attempt to take the knife by direct force is highly likely to result in very serious or fatal injury. Now, in this hypothetical scenario what should the police do? Well, assuming there were no third parties around that might be injured, so it is just the three cops and the girl, what I would try to do is keep my distance, and try to get some large furniture between me and her, so as to avoid the possibility of being rushed. Then I would try to talk her down as long as possible.

You don't say. Talk, instead of unholstering guns and then shooting her? Seems someone logical.

Of course all this is purely imaginary, because we know only the barest outline of what went down.

What happened can be decently assumed based on the limited data released. We don't know why the teen did what she did.

It may be as bad as you think, or it may not be. Seriously where has people's skepticism gone.

Being able to read between the lines doesn't mean not being skeptical. The Police released information that can used to be reasonably come to a accurate, though limited, picture of the events.

We know that she went at them, don't do that with a gun.
We know that she was shot by three officers. This indicates that at least three officers had their guns drawn. This implies they overstepped and helped create a situation with fewer outs.

I can get just as outraged as the next person about abuse of power by the police (overuse of SWAT and no-knock raids in particular)...

This isn't about abuse of power, it is about people who aren't trained to be officers, being officers.

Why can't people take the sensible route and just say "I don't know enough to make an informed conclusion."

I think we have enough info to be able to draw a conclusion as to the lead up to the shooting. We don't know why the teen did what she did, but we she the heck know that the officers didn't know what they were doing either.

If it was a suicide attempt, she needed help, not lead.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

One website claims she was bipolar and had tried suicide before.

Sounds like this Department has two other recent bad shootings as well. What seem odd is that this tragedy isn't getting much news coverage at all, which is odd when a white blonde is killed, maybe she has brown hair.

Brandished a "weapon". If it was a gun, they would have said it was a gun. May not have even been a knife.

And let me be straight forward. I'm not a blame the police by default guy. This case stinks. She was sick and needed help and the Officers, who apparently are only trained on how to use a gun, not when, ended her life. How many people with a bipolar or otherwise mentally unwell relative could see or have seen the same thing happening to them?

 

[ksen]

One website claims she was bipolar and had tried suicide before.

Sounds like this Department has two other recent bad shootings as well. What seem odd is that this tragedy isn't getting much news coverage at all, which is odd when a white blonde is killed, maybe she has brown hair.

Brandished a "weapon". If it was a gun, they would have said it was a gun. May not have even been a knife.

And let me be straight forward. I'm not a blame the police by default guy. This case stinks. She was sick and needed help and the Officers, who apparently are only trained on how to use a gun, not when, ended her life. How many people with a bipolar or otherwise mentally unwell relative could see or have seen the same thing happening to them?

Cops have killed quite a few mentally ill people after they've been called by the family to come and help them with their mentally ill relatives.

Basically if you have a dog or a mentally ill relative don't call the cops for help because there's a good chance your family member/pet will get shot.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Looks like "suicide by cop" to me.

Article from OP says she "came at" the officers. This implies it was not a gun (though possibly an unloaded musket with a knife at the end).

It could have been suicide, but of course, if she didn't have a gun, the officers weren't in any lethal danger for their lives, outnumbering her. What sick fuck just pulls the gun out anyway? Are these people not trained to subdue people? Especially smaller teenaged girls?

She's tried suicide before. Is it that hard to figure this might be a suicide-by-cop?

 

[ksen]

And the officers were obliged to carry out her wishes and shoot her?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

One website claims she was bipolar and had tried suicide before.

Sounds like this Department has two other recent bad shootings as well. What seem odd is that this tragedy isn't getting much news coverage at all, which is odd when a white blonde is killed, maybe she has brown hair.

Brandished a "weapon". If it was a gun, they would have said it was a gun. May not have even been a knife.

And let me be straight forward. I'm not a blame the police by default guy. This case stinks. She was sick and needed help and the Officers, who apparently are only trained on how to use a gun, not when, ended her life. How many people with a bipolar or otherwise mentally unwell relative could see or have seen the same thing happening to them?

Cops have killed quite a few mentally ill people after they've been called by the family to come and help them with their mentally ill relatives.

Basically if you have a dog or a mentally ill relative don't call the cops for help because there's a good chance your family member/pet will get shot.

The cops get called in these cases because the mentally ill relative is a danger to the family. They think the cops have some magical ability to control the situation, they don't.

- - - Updated - - -

And the officers were obliged to carry out her wishes and shoot her?

If they are in a confined space they very well might not have a choice.

 

[ksen]

They were in the police station lobby, most likely not a confined space.

But keep making excuses. It makes perfect sense that a small governmentarian continues to have no problem with the police killing at least over a thousand civilians a year.

 

[Daioh]

In addition I find it crazy how people seem to think someone with a knife isn't a threat to your life. Let's say hypothetically that she did have a knife. It seems most people seem to think the safe thing to do would be for the three police officers to tackle and restrain her. This isn't the movies, where it is a simple matter of catching their wrist and applying a little pressure to make them drop the knife. If she really wanted to hurt them (which they have to assume), any attempt to take the knife by direct force is highly likely to result in very serious or fatal injury. Now, in this hypothetical scenario what should the police do?

Wouldn't you try to use things like Police Batons to disarm her or Pepper Spray and Tazers to incapacitate/subdue her?

Isn't that why Police officers have these items that they can use instead of lethal force?

 

[ZiprHead]

There isn't really enough to this story to come to any good conclusion. We don't even know what sort of weapon she brandished. Was it a knife? If so, I agree this was a severe overreaction. If it was a gun, it may not have been. Since this happened in a police station there should be ample video documentation of the encounter. I'm sure there will eventually be enough information available to come to a solid informed conclusion.

I agree with this post.

 

[Toni]

Cops have killed quite a few mentally ill people after they've been called by the family to come and help them with their mentally ill relatives.

Basically if you have a dog or a mentally ill relative don't call the cops for help because there's a good chance your family member/pet will get shot.

The cops get called in these cases because the mentally ill relative is a danger to the family. They think the cops have some magical ability to control the situation, they don't.

- - - Updated - - -

And the officers were obliged to carry out her wishes and shoot her?

If they are in a confined space they very well might not have a choice.

Actually, a lot of times people call the cops because they are afraid their loved one is going to kill him/herself. Too often the police response is to make suicide unnecessary by killing the suicidal person themselves .

Happened in my town. The guy was armed with a knife--pointed at his own throat, many yards from any police officer or any other human being. A cop thought the knife was a gun and killed the guy. The family had called for help because they were afraid their loved one would commit suicide. Guy was never any kind of threat to anyone other than himself. Instead of help, he got a bullet.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Article from OP says she "came at" the officers. This implies it was not a gun (though possibly an unloaded musket with a knife at the end).

It could have been suicide, but of course, if she didn't have a gun, the officers weren't in any lethal danger for their lives, outnumbering her. What sick fuck just pulls the gun out anyway? Are these people not trained to subdue people? Especially smaller teenaged girls?

She's tried suicide before. Is it that hard to figure this might be a suicide-by-cop?

And maybe the cops weren't contractually obligated to light her up?

 

[Rhea]

I agree fully with our police overlords, but the fact of the matter is that if she didn't have a gun, their lives weren't at risk. Potential injury, yes, but not likely their lives.

You don't know that. You have next to no idea what happened. This could certainly be another case of police misuse of force, but it is irrational to assume it is on such flimsy information.

In addition I find it crazy how people seem to think someone with a knife isn't a threat to your life. Let's say hypothetically that she did have a knife. It seems most people seem to think the safe thing to do would be for the three police officers to tackle and restrain her. This isn't the movies, where it is a simple matter of catching their wrist and applying a little pressure to make them drop the knife. If she really wanted to hurt them (which they have to assume), any attempt to take the knife by direct force is highly likely to result in very serious or fatal injury. Now, in this hypothetical scenario what should the police do? "

What should the police in the police station surrounded by police do? Why, ASSUME THEY ARE ABOUT TO DIE IN THE WILD WEST! Because certainly there is no mace or baton or taser around. No door to be closed, no help to be called. No voices of reason to be used. SHOOT 'ER ALL UP!

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I was pondering, based on recent events, I think women have more training in self-defense than officers do (and most of that self-defense doesn't involve using a gun).

 

[Nice Squirrel]

There is a video, but mums the word.

 

[ksen]

Yep, and given past history if there was anything exculpatory for the police officers on that video it would have been leaked by now.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

Yep, and given past history if there was anything exculpatory for the police officers on that video it would have been leaked by now.

Agreed, but they might want to hold it until the family sues the department, and every lawyer in the state is running to their door.

 

[KeepTalking]

I think it's apparent at this point that she only had a knife, the Mayor let that cat out of the bag. The size of the knife might have some bearing, as well as how close she was to the officer when she attacked. There is no way to know any of that without viewing the video. There are pictures of the lobby, however, which looks pretty secure, so I don't see how the police will be able to defend their actions here.

 

[funinspace]

Looks like "suicide by cop" to me.

Errrr....so the cops were obliged to provide the suicide service?

Well, it is at least "legal" for the cops to do it, verses a doctor in most state