Atheists and Religious people. Are their views changing?

[unapologetic]

Why do you care so much about that post?

(A) It sounded like a sheeple pretending to be an atheist.
I would have ignored it, but
(B) The 'leader' comment pissed me off. Equating us to sheeple.

perceived as being a bit abrasive

Oh my, not that. Oh please don't think ill of little ol me.

I've never heard of that atheist trope

It's a THEIST trope. in an attempt to embarrass us.

Most people have become more reasonable when it comes to people identifying as atheists

We have made a little progress, but not enough. And the progress we've made is thanks to the loudmouths.

And you think we should stay quiet when the republicans and Faux are still pandering to the religious right.

I take it you don't mean lay down arms literally

Figuratively SIB and you are suggesting a surrender. I'm saying HELL NO, figuratively.

"You can catch more flies with honey than you can with vinegar". At least when it comes to having a conversation with people who might not agree with you.

And how has that worked out so far?
It hasn't.
We've been in hiding for centuries.
Now that we are making some progress You think we should slow down?
I've been seeing that a lot lately. As if we are being infiltrated by sheeple trying to throw us off our game. Or fracture us.

We haven't reached equality yet. And we won't if we don't keep pressing for it.

 

[southernhybrid]

You can kill more flies with honey than you can with vinegar

So, when do they start dropping dead?
(Asking for a friend)

I think I corrected that phrase around the same time that you posted that because about 20 minutes after I posted it, I realized I used the wrong word. Either way, I think you know what I meant. I didn't see your reply until this morning.

 

[southernhybrid]

Why do you care so much about that post?

(A) It sounded like a sheeple pretending to be an atheist.
I would have ignored it, but
(B) The 'leader' comment pissed me off. Equating us to sheeple.

perceived as being a bit abrasive

Oh my, not that. Oh please don't think ill of little ol me.

I've never heard of that atheist trope

It's a THEIST trope. in an attempt to embarrass us.

Most people have become more reasonable when it comes to people identifying as atheists

We have made a little progress, but not enough. And the progress we've made is thanks to the loudmouths.
View attachment 45297
And you think we should stay quiet when the republicans and Faux are still pandering to the religious right.

I take it you don't mean lay down arms literally

Figuratively SIB and you are suggesting a surrender. I'm saying HELL NO, figuratively.

"You can catch more flies with honey than you can with vinegar". At least when it comes to having a conversation with people who might not agree with you.

And how has that worked out so far?
It hasn't.
We've been in hiding for centuries.
Now that we are making some progress You think we should slow down?
I've been seeing that a lot lately. As if we are being infiltrated by sheeple trying to throw us off our game. Or fracture us.

We haven't reached equality yet. And we won't if we don't keep pressing for it.

Nope. I don't think we should slow down, assuming I know what you meant by that. I've mentioned a few times that I've always been very open about my atheism, regardless of what type of responses I get. I've just found that when I try to be nice, it usually makes my opponent look like an asshole, if they start off by attacking me.

But sure, there are times when it's fine to tell it like it is. I did that a few months ago when a woman who I exercise with told me she was worried about me in the afterlife after I calmly told her that I didn't believe in the concept of being "saved". I told her I didn't care what she believed as long as she was a good person who didn't use her beliefs to harm others. She was speechless. But guess what? While I have no desire to be a close friend of hers, and while she probably feels the same way about, me, we are on very friendly terms now when we see each other and she has finally met an atheist who isn't afraid to tell it like it is. So good. Hopefully, we are on the same page now, when it comes to being outspoken atheists, but I don't think either of us really know what's in SIB's mind. Only SIB knows that. But again, I'm off topic as this was never meant to be a discussion about atheists battling each other.

 

[steve_bank]

Some atheists, IMO, can be as deranged as theists can be.

Could you be more clear?

Name names? At least give a description of the atheists as deranged as Pence, Cruz, Trump, or the current ayatollah? I'll agree that P Z Meyers is annoying, but is that the kind of atheist you're talking about?

I can give you a list of deranged theists. Across the board, around the globe, and through the centuries. Have you a similar list of atheists?
Tom

In the extreme Mao, Stalin. State atheism that purged and persecuted religion. Suppress free thought and speech.

Your counter argument would be anyone with religious belief is irrational, anyone who is atheist is inherently rational?

Today the market for woo is enormous. TV shows, books, speakers.

From my experince it coes down to the person not beliefs. About 7 years ago I was having a conversion with an atheist active in the Seattle atheist community. Ass we parted ways he said 'Enjoy being a hedonist'. Apparently he links atheism with hedonism, which I am not.


To him being atheist means living for pleasure, unbounded satisfaction of desires.

As I said atheism says nothing about who someobe is.

Ateism as an ideology can be as abusive as any social human group.

 

[steve_bank]

I herd this in a comparative religion class in philosophy. The teacher, a Catholic, made a joke saying the Greeks had a temple to unkown gods, 'just in case they left one out'.

Who is the Greek god of the unknown?
Agnostos Theos also known as the unknown God was a diety who was worshipped in ancient Greece. Keeping aside the twelve main gods and several other lesser dieties, the ancient Greeks also worshipped a God who was unknown to them.Aug 17, 2016

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

has finally met an atheist who isn't afraid to tell it like it is.

The more atheists and nones there are the more these types are likely to actually meet one in person. I've always thought it's difficult to actually pass judgement on something with which you have no contact.

living for pleasure, unbounded satisfaction

Sure sounds "heavenly" to me. I've always considered the heaven idea to be one of ultimate hedonism.

 

[steve_bank]

Wat way back on the forum when it was run by a hostle abusve womn rrom New Zaland she had a runing dispute with another another atheist off the board. Don't remeber the details but to say there is no hostility and conflict among the organized atheist comminty would be unbeleivable. I don't believe
Jesus walked on water, and I doubt atheists can do it either.

 

[southernhybrid]

Wat way back on the forum when it was run by a hostle abusve womn rrom New Zaland she had a runing dispute with another another atheist off the board. Don't remeber the details but to say there is no hostility and conflict among the organized atheist comminty would be unbeleivable. I don't believe
Jesus walked on water, and I doubt atheists can do it either.

Of course, atheists sometimes disagree and get argumentative with each other, just like other humans do. I'm not sure what your point is, or why you keep derailing this thread.

Did somebody say there was no conflict among the atheist communities? I guess I must have missed that. I thought we were supposed to be discussing whether more atheists are seeing that religion sometimes has a positive purpose in someone's life, not whether or not all atheists are saint like.

 

[Elixir]

2. when atheists say "theists are atheists about all the gods they don't believe in" they're ignoring that many theists DO believe those other gods but view them as mistaken or incomplete depictions of the "real God", or they dismiss them as demons fooling the other religionists into thinking they're gods.

Huh? Do you actually know people like that? People believe in the god of the Bible, and also think Thor is real, but a bad guy?
I’m not doubting you - I know people are under no obligation to make any sense.

in any case, steve_bank's phrase "atheist simply means a rejection of gods" has an implicit "all" in front of "gods" that you're ignoring.

Yes, yes I am ignoring that implication, since it could have been stated rather than implied, with one three-letter word.

 

[Tigers!]

Some atheists, IMO, can be as deranged as theists can be.

Could you be more clear?

Name names? At least give a description of the atheists as deranged as Pence, Cruz, Trump, or the current ayatollah? I'll agree that P Z Meyers is annoying, but is that the kind of atheist you're talking about?

I can give you a list of deranged theists. Across the board, around the globe, and through the centuries. Have you a similar list of atheists?
Tom

In the extreme Mao, Stalin. State atheism that purged and persecuted religion. Suppress free thought and speech.

Yes but those were not "true" atheists.

Your counter argument would be anyone with religious belief is irrational, anyone who is atheist is inherently rational?

If you had not said it I would have.

 

[Tigers!]

I herd this in a comparative religion class in philosophy. The teacher, a Catholic, made a joke saying the Greeks had a temple to unkown gods, 'just in case they left one out'.

Who is the Greek god of the unknown?
Agnostos Theos also known as the unknown God was a diety who was worshipped in ancient Greece. Keeping aside the twelve main gods and several other lesser dieties, the ancient Greeks also worshipped a God who was unknown to them.Aug 17, 2016

Sounds like Paul when he spoke on Mars Hill in Athens. Acts 17:22-31

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

2. when atheists say "theists are atheists about all the gods they don't believe in" they're ignoring that many theists DO believe those other gods but view them as mistaken or incomplete depictions of the "real God", or they dismiss them as demons fooling the other religionists into thinking they're gods.

Huh? Do you actually know people like that? People believe in the god of the Bible, and also think Thor is real, but a bad guy?

Naw. I think the "Christians are atheists in all but one god" was a bit of a problem to reconcile, so Christians came up with a BS line of, 'god is represented by other gods' schtick. It isn't very rational. But Christianity has a lot of that going on.

 

[Coleman Smith]

I see religion as a power trip (and a scam), and no 'truce' is posable.

I knew I married the right woman when my wife said she thinks that religion is the greatest fraud ever committed on humanity.

 

[southernhybrid]

I see religion as a power trip (and a scam), and no 'truce' is posable.

I knew I married the right woman when my wife said she thinks that religion is the greatest fraud ever committed on humanity.

And, I was pretty sure I had found Mr. Right, when after dating for about 2 months I asked him if he believed in god and he said, "No". We've been together since 1979, married in 82, so I think it will last.

But, we do have some good Christian friends who aren't very religious at all and don't care that we are atheists. And, I don't care that they are Christians, as a lot of it has to do with culture.

 

[Worldtraveller]

Julie was also an atheist (and a pretty strong atheist to boot). It was always fun watching her run logical circles around the door knockers, campus preachers, and other god botherers. She was generally very non-confrontational, unlike me, but if they came into her circle, they got what was coming.

When I serving on the board of directors of Kansas Citizens for Science, she would often come with me to events I attended (and there were, and probably still are, a LOT of them in Kansas) where some YEC was trying to convince the state that they needed more bibble in their curriculum.

However, she also taught me a lot about when NOT to argue, and to recognize an ally when I otherwise might want to pick a proverbial fight with them. Now? I'd rather befriend and hang out with a liberal, tolerant, theist, than a right wing atheist. These days, politics/social issues are much more important to me than whether said person is actually a good person or not.