Elixir
Made in America
The same way you know Trump isn't in Russia's pocket, Russia didn't interfere with the US election, and Russia isn't funding wikileaks.
-
Features
CIA says "High Confidence" that Putin involved with Hacking
- Thread starter Jimmy Higgins
- Start date
The same way you know Trump isn't in Russia's pocket, Russia didn't interfere with the US election, and Russia isn't funding wikileaks.
skepticalbip
Contributor
- Joined
- Apr 21, 2004
- Messages
- 7,304
- Basic Beliefs
- Everything we know is wrong (to some degree)
Baseless assertions are silly. We don't know Trump isn't in Russia's pocket the same as we don't know he isn't in Spain's pocket. Russia "interfered" in the US elections with their RT news outlet and other propaganda the same as Mexico "interfered" with their news outlets like La Opinión. There is absolutely no reason to believe that Russia is funding Wikileaks any more than that Israel is.
Yes, Russia hacks and tries to hack information from all countries the same as all countries including the US. Yes, Russia tries to influence elections in all countries the same as all countries try to influence elections in other countries of interest including the US.
Claiming that Russia is the buggerman responsible for anything someone doesn't like is cold war mentality still being clung to by the neo-cons because it served them well throughout the cold war and still works on their followers.
Jimmy Higgins
Contributor
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2001
- Messages
- 45,986
- Basic Beliefs
- Calvinistic Atheist
In general, Wikileaks has released a lot of stuff about the US.
skepticalbip
Contributor
- Joined
- Apr 21, 2004
- Messages
- 7,304
- Basic Beliefs
- Everything we know is wrong (to some degree)
Indeed they have. Do you have a point? What do they have that Israel doesn't want released or that Mexico doesn't want released or that Venezuela doesn't want released, etc.?
The fact that Assange has a problem with the US and Clinton doesn't mean he is a Russian puppet any more than it means that he is a puppet of any other country that has concerns with the US policy.
Elixir
Made in America
Nah - it just means he'd like to harm the US. Doesn't care if Russia helps with that or if Iran helps - as long as it damages the US and its electoral process. The CIA hasn't implicated Iran as of yet...
You are already convinced that the CIA is making stuff up and Trump isn't making stuff up, so "debating" with you about it would be a waste of time.
skepticalbip
Contributor
- Joined
- Apr 21, 2004
- Messages
- 7,304
- Basic Beliefs
- Everything we know is wrong (to some degree)
Where the hell did you see me say that the CIA is making shit up?
The CIA said that Russia hacked the DNC computer and Clinton's unsecured server. No argument. If they were asked if China, Israel, Iran, etc. also hacked them, they would likely say yes they did. The CIA did say that those computers were hacked by five different countries. That isn't them saying that Russia provided Wikileaks with the emails as the spin doctors are trying to claim.
The CIA said that Russia tried to influence the election. No argument. Their RT news and other propaganda is obviously an attempt at influence. All countries, including the US, tries to influence the politics of countries of interest. The CIA didn't claim that the Russians "hacked the election" (whatever the hell that is supposed to mean) as the spin doctors are claiming.
Last edited:
Jimmy Higgins
Contributor
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2001
- Messages
- 45,986
- Basic Beliefs
- Calvinistic Atheist
*head into desk*
Jason Harvestdancer
Contributor
Obviously, since they are leaking details about the Democratic Party (I almost wrote "US government" but realized that in spite of popular opinion the two are not the same) they must be deliberately working for the Russians. We now know that they are withholding things that Russia doesn't want released because we've been told in this thread that it is so.
Jason Harvestdancer
Contributor
I like how nobody official has said the contents of the leaked emails are false.
They had some Republican leaks--not published.
skepticalbip
Contributor
- Joined
- Apr 21, 2004
- Messages
- 7,304
- Basic Beliefs
- Everything we know is wrong (to some degree)
Assange was asked about those leaks and he said that he didn't publish them because they were already public when he got them. It is rather redundant to make something public that has already been made public. And how do you "know" that Moscow didn't want them released?
Will Wiley
Veteran Member
it's how people here get so upset about rtnews.com, but it's real value is in showing us stuff that CNN is not reporting on
barbos
Contributor
There was nothing to leak from Trump, he was leaking it himself in twitter. Same with RNC, they made no secret from their plans to stop Trump.
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2002
- Messages
- 41,246
- Location
- Frozen in Michigan
- Gender
- Old Fart
- Basic Beliefs
- Don't be a dick.
Can you provide a link to those "public" documents?
Jimmy Higgins
Contributor
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2001
- Messages
- 45,986
- Basic Beliefs
- Calvinistic Atheist
The truth about the American Government? You mean the dirty laundry of a single party, right?
Elixir
Made in America
To date that's been the pattern. But it will be interesting to see how things develop going forward. Will Trump's indebtedness to Putin mean that he has to put up with whatever Uncle Vlad wants to do, or does the fact that Don the Con owes Putin's buddies so much money mean that Russia better do what Trump wants, or they'll all get stiffed like a drywall contractor? If Trump looks like he gong to default, will Putin start getting his pal Julian to put pressure on Trump? If Putin does that... then what? An epic twitter attack?
Putin's interest is probably in maintaining the perception that currently prevails in Russia, which is that their Leader has ingeniously tricked the US into hiring his hand-picked puppet as their president.
Russia probably won't hesitate to force their trick pony to jump through some flaming hoops, if for no other reason than to keep the Russian populace elated about their world dominance. The big question is how much leverage Trump has, due to owing them so much money. That has always been the source of his 'power' over monied interests - "Be nice to me or I won't pay you back".
But Russia isn't a garden-variety venture capital group. Trump's billions owed might pale in value compared to maintaining the perception that the US president is the Russian Leader's Butt-Boy.
barbos
Contributor
But there is no such perception in Russia.
Also the RNC actually took security seriously. The FBI warned both the DNC and the RNC that they may be targets of attacks. Only the RNC paid attention, apparently. The attack on the RNC was foiled early; but the DNC showed itself to be a soft and easy target. Path of least resistance and all that. Given how lax and incompetent the DNC (and Podesta) was about security, it's a good thing Clinton lost. Having these clowns in charge of national security for four years would have been a disaster.
Leave Elixir with his/her/ze's conspiracy theories. Helps get they through the night.