Columbia University is colluding with the far-right in its attack on students

[Derec]

Group claims responsibility for arson at Portland police training center

After a group claimed responsibility on Monday for setting fire to at least 15 police cars at the PPB’s training facility, Portland officials along with the FBI and U.S. Attorney’s Office spoke Wednesday about last week’s protest-related vandalism in the city.
The group is called “Rachel Corrie’s Ghost Brigade” and they claim that they set fire to the police cars because they knew officers were going to sweep the Portland State University library to clear out protesters who were occupying the building.

Rachel "Pancake" Corrie was a far-left activist who was accidentally killed by an Israeli bulldozer which was creating a buffer zone at the Gaza-Egypt border in 2003, before Israel disengaged from the Strip.

“Rachel Corrie’s Ghost Brigade” says they are now calling for violent resistance against police and others.
The Portland Police Bureau told FOX 12 they are aware of the social media post and are investigating.
Also on Wednesday, officials spoke about the police vehicle arson.
“Somebody knows something about those fires and they need to come forward,” Mike Benner said.

I hope they catch the bastards. But will Mike Schmidt, the fauxgressive Multnomah County DA prosecute?

 

[Derec]

I think that the contrast between Columbia University's handling of their protest and Brown's is very revealing. IMO, every university facing these protests should use Brown as a model for deconflicting the breakdown in civil discourse among students on campus.

Brown(shirt) University has caved to a small, but loud and obnoxious, number of students and outside agitators, many of them paid by left-wing groups.
It is not a model that should be emulated. It should be viewed as a shameful example of a lack of moral courage in the administration.

 

[Derec]

12,300 dead children, Tom. They were innocent. They were all innocent. That's what it means to be a kid.

"Children" in this context means anybody under 18. So, even if we take Hamas-provided numbers for a fact, many of these minors (a better word than "children") would be 15-17 year old teenagers who are frequently recruited by Hamas and other terrorist groups.

These three are from Jenin in Samaria, but it's not like terror groups in Gaza eschew recruiting minors.
So it is definitely not the case that "they were all innocent".
I would very much like to see an age breakdown for the dead minors. I suspect that those between 15 and 17 are strongly overrepresented among the dead, because many of them are combatants.

 

[Derec]

I don't know either.
But if some rando sprayed me like that I would not care what it was, I'd consider it assault.
Tom

I would think a direct, deliberate spraying would qualify.
It was claimed by Arctish (post #484) that it would be assault even if the spraying with a gag spray was deployed in "close vicinity" or just "upwind" of protestors. I think that goes way too far.

 

[Derec]

Here's the deal. It wasn't unprovoked. There were 3 reasons for it: 1. A dumb religious reason, 2. Because of the occupation and killings, and 3. Because of imprisonments of Palestinians with no due process which itself amounts to kidnapping.

None of these are valid reasons to massacre and kidnap innocent people.
There is also no occupation of Gaza. There hasn't been since 2005. And you could view the Gaza disengagement as a sort of dress rehearsal for a Palestinian state. Had Gazans responded with peace, I am 100% certain that a Palestinian State would have been established.
Instead, Gazans responded with shooting hundreds of Rockets at Israel.

It takes all sides to come to an agreement for Palestinian statehood. And Palestinians have the obligation to act responsibly, and not like bloodthirsty savages who attack their neighbors at the first opportunity.

As to your point 3, most Palestinian security prisoners before 10/7 have been convicted. There have been some 1000 odd in "administrative detention" but even that is following "due process of law" (under Israeli, not US, law of course) since the detention has to be signed off by a judge and any renewals too. That's more due process than Gitmo, and mind you, administrative detainees are generally known terrorists who have served prison sentences before.

They both practice tyranny.

That's a false equivalence. Israel is not perfect, no country is, but comparing Israel and Hamas is like comparing a meal that is slightly underseasoned and a bit high in saturated fats with a plate of toxic sludge.

In the mean time, I don't care if a bunch of radical college kids draw attention to the reality of de facto, if not deliberate, ethnic cleansing and its need to end. Doing so CAN lead to a better world.

Very unlikely. If it leads to Biden pressuring Israel into ending the war before Hamas is destroyed, then it will lead to a much worse world. To paraphrase Michael Jordan, "fuck them radical college kids".

 

[Derec]

Jewish Democrat on voting against bill: Anti-Zionism not ‘inherently’ antisemitism

Jewish Rep. Sara Jacobs (D-Calif.) said she voted against the bill that would crack down on antisemitism on college campuses because, in her view, anti-Zionism is not “inherently” antisemitism, and…

thehill.com

Rhetorical and physical manifestations of antisemitism are directed toward Jewish or non-Jewish individuals and/or their property, toward Jewish community institutions and religious facilities

So criticism of the Israeli govt?

Criticism of any government is ok. Saying that Israel should not exist (which is the essence of anti-Zionism) is very different and is antisemitic in my view.

I would also say that for example saying that Iran should not exist would be an example of antipersianism.

 

[Derec]

Well, Biden said that a red line should be drawn at Rafah.

A foolish red line. Going into Rafah is necessary to defeating Hamas. And Kerem Shalom crossing was attacked from Rafah. This crossing processes trucks carrying humanitarian aid.

So that makes him anti-semitic because he is criticizing the Israeli govt policy.

That's a strawman. Nobody is claiming that.

only one side is allow to Godwin.

Only one side is truly like the Nazis, so that fits.

 

[Derec]

I've been following the news on campus protests and I don't recall what I'd describe as riots. Would you post some links to what you consider riots?

If breaking into Congress and causing property damage qualifies as a riot on 1/6, then it surely also qualifies when the Dollar Store Abu Obaida and his buddies did it at Hamilton Hall.

 

[Derec]

Samidoun is an organ of the Marxist-Leninist Palestinian terrorist organization PFLP (splitters!)

So?

You do not see a problem that extremist groups linked with terrorism are astroturfing these campus takeovers?

 

[Derec]

So some of the organizers at the various months, no years that divestment groups have been around consulted with some other groups some of whom did other protests, especially some that are pro-Palestine.

In other words, these campus takeovers are astroturfed.

They are also getting paid.
Some Anti-Israel Protesters Are Paid

Since at least the Vietnam War, exasperated observers of student protests have rolled their eyes and thought: Get a job. In some cases today, activism is a job. Two of America’s largest philanthropic foundations are behind a group that has paid some of the anti-Israel activists for the kind of antics disrupting campuses across the country.
[...]
Ms. Afaneh and Mr. Birckhead-Morton have both been “youth fellows” of the U.S. Campaign for Palestinian Rights, whose website identifies them by their first names. As of April 4, the campaign was soliciting applications for a new cohort, whose “campus-based fellows” would receive stipends of $2,880 to $3,360 for three-month terms of roughly eight hours of work a week. That “work” could include aiding campaigns that “demand federal or state politicians cut US military, financial, or diplomatic ties with Israel.”
The corporate entity behind these fellowships is Education for Just Peace in the Middle East. Where does it get its funding?
George and Alexander Soros’s Open Society Foundation has put $700,000 into Education for Just Peace in the Middle East since 2018, most recently with a two-year grant in 2022, according to the Open Society Foundation’s website. The Rockefeller Brothers Fund has given Education for Just Peace in the Middle East $515,000 since 2019, most recently with a three-year grant for $225,000 awarded in August 2023.

...the group shared cartoons giving protesters ideas for “non-violent” resistance, including throwing what appears to be a smoke bomb, jumping over barriers and lifting a garbage can...

Also mooning people (which a few of the posters on here did during their misspent youth - I remember reading about it, I just don't remember who it was) and, for some reason, being Drake. Weird.

"...we take care not to endanger others with our actions."

And yet the tactics displayed on that image include things that can endanger others such as deploying lasers or throwing projectiles. They also do not want to "police" protestors even when they endanger others.

 

[Derec]

If they had just ignored all these protests this would all have been water under the bridge.

Streisand effect?

I don't think so. These people want a spectacle. They want to disrupt. If they were ignored, they'd feel it necessary to up the ante. Burn down cars, perhaps even buildings, like their Ilk did in 2020.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

GOP Rep. Proposes Bill to Send Protesting Students to Gaza

Rep. Andy Ogles desperately wants to punish protesting students.

www.thedailybeast.com

Obviously not realistic as a law, but I must admit that these creeps would benefit from having to live under Hamas rule. Especially the Queers for Palestine idiots, who have the situational awareness of a moth drawn to a flame.

Hamas are evil and this has been told to you over and over in multiple threads. Students at the schools are not a monolithic bunch, regardless of whether you'd like to poke fun at Queers for Palestine or not, and certainly sending some of them off would not be a benefit to them, but a detriment. Any extremist students of which there are some would not be a benefit to the world either, especially if they joined Hamas. Any students who are just trying to make peace and stop slaughter at the hands of the most extreme right-wing govt Israel has had over the years if they face violence at either the hands of Hamas or the IDF bombs or starvation, that also is not a benefit to them or in anyone's interests. Advocacy of this legislation is an extreme form of cancellation of a message that proponents of the legislation simply do not like. We do not have to agree with the message in its entirety to allow students to have their free speech and assembly, but trying to get them killed is an inappropriate response to political disagreement.

 

[laughing dog]

I think that the contrast between Columbia University's handling of their protest and Brown's is very revealing. IMO, every university facing these protests should use Brown as a model for deconflicting the breakdown in civil discourse among students on campus.

Brown(shirt) University has caved to a small, but loud and obnoxious, number of students and outside agitators, many of them paid by left-wing groups.
It is not a model that should be emulated. It should be viewed as a shameful example of a lack of moral courage in the administration.

How is agreeing to talk by an administration of a university in the future “caving in”?

In the real world that is how reasonable academics and educators behave.

 

[laughing dog]

Samidoun is an organ of the Marxist-Leninist Palestinian terrorist organization PFLP (splitters!)

So?

You do not see a problem that extremist groups linked with terrorism are astroturfing these campus takeovers?

No. These a campus protests, not an attempt to overthrow an election.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I've been following the news on campus protests and I don't recall what I'd describe as riots. Would you post some links to what you consider riots?

If breaking into Congress and causing property damage qualifies as a riot on 1/6, then it surely also qualifies when the Dollar Store Abu Obaida and his buddies did it at Hamilton Hall.

The national guard was called in on January 6th. Why is there this absurd need to minimize the actions of those people on January 6th.

And a person committing acts of property destruction and vandalism doesn't mean the act then becomes a "riot". Why do you always have to skull fuck hyperbole?

 

[Toni]

Samidoun is an organ of the Marxist-Leninist Palestinian terrorist organization PFLP (splitters!)

So?

You do not see a problem that extremist groups linked with terrorism are astroturfing these campus takeovers?

No. These a campus protests, not an attempt to overthrow an election.

Yes, they are campus protests, but I think Derec has a point. Outside agitators have long been a problem at protests, since long before the '60's. And more recently, someone I trust very much told me about what he knew to be out of state people ginning up the rhetoric at protests after the shooting of George Floyd. And he had photo evidence.

Disinformation and propaganda are serious issues in many places and perhaps on college campuses today. This would not be a new phenomenon.

Protesters have a right to protest and to hope to affect change. They have a right to be heard, whether they are right or wrong. What is needed is cool heads, sound judgment and a lot of effort at teaching people, from early childhood on, to detect manipulation and disinformation.

 

[laughing dog]

I've been following the news on campus protests and I don't recall what I'd describe as riots. Would you post some links to what you consider riots?

If breaking into Congress and causing property damage qualifies as a riot on 1/6, then it surely also qualifies when the Dollar Store Abu Obaida and his buddies did it at Hamilton Hall.

The national guard was called in on January 6th. Why is there this absurd need to minimize the actions of those people on January 6th.

And a person committing acts of property destruction and vandalism doesn't mean the act then becomes a "riot". Why do you always have to skull fuck hyperbole?

Jimmy, when will you ever learn that
When armed white people gather together and storm the seat of the federal gov’t in order to get their porn-star fucking capitalust authoritarian idol installed as their fuhrer, it is just patriots defending their rights. But when othets protest on behalf of brown people, it is always a riot.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Pennsylvania

Police arrest 33 pro-Palestinian protesters, disband encampment at Penn

Philadelphia Police arrested and removed more than 30 pro-Palestinian protesters as they disbanded their encampment that was on the University of Pennsylvania's campus for more than two weeks.

www.nbcphiladelphia.com

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

UMass graduation speaker Colson Whitehead pulls out over quashed campus protest

AMHERST — Disturbed by the arrests of 132 protesters on the University of Massachusetts campus this week during a pro-Palestinian encampment, Colson Whitehead, the two-time Pulitzer Prize winning author scheduled to deliver the keynote address at the...

www.gazettenet.com

From the article:

“I have to withdraw as your commencement speaker. I give all my best wishes and congratulations to the class of ’24 and pray for the safety of the Palestinian people, the return of the hostages and an end to this terrible war.”

That's the kind of message that resonates with me: "safety of the Palestinian people" which is very pressing right now, "return of the hostages" also very high priority. Promote peace and coexistence. Return the hostages. No slaughters of civilians.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Nearly all Gaza campus protests in the US have been peaceful, study finds

Analysis of 553 protests in solidarity with Palestinians between 18 April and 3 May found 97% of them did not cause serious damage

www.theguardian.com